At last look, it was going to be sunny and mid 60's all weekend. Granted, the thing you can count on with Ohio weather is unpredictability..so we'll just play it by ear.

I know I'm going to work on it as if it's going to be nice out.

 

Upper 60's here in the Midwest, thru all of next week too. What's it doing in Vancouver ??

 

Changed the alternator this afternoon, and the whine is still there. After letting it run for a bit, I managed to decyfer its somewhere between the carb and back of the engine. Went ahead and shut it off to verify it wasn't something obvious, and fired it up again and the noise was gone.

In my confusion I took a minute while it was running to record how it sounds on 8 cylinders this time. Still need to dial the timing in After I get that noise taken care of, and make sure the carb is dialed right too..but man were getting close!

 

What RPM is it ?

 

Ya know, I've not even looked at the tach once.

I'll have a look next time it's running

 

Pulled the carb, put new gaskets/spacer in. Replaced trans vacuum line with a hardline and vacuum line from canister to intake (smaller hose). No change

Went ahead and made sure it wasn't the obvious (loose belt) and fired it up for this video.


I did look while it was running shortly after shutting the video off, it was about 2200 RPM, which tells me the tach is off (there no what that's 2200)

After a few I notice smoke coming from the PS side (not sure exactly where) so I shut it off and it puked coolant from the overflow hose. Figured the best thing for me to do is walk away..lol

 

If you don't have it set up as a closed system with an overflow jug and return style radiator cap, the coolant needs to be about 3" below the filler neck. The open systems will puke coolant if they are filled too high. The open systems have a FULL mark on the end tank to show the proper coolant level when cold.

 

Hmm..so no need to be concerned at the moment (aside from the obvious coolant hitting the ground), correct?

How hard is it to add an overflow?

 

An aftermarket setup is simple. Just get the overflow tank (there are many styles to choose from, everything from factory reproductions to basic tanks) and a return style radiator cap.

I have this style Dorman tank on my car. It's available from most auto parts stores, Amazon, Summit, etc.
https://www.dormanproducts.com/p-14807-54002.aspx

 

May go ahead and get one of those kits, but to update a bit on the engine..

Got it out today and actually drove it. After fighting with the mystery whine, I started tinkering with the idle speeds a bit (not a lot, and documented how many turns on both fast and curb screws in case I need to reset) but got it idled down enough to settle the whining down. At that point, I realized I need fuel so I said screw it and drove it to the gas station. I did notice it was harder to start each time I restarted it, but also hadn't put the light to it yet (was going to until I realized how low I was on fuel) so I believe that still leaves a bit of adjustment available. I did get to reading though on the Summit carb, and they pretty much require the supplied gasket..it sounds like in order to prevent an issue of a not-flat surface. Looking back at the other car I used a Summit carb on, I did use that gasket and had no issues. I'll go ahead and switch them around and hopefully that'll incidentally take care of that whine, as the paper gasket that came off yesterday did look like there was a spot that wasn't quite sealed.

I also need to fix the tabs for the throttle cable where it enters the firewall, as when I was pulling into the garage I could feel an issue with the throttle and could not get it to idle down before shutting it off..therefore it dieseled pretty bad and kinda startled me for a second.

Its so dang close though. Fixing those couple things, and making sure I don't have an exhaust leak..and I think we're finally done.

 

Changed gaskets last night, changed PCV grommet, and fought with the throttle cable tabs to the firewall. I'm not confident at all that its locked in, but at some point it'll quit raining and I'll be able to try it out (granted, the highs are in the 30s now..so I'm not going to be thrilled)

 

Went out for a minute to get a baseline on current timing...here's what I've got.

With timing light attached to #6 plug wire (remember, 180° out) and vacuum line plugged for vacuum advance, I used my dial light to get to 0. With the engine at 0, the dial showed 30°

First question. Should I be basing off of #6 even with being 180° out? Second, I am correct in procedure of checking with vacuum port plugged, right?

