Steering sloppy
August 27th, 2012, 03:11 PM
#1
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Steering sloppy
As I fine tune the bugs out I have noticed the steering is loose as if the steering is not tight. You can turn the wheel a few inches without any wheel tracking. I've read and heard there is an adjustment for the worm gear, The car is original 99K and this is the only thing I didn't have rebuilt as I thought it wouls be fine. All suspension and such is new. Any advise guys?
This is a power steering unit-forgot to mention earlier
This is a power steering unit-forgot to mention earlier
Last edited by Al Graaf; August 27th, 2012 at 04:06 PM.
August 27th, 2012, 03:16 PM
#2
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Subscribe, I too have a loose gearbox on my convertible. I was contemplating doing the Jeep Grand Cherokee gearbox conversion but if there's a way to tighten the worm gear then I'd rather do that. Hope you get some replies, for you and me both 
August 27th, 2012, 03:27 PM
#3
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August 27th, 2012, 03:36 PM
#4
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There is nut with a slotted threaded insert in the center. Hold the threaded insert in place and break the nut loose. Screw the inset in 1/8 of a turn and snug the nut back in while holding the threaded insert in place. You can repeat until you have the play you like. When you check it make sure the engine running. DO NOT OVER TIGHTEN THE THREADED INSERT.
Before you do all that, make sure you don't have any worn components.
Also if your alignment is off it will walk all over the road - Steve. In addition tire pressure makes a big difference in the way the car steers.
Before you do all that, make sure you don't have any worn components.
Also if your alignment is off it will walk all over the road - Steve. In addition tire pressure makes a big difference in the way the car steers.
August 27th, 2012, 03:44 PM
#5
Just an Olds Guy
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Edmonton, AB. And "I am Can 'eh' jun - eh"
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Al/Steve
At 99K the steering box should still be ok. The Saginaw standard gearbox should be 3.5 turns lock to lock. If you have slop in it, you should take a look in the CSM for the steering.
Before you do anything else, I'm going to quote from my 72 CSM as causes of 'loose steering'
At 99K the steering box should still be ok. The Saginaw standard gearbox should be 3.5 turns lock to lock. If you have slop in it, you should take a look in the CSM for the steering.
Before you do anything else, I'm going to quote from my 72 CSM as causes of 'loose steering'
Air in system - Add fluid and bleed by repeatedly turning lock to lock (I lifted my car front when doing this)
Steering gear loose on frame - check bolts for torque (3 bolts torque is 70 ft/lbs)
Steering gear (ragjoint) loose or worn - tighten pinch bolts to 30 ft/lbs
Front wheel bearings incorrectly adjusted - Adjust to specs
Worn poppet valve (gear) - replace poppet valve
Loose thrust bearing preload adjustment - Adjust to spec with gear out of vehicle.
Excessive 'over-center' lash. Adjust to spec with gear out of vehicle
Steering gear loose on frame - check bolts for torque (3 bolts torque is 70 ft/lbs)
Steering gear (ragjoint) loose or worn - tighten pinch bolts to 30 ft/lbs
Front wheel bearings incorrectly adjusted - Adjust to specs
Worn poppet valve (gear) - replace poppet valve
Loose thrust bearing preload adjustment - Adjust to spec with gear out of vehicle.
Excessive 'over-center' lash. Adjust to spec with gear out of vehicle
August 27th, 2012, 03:48 PM
#6
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There is nut with a slotted threaded insert in the center. Hold the threaded insert in place and break the nut loose. Screw the inset in 1/8 of a turn and snug the nut back in while holding the threaded insert in place. You can repeat until you have the play you like. When you check it make sure the engine running. DO NOT OVER TIGHTEN THE THREADED INSERT.
Before you do all that, make sure you don't have any worn components.
Also if your alignment is off it will walk all over the road - Steve. In addition tire pressure makes a big difference in the way the car steers.
Before you do all that, make sure you don't have any worn components.
Also if your alignment is off it will walk all over the road - Steve. In addition tire pressure makes a big difference in the way the car steers.
