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holy f’n Christ. John’s NOT replacing his crank, he’s sticking with the same bottom end. Understand?
that means NO aftermarket crank…get it?
like I said ten times already, nobody in their right mind is going to choose between an aftermarket crank or a halo. That’s two different worlds ..being the engine guru you say you are, why is that so hard to understand?
this stock parts and helping them survive.
You opened your big yap before you understood what was being talked about… maybe think before you talk.
your reading comprehension level is atrocious. No wonder you struggle so much. Glad I could get under your skin.
The rear cap should be spot faced at the stud nut area, then the front four caps cut the same height as the rear cap , that way you’ll have a squared true surface where the halo contacts the top of the caps .
The rear cap should be spot faced at the stud nut area, then the front four caps cut the same height as the rear cap , that way you’ll have a squared true surface where the halo contacts the top of the caps .
Everything is dead on square and leveled.
Why won't it work ! ?
Everything is dead on square and leveled.
Why won't it work ! ?
It will, but should be installed like I said. The factory cap machining leaves a lot to be desired. Measuring stock caps , they are not identical in height, or side to side.
The correct way to get the most out of the halo is to spot face the rear cap stud area. Then cut all the other four caps, clamped together, to the height of the rear cap spot faced height measurement.
the way you have the rear mounted, the halo sitting on top of the TQ’d nut, will not be the same TQ when you install another piece on top and TQ it… that will compress the nut under it and nullify it’s initial TQ. Kinda splitting hairs here but that rear mounting isn’t ideal. You are also using reduced diameter nuts under it..not ideal
this also lowers the halo to fit under a stock pan.
Last edited by CANADIANOLDS; Sep 7, 2022 at 03:18 PM.
It will, but should be installed like I said. The factory cap machining leaves a lot to be desired. Measuring stock caps , they are not identical in height, or side to side.
The correct way to get the most out of the halo is to spot face the rear cap stud area. Then cut all the other four caps, clamped together, to the height of the rear cap spot faced height measurement.
this also lowers the halo to fit under a stock pan.
I still don't understand why I have to machine caps 1-4 to the same height of 5. My 1-4 have been slightly machined to the same height and I used an ARP windage tray bolt to even out #5 and clear oil pump. Halo is dead on.
It was then align honed and everything is measuring perfect to centerline.
And my oil pan fits perfectly!
Looks like y'all had a party!
I'll just leave this here https://arp-bolts.com/p/technical.php I'm not real smart, but if that 55kn measurement actually does transfer to 12,xxxpsi, something ain't right. LMFAO
Hey, does anyone want to discuss the Mondello valley brace where you drill the China walls and put some bar stock in?
I still don't understand why I have to machine caps 1-4 to the same height of 5. My 1-4 have been slightly machined to the same height and I used an ARP windage tray bolt to even out #5 and clear oil pump. Halo is dead on.
It was then align honed and everything is measuring perfect to centerline.
And my oil pan fits perfectly!
Looks like y'all had a party!
I'll just leave this here https://arp-bolts.com/p/technical.php I'm not real smart, but if that 55kn measurement actually does transfer to 12,xxxpsi, something ain't right. LMFAO
Hey, does anyone want to discuss the Mondello valley brace where you drill the China walls and put some bar stock in?
thats why i let him tell us what 55kn converts to,,,thinking he would say, oh, i made a mistake. but according to him they have a tensile strength of just over 12k
On your rear cap, what do you have between the bottom nut and the halo,, is the halo sitting on top of the nut?
Yes, halo sits on custom flat head ARP nut.
I used a 1/2" to 3/8 stepped main stud from ARP. 1/2" comes up into halo and taper's to 3/8
This was sent to ARP engineering and they worked with me to find this bolt. They said it has been used in the past for similar setups. I also questioned the torque and was told that the value of the lower 1/2" would not change when torquing upper 3/8" nut as long as I did not exceed the recommended 110 ft lbs. of lower nut.
Another misconception clarified by ARP engineering is there is no minimum stud thread protrusion above the nut.
They said as long as the nut fully catches all threads it does not matter how many threads are showing above nut.
Yes, halo sits on custom flat head ARP nut.
I used a 1/2" to 3/8 stepped main stud from ARP. 1/2" comes up into halo and taper's to 3/8
This was sent to ARP engineering and they worked with me to find this bolt. They said it has been used in the past for similar setups. I also questioned the torque and was told that the value of the lower 1/2" would not change when torquing upper 3/8" nut as long as I did not exceed the recommended 110 ft lbs. of lower nut.
How did you ensure the rear main nut would be torqued to the identical height of the other main caps so that the halo would be level?
Another misconception clarified by ARP engineering is there is no minimum stud thread protrusion above the nut.
They said as long as the nut fully catches all threads it does not matter how many threads are showing above nut.