 

What is the timing off #1 cylinder? That sounded pretty high for an idle, it might be 2200 rpm. Try backing it down to about 1/2 that timing, if the same off #1. I used this an an overflow, my Dorman one began leaking.

 

Not sure, but it registered to me this morning that I was reading the timing while the car was still in fast idle mode..so obviously the RPMs were up.

I went ahead and switched to #1, that way after the kids bday party I can run out and fire it up and let it warm up to get a true base timing number at idle.

Ken at Everyday when he rebuilt my dist sent a card saying between 12-14 was recommended.

 

I’ve talked to him more than once regarding a dist and carb he did for a build I had. Zero help, I repeat, Zero. If it’s even just remotely different than stock he’s clueless. You’ll get more, and better help here I’m sure.

 

I'd heard somewhere else that 12° was what I should shoot for as well, that was the only reason I'd brought it up.

 

Just went out and let it run long enough to ensure it was warm, and it was still showing 30°. I backed the timing and idle screw down and it's reading 14° on the dial and idling smooth. The catch is, I seem to be having an issue with the linkage/return/something. I would rev it at the linkage and it'd return only so far, then I'd have to bump it back down. I figured that was enough for today, so I backed it back into the garage and realized it's definitely sticking. I finally got it in here and put it in park and tried to do the old "kick the throttle to unstick it" trick that I had to do on my Dodge when the springs were going out and it got stuck at WOT.

Im going to comb through the Summit carb booklet to make sure simething isnt missing, but Id hate to think it needs a different cable. It acts as if it's bound, yet as much slack I don't know how it would be.

At least now I have a reasonable base number to start with.

 

After some digging into the linkage mess, I started noticing the little bushing deal that came with the new throttle cable was kind of an important thing. I'm guessing it was sticking because it was bound up due to how tight I had the cable bolted on without the bushing in there. Went ahead and grabbed that and stuck it on, then reinstalled the cable as well as moved the return spring to a further back hole to provide a bit more tension.

I also tried to finally replace a bolt that was being used as a plug on the intake, and noticed it could be loosened by hand. Searched my stash of plugs and realized I don't have one small enough, so I found a shorter bolt and tightened it all the way down.

As long as the weather isnt dumb tomorrow, I may pull it out of the garage again and see what else can get done.

 

Glad to see you made some progress, sounds like you may actually get to drive this gorgeous 🚗.

 

Got the car out yesterday to verify the linkage issue, and it is fixed. While it was out and before I got too cold, I bumped the timing back to 12° and had full intentions of hooking the vacuum gauge up to work on getting things where they should be..but I couldn't get the line off the carb before it started snowing again. I do feel much better about the linkage though, and made note of where it's at for next time.

At 12°, it idles smooth at 2k (either the tach isn't right or the cam is much bigger than I realized) and the only complaint at this point is when I give it quick throttle, it chokes out for a quick second.

 

You may need lighter advance springs or the carb may need tweaking. This is where an AFR gauge is a huge help. You can try a couple more degrees of timing.

 

if I remember right, we ran into similar issues with the Dodge and the Summit 600 carb, and it took a couple finite adjustments.

I'm also considering getting ahold of a buddy of mine who races and tunes, and having him finish dialing this one in on his equipment..maybe even utilizing the chassis dyno since the engine builder kinda shafted me on that.

 

I think this would be a great idea.

 

Haven't updated this one in a while, but to make a long story short i managed to do nothing but make things progressively worse. I called cutlassefi this morning just asking for a solid reset point. As of now, I'm at 1100 RPM at idle, and the bog is practically gone. It does act like it's loading up while cruising, but not hateful. I'm at 16° initial and the concern is now only having 5-6 lbs (or whatever it is) of vacuum.

 

Not sure what's going on there -- my G-motor, with fairly rasty cam (218/224 @ 0.050, 0.462/0.468, 110 LSA), timing of 33-4 degrees @3000, and its original Q-Jet, will idle steadily, if not particularly smoothly, as low as 550 RPM with no off-idle bog or dead spot on tip-in.