August 27th, 2012, 03:51 PM
#7
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Al/Steve
At 99K the steering box should still be ok. The Saginaw standard gearbox should be 3.5 turns lock to lock. If you have slop in it, you should take a look in the CSM for the steering.
Before you do anything else, I'm going to quote from my 72 CSM as causes of 'loose steering'
At 99K the steering box should still be ok. The Saginaw standard gearbox should be 3.5 turns lock to lock. If you have slop in it, you should take a look in the CSM for the steering.
Before you do anything else, I'm going to quote from my 72 CSM as causes of 'loose steering'
August 27th, 2012, 04:01 PM
#8
Old(s) Fart
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Northern VA
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Turning the adjustment screw on the steering box cover will help tighten a manual box, but not a power box. Proper adjustment of bearing preload requires the box to be removed - you have to adjust the plate at the end of the box where the steering shaft attaches. This is described in your CSM.
August 27th, 2012, 04:05 PM
#9
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Turning the adjustment screw on the steering box cover will help tighten a manual box, but not a power box. Proper adjustment of bearing preload requires the box to be removed - you have to adjust the plate at the end of the box where the steering shaft attaches. This is described in your CSM.
August 27th, 2012, 04:18 PM
#10
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I've done it the same way on both, like I said a little is a lot. Make sure the wheels are straight before you start. After you adjust it start the car and check. You might have to do this a couple of times, if it starts to bind the steering back of the amount of the last adjustment. It will not solve a worn part problem inside the steering box. Sorry your right it's a hex socket on yours, the nut is really not tha tight.
August 27th, 2012, 04:21 PM
#11
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I've done it the same way on both, like I said a little is a lot. Make sure the wheels are straight before you start. After you adjust it start the car and check. You might have to do this a couple of times, if it starts to bind the steering back of the amount of the last adjustment. It will not solve a worn part problem inside the steering box. Sorry your right it's a hex socket on yours, the nut is really not tha tight.
August 27th, 2012, 04:22 PM
#12
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Mine is power steering as well.
August 27th, 2012, 04:25 PM
#13
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If you don't believe me google it, how to adjust freeplay in a gm power steering box. It is not a cure all. But it will take some of it out. The worm gear does wear and the adjustment makes it mesh tighter.
August 27th, 2012, 05:32 PM
#14
Just an Olds Guy
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Location: Edmonton, AB. And "I am Can 'eh' jun - eh"
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a simplified explanation here: http://www.privatefleet.com.au/glossary/a-poppet-valve/
I looked in the CSM for where it is and they must call it something else? Maybe the spool valve? Just guessing because I'm not a mechanic. From what I've seen and read though I'm guessing it controls the rate of flow, or fluid pressure in the gearbox.
I looked in the CSM for where it is and they must call it something else? Maybe the spool valve? Just guessing because I'm not a mechanic. From what I've seen and read though I'm guessing it controls the rate of flow, or fluid pressure in the gearbox.
August 27th, 2012, 06:12 PM
#15
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Location: New Brunswick Canada
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not sure but i beleive that the sector shaft [the shaft that the pitman arm is attached to] will have end play if an adjustment is required,turn the adjusting screw in untill no more end play then back it out about a 1/8 turn.correct me if i am wrong.
August 27th, 2012, 06:28 PM
#16
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August 27th, 2012, 07:20 PM
#17
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There's you problem - did you not put the frame back on? 
Mine was loosey goosey like yours, too. Tie rods and BJs were not excessively worn. I could move the steery wheel about 3" effortlessly before the wheels turned - bad feeling when driving.
The steering box rebuilder said it had seen its better days as it was well worn after 155k miles. It was driven hard in sandy environments and had grit all in it.
It is now virgin-tight after rebuild.
Mine was loosey goosey like yours, too. Tie rods and BJs were not excessively worn. I could move the steery wheel about 3" effortlessly before the wheels turned - bad feeling when driving.
The steering box rebuilder said it had seen its better days as it was well worn after 155k miles. It was driven hard in sandy environments and had grit all in it.