A few were made for the motor sports world. Oldsmobile redesign around a DX block. Beefing up the bottom end. Added oil passage in rear of block. Some for HP block for NASCAR and others for drag racing. This one is getting a SBO Bryant crank. And lightweight rods and pistons. Large diameter roller lifters.
One would think Oldsmobile did some engineering into this block.
Head flow is more of a limiting factor as far as power goes.
Bernhard wrote:
How could I forget the unobtainable NASCAR blocks.
Yes, halo sits on custom flat head ARP nut.
I used a 1/2" to 3/8 stepped main stud from ARP. 1/2" comes up into halo and taper's to 3/8
This was sent to ARP engineering and they worked with me to find this bolt. They said it has been used in the past for similar setups. I also questioned the torque and was told that the value of the lower 1/2" would not change when torquing upper 3/8" nut as long as I did not exceed the recommended 110 ft lbs. of lower nut.
what was your reasoning to install it that way in the first place?
I just didn't see any reason to take any extra material off the main caps other than leveling them.
ok. My reason for cutting the front four is to get cap height and stud height down which is more rigid. The caps are tapered going up, cutting them actually makes the top area bigger…=more contact area
The rear cap should be spot faced at the stud nut area, then the front four caps cut the same height as the rear cap , that way you’ll have a squared true surface where the halo contacts the top of the caps .
DAMN, bolting/clamp onto a nut???? Umm not my cup of tea there. So now that I can physically see this, I see what Dale is talking about. (Been on the road last couple of days, so look thing thru phone..)
I see why Dale says to cut the caps. This looks like a 3 fold result:
1. Like dale said, you get the same heights for being sq on all main caps.
2. Gets the added benefit of "straps" on caps.
3. THEN the added benefit of the halo tying the studs together.
As stated, I see no down-side other then a bit more work and therefore more $$$ for a 600Hp engine that doesn't go past 6200RPM street strip deal.
Dale, also from our talks, thank you for the nice comments. NOW maybe this crazy-train get back on track!!!!!!!!!
Good job rick for thinking outside the box. If that halo is level, you should be fine. If you don't need to cut the caps
its all the better. Its stronger with a thicker main cap. This has all been done before with excellent results.
Too many know it alls on this website, and too much bashing fellow oldsmobile enthusiasts.
Most of us just find it easier to machine the caps the same height as the rear cap and not modify the oil pan.
That doesn't mean thats the only way to do it.
ok. My reason for cutting the front four is to get cap height and stud height down which is more rigid. The caps are tapered going up, cutting them actually makes the top area bigger…=more contact area
You say that the larger contact area when cutting caps 1-4 even with 5 is more beneficial because of larger contact area. 🤔
Mocked up another 455 today.
Let's do the math !
Measurements of factory caps on this block.
Height of Caps 1-4 over stud = 2.8715.
Height of Caps 1-4 at center = 1.2740.
(Measurement from center of arch to top of cap).
Height of #5 over stud = 2.3780.
Height of #5 at center = .7810.
(Measurement from center of arch to top of cap).
Width of Caps 1-4 at stud end = .8305.
Width of Caps 1-4 at center = .5050.
Measurements over stud:
1-4 cap height = 2.8715.
5 cap height = 2.3780. Difference in height = .4935 (just shy of 1/2")
Measurements at center over arch:
1-4 cap height = 1.2740.
5 cap height = .7810. Difference in height = .493 (just shy of 1/2").
Let's mill caps 1-4 .50... (Just a round number close enough)
What are our measurements !
Height of Caps 1-4 over stud = 2.3715.
Height of Caps 1-4 at center = .7740.
(Measurement from center of arch to top of cap)
Width of Caps 1-4 at stud end = .8585.
Width of Caps 1-4 at center = .5415.
So lets take a look at what was lost and gained by milling caps 1-4 .50 .
Height of Caps we Lost .50 (1/2 "). Leaving us with .7740 at center as opposed to 1.2740 and at the stud 2.3715 as opposed to 2.8715.
Width of Caps 1-4 at widest point at stud we Gained .028. That less than 1/32 ".
Width of Caps 1-4 at center we Gained .0365. That's just over 1/32 ".
Good job rick for thinking outside the box. If that halo is level, you should be fine. If you don't need to cut the caps
its all the better. Its stronger with a thicker main cap. This has all been done before with excellent results.
Too many know it alls on this website, and too much bashing fellow oldsmobile enthusiasts.
Most of us just find it easier to machine the caps the same height as the rear cap and not modify the oil pan.
That doesn't mean thats the only way to do it.
Bernhard wrote:
No one is bashing Rick.
It's all about thought process, advantages and disadvantages to consider when installing a halo.
Thanks Dale and Rick for sharing.
Sure looked like rick was getting beat up for something other that the accepted method. Nice to see rick did his homework
to show he was correct.
Get better vortec pro.