I can't remember -- what were you cam specs?

 

228/235 @ .050 if I remember right, 110 LSA.

I think the issue is the lack of vacuum. I went out last night and double checked to make sure the carb was tight (it was) but also could crank the fittings on the intake a full 2 turns. It's supposed to be a pretty nice day today, so I'm gonna get it to work and play with it during my breaks.

Typically whenever I'd have a vacuum leak, I'd hear it..and I don't hear anything.

 

Careful you don't lash the carb down too tight. Warpage is a thing.

 

That's plenty of cam for a poor old long-stroke G-block. Dunno if it's the direct cause of your excessively low vacuum and attendant high idle, but if it were me, I'd think about backing it off a tick or two.

 

I'm struggling getting it to idle lower with the speed screw. I can turn it, but its just not making a difference.

Agreed, though I tend to break bolts before warping anything..so while its probably got a couple more snugs in there, I'm getting to my point of no longer comfortable tightening it..ha!

 

I'm sorry, bad wording on my part -- I meant back off on the cam, not the idle.

 

Look down the carb to see if the throttle blades are hung open. Check secondary blades as well.

 

Cam was recommended and purchased from CutlassEFI knowing what setup I was building. Even after the conversation yesterday, he didn't seem to think it was too much cam (or at least thats the vibe I got)

I thinking (hoping) the source is a vacuum leak somewhere. I know the trans mod line doesn't seal like I'd like it to (nipple on the mod is much larger than the end of the hardline) and I didn't replace the vacuum line from the canister into the dash, or the canister itself.

 

If that's the cam specs it's a pretty heft cam. Also you mention 5-6 lbs of vacuum. That's not a lot. But would be consistent with a hefty cam,or it could be a vacuum leak. If you've ruled out a leak and that's your vacuum, you could have an issue with the power valve that came with your Carb. If the powervalve set point is above 5-6lbs then you are always running with the circuit enriched (power valve lets in more fuel when the vacuum drops, which is normal when you hit the pedal). That would explain why you can never get the idle down to a normal RPM.

 

Just went out at lunch and unhooked any vacuum source one at a time to see if it was anything other than engine/carb related..and struck out. In running my hand under the carb between the carb and intake (has the adapter/spacer for Holley carb to Qjet intake) I noticed some sort of fluid or something. The spacer/adapter came with bolts to bolt the adapter in and studs for the carburetor, but I could never get those tight so I switched to the bolts holding the spacer on and bolting the carburetor down. What worries me is the bolts for the spacer are blade screws..so there's no telling how tight they are. If I were a betting man-I wouldn't be surprised if I have a leak there..though I wouldnt expect to be losing 8-10hg. I did notice a slight whistle when I fired it up though and fast idle was active, so I guess anything is possible at this point.

When I get home this evening, I'm going to be making another checklist as I don't foresee getting the car out again the rest of the year. I'll put that on the list, and in the meantime try to figure out how I can ensure those are tight.

 

For reference, the cam I have in my '69 400G is 216/226 @ .050, 0.488 intake / 0.496 exhaust and my idle vacuum is in the 13-14 range. No problem for the power brake booster. 5-6 seems crazy low to me.

 

I agree it's pretty dang low. I had it up to 8-9 last week, but it was also idling at 1600 in park. I did that by timing it with the dial light, and going by total timing (put me at 18-20° initial).

I'm going to check that base again when I get home. I'm tired of pulling the carb off but if that's where the issue is then what other choice do I have.. lol

 

That cam is just a little warmer than a base model 442 cam. It should have plenty of vacuum. I am certain Cutlassefi knows what he is doing and recommended a suitable cam.

 

Agreed.

 

That sounds right - my HEI is at 18º initial.
So is your initial still at 18-20?
Or did you change it to something else?

 

I think it's at like 14-16..I dont remember at the moment. Im running points though