It is now virgin-tight after rebuild.
August 27th, 2012, 08:33 PM
#18
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There's you problem - did you not put the frame back on?
Mine was loosey goosey like yours, too. Tie rods and BJs were not excessively worn. I could move the steery wheel about 3" effortlessly before the wheels turned - bad feeling when driving.
The steering box rebuilder said it had seen its better days as it was well worn after 155k miles. It was driven hard in sandy environments and had grit all in it.
It is now virgin-tight after rebuild.
Mine was loosey goosey like yours, too. Tie rods and BJs were not excessively worn. I could move the steery wheel about 3" effortlessly before the wheels turned - bad feeling when driving.
The steering box rebuilder said it had seen its better days as it was well worn after 155k miles. It was driven hard in sandy environments and had grit all in it.
It is now virgin-tight after rebuild.
lol!
August 28th, 2012, 06:18 PM
#20
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Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Lexington, KY
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there's you problem - did you not put the frame back on?
Mine was loosey goosey like yours, too. Tie rods and bjs were not excessively worn. I could move the steery wheel about 3" effortlessly before the wheels turned - bad feeling when driving.
The steering box rebuilder said it had seen its better days as it was well worn after 155k miles. It was driven hard in sandy environments and had grit all in it.
It is now virgin-tight after rebuild.
Mine was loosey goosey like yours, too. Tie rods and bjs were not excessively worn. I could move the steery wheel about 3" effortlessly before the wheels turned - bad feeling when driving.
The steering box rebuilder said it had seen its better days as it was well worn after 155k miles. It was driven hard in sandy environments and had grit all in it.
It is now virgin-tight after rebuild.
August 28th, 2012, 06:22 PM
#21
Formerly "Shimmer"
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Lexington, KY
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There's you problem - did you not put the frame back on?
Mine was loosey goosey like yours, too. Tie rods and BJs were not excessively worn. I could move the steery wheel about 3" effortlessly before the wheels turned - bad feeling when driving.
The steering box rebuilder said it had seen its better days as it was well worn after 155k miles. It was driven hard in sandy environments and had grit all in it.
It is now virgin-tight after rebuild.
Mine was loosey goosey like yours, too. Tie rods and BJs were not excessively worn. I could move the steery wheel about 3" effortlessly before the wheels turned - bad feeling when driving.
The steering box rebuilder said it had seen its better days as it was well worn after 155k miles. It was driven hard in sandy environments and had grit all in it.
It is now virgin-tight after rebuild.
August 28th, 2012, 06:44 PM
#22
Formerly "Shimmer"
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Lexington, KY
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There's you problem - did you not put the frame back on?
Mine was loosey goosey like yours, too. Tie rods and BJs were not excessively worn. I could move the steery wheel about 3" effortlessly before the wheels turned - bad feeling when driving.
The steering box rebuilder said it had seen its better days as it was well worn after 155k miles. It was driven hard in sandy environments and had grit all in it.
It is now virgin-tight after rebuild.
Mine was loosey goosey like yours, too. Tie rods and BJs were not excessively worn. I could move the steery wheel about 3" effortlessly before the wheels turned - bad feeling when driving.
The steering box rebuilder said it had seen its better days as it was well worn after 155k miles. It was driven hard in sandy environments and had grit all in it.
It is now virgin-tight after rebuild.
August 28th, 2012, 07:59 PM
#24
Just an Olds Guy
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Edmonton, AB. And "I am Can 'eh' jun - eh"
Posts: 24,525
Me - always with another question, right?
Al, just a question about the steering and I know this isn't all that fair. By any chance did it behave like this before you did the resto? I realize you've had to be involved with so much of the work at the shop that it can be mind boggling and you may not remember back to then? Just curious to know if the feel of the steering might not be related to the resto at all. When you had the pump and gearbox off, did you do anything to them aside from changing the hoses and cleaning them up?
BTW I just ordered all new proper 'concourse' hoses from ILT so I'll be taking my steering box and pump off again so I don't spill fluid all over the place. I found that when I was 'bleeding the air' from the power steering it felt really loosey goosey. I posted that in my thread and the answer I got from a lot of guys was this is 'normal'. Even the CSM says that it may be necessary to bleed the air by turning lock to lock for quite some time. The others also said that after about a week of driving it would be back to normal. Is this any help to you at all?
BTW I just ordered all new proper 'concourse' hoses from ILT so I'll be taking my steering box and pump off again so I don't spill fluid all over the place. I found that when I was 'bleeding the air' from the power steering it felt really loosey goosey. I posted that in my thread and the answer I got from a lot of guys was this is 'normal'. Even the CSM says that it may be necessary to bleed the air by turning lock to lock for quite some time. The others also said that after about a week of driving it would be back to normal. Is this any help to you at all?
August 29th, 2012, 04:40 AM
#25
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Join Date: May 2009
Location: USA
Posts: 2,200
Do the 93 - 98 Jeep Grand Cherokee steering box upgrade.
Factory was 16:1 (3.5-4 turns) and the Jeep is 12.7:1 (2.5-3 turns)
They're all over junkyards for $50 plus the rag joint for.....I think ~$50 IIRC
There's also 2 little adaptor fittings for it for $10 but I cant remember where I got them.
There's info all over LS1tech for this stuff with part #'s and Chevelles.com
http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/9343854-post93.html
Factory was 16:1 (3.5-4 turns) and the Jeep is 12.7:1 (2.5-3 turns)
They're all over junkyards for $50 plus the rag joint for.....I think ~$50 IIRC
There's also 2 little adaptor fittings for it for $10 but I cant remember where I got them.
There's info all over LS1tech for this stuff with part #'s and Chevelles.com
http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/9343854-post93.html
Last edited by Aceshigh; August 29th, 2012 at 04:45 AM.
August 29th, 2012, 09:54 AM
#26
Once Olds Always Olds
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: New Matamoras, Ohio
Posts: 1,202
If you are wanting an original look talk to Chip at Power Steering Services. Super guy. He can replace the insides of your original case to make it a 12:1. He did mine, based on Rob's recommendation. I can only tell you it looks good in a box in the basement, but Rob had Chip do his, and you already heard Rob's report.
August 29th, 2012, 10:40 AM
#28
Once Olds Always Olds
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: New Matamoras, Ohio
Posts: 1,202
It's more expensive than a Jeep box from the junkyard, its around $295.00 - "standard detailing" about $40 extra for the better detailing IIRC. WWW.powersteering.com is his site
August 30th, 2012, 06:36 PM
#30
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There's you problem - did you not put the frame back on?
Mine was loosey goosey like yours, too. Tie rods and BJs were not excessively worn. I could move the steery wheel about 3" effortlessly before the wheels turned - bad feeling when driving.
The steering box rebuilder said it had seen its better days as it was well worn after 155k miles. It was driven hard in sandy environments and had grit all in it.
It is now virgin-tight after rebuild.
Mine was loosey goosey like yours, too. Tie rods and BJs were not excessively worn. I could move the steery wheel about 3" effortlessly before the wheels turned - bad feeling when driving.
The steering box rebuilder said it had seen its better days as it was well worn after 155k miles. It was driven hard in sandy environments and had grit all in it.
It is now virgin-tight after rebuild.
Thanx,AL
August 31st, 2012, 08:09 AM
#33
delete
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Location: Long Island, NY
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I got mine from The Parts Place (everyone's favorite) and was very happy with it. Good thing is that they don't require the core back so you can have it ready to go as soon as you pull the old one out.
http://www.thepartsplaceinc.com/ocat...g%20gear%20box
http://www.thepartsplaceinc.com/ocat...g%20gear%20box
September 16th, 2012, 11:45 AM
#34
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Wan't ignoring you-been so damn busy with work and life. No I didn't. Spoke with many guys and drove it and the vote is to just replace it. So was going to get a rebuilt from PP. Liked Chip's but don't want to wait 3 weeks.
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