RetroRanger

wow busy, informative and interesting thread ! Is it the same person selling fake parts to all on CO or is it a number of individuals ?

Mr Shifty Sidney

Unfortunately I have a contribution to this post. These parts were purchased from a member here. The person has always seemed honest and wanted to help. I guess I need to review my old emails and contact seller.

Don W

natedrag

Something to keep in mind is that sellers may not know its a fake, they may have paid good money for what they thought was a "real" part. Things changed- sold car, bought a project with the part included, etc. If I give you a counterfeit dollar bill, don't assume I make them in my basement.

72xw30

Yeah I understand, but the number of people who received counterfeit parts is growing by the day!!

If this is the work of one individual(s), then there is NO WAY you can tell me that the seller didn't know!!! - unless he is in his ROOKIE season but I highly doubt that.

If the individual(s) is/are veterans or have a good knowledge of OLDS then they KNOW real from fake and knew exactly what they were doing. I really hope this isn't the case.


ITS NOT RIGHT that people have been ripped off.

It used to be real difficult to find the rare W part. Now you see them listed online everywhere.
It's the same thing as more W cars now then Olds ever made.

Why isn't there any W30 parts for sale? Things that make you go hmmmmmm.

Keep the pictures coming.


Sam

dnmfranco

dnmfranco

Def one for now , possibly another

mrolds69

See how the last 3 fakes posted are clean? Now, look at that alt pic Sam posted. Notice how it's equally grungy, the crude cover casting, the very faint black letter codes showing still. Even though the 890 is spaced away from the 1100, you can tell it's real. Yup, I very rarely see open face alts on 442's, and I'll bet there are many fakes out there, too.

dnmfranco

is this carb real or fake?

Bernhard

This is the kind of **** that takes the fun out of the hobby!

stevengerard

I don't see a date stamp on it. Even the replacement W30 carbs had date stamps as far as I know - anyone else know for sure

dnmfranco

so true

dnmfranco

but look at 0 how it seems almost ground down, then look at 4
then look at B in comparison to U

72xw30

68/69 date codes on base plate.

Sam

stevengerard

I'm sure its multiple people. As I mentioned mine was from a retailer. When I called them on it they just said "if you don't like it return it" but I told them multiple times before I paid for it I did not want a re-stamp I wanted an original. They insured me it was one of their original on the shelf parts "waiting for the right car" I also agree some do not know better, many of these parts are 50 years old and not everyone knows what's what.

dnmfranco

Emails still coming in re: OW tranny's and rear ends
If you bought one in last few years check it and send pics

72xw30

The posi units need to be checked for the re-stamping of the 2 letter application code.
The different font on the re-stamped units is easy to identify!

Need pictures of your posi! Lol

Check your open face alternators too!! This is crazy!

Sam

pogo69

quite a bit of time has gone by now and i think the seller(s) SHOULD be at a point to come out and confess to this on their own...there are a few consequences to this such as reputation... if this is intentional i believe people can forgive these actions along with restitution ...i see three options for the seller..... accept responsibility, deny it, ignore it

Koda

And if they don't, it's time for name and shame!

pogo69

i have been thinking that one possibility of no names being thrown out yet is to give the seller(s) some time to address this, but i think time is running out

72xw30

That time will come - if the vendor(s) doesn't pay back every little penny to the folks that have been screwed, including me.


Send pictures, I KNOW there are many more people that got screwed on parts like trans, alts, carbs, and rear ends

I wonder if this vendor has worked on customer cars? I can only imagine!!

Again, send your pictures.

Cheers,
Sam

mrolds69

Yup, OW's...those are a big prob also. New tags were available for a long time, maybe still are. You can't tell unless you go into the trans. If the person says it's a rebuild, then you wouldn't do that. You can make an equivalent trans inside, I think. The prob is if you pay crazy bucks for one that's not real. It's the "ripoff" factor that's irritating.

72xw30

Yes the OW tags are available, however, the stamping is obviously different from original. It is Very easy to tell when you have originals to compare to.

In my case, I have 8 cars that have their original OW's and I have one original OW on the shelf NOT INCLUDING THE RE-stamped one I bought approx 10 years ago. ..I can tell a fake at first glance.

How many fakes have been sold in the past 10 years? Wow!

Cheers,

Sam

pogo69

internally i think you would tell by counting the clutch/plates

dnmfranco

Morgan is corect there is an extra clutch in ow

They are obviously not putting the extra clutch in

Unfortunately Morgan I think the possibility of unintentional actions is beyond reality way too many incidents.

I as well agree member or members come forward , admittance . And restitution . I think that would be the best but that's my belief only
Dean

442rocketdave

I remember being at the Lansing Oldsmobile Nationals and some guy had OW tags that was back in the late 80s he said he worked in the factory and had a few extra's! So if he sold them they found their way onto non OW trans and I know somebody made some fake ones in the 90s. either way if they were put on the trans and its not an OW then its a fake. Same for rear ends I got burned twice over the years for restamped axles!

dnmfranco

Dave actually Parts Place was selling them as well wonder how many of those made it to OG tranny's

dnmfranco

Received emails from members that purchased parts that they thought were suspect back a few years ago. They subsequently sold their cars but now are wondering what to do.

This is big and its only been 6 days or so for this thread
can only imagine how much more is out there

ROCKET VAPOR

These 7040257 carburetors are becoming rare and costly, thus the increased number of re-stamps available!


I am also very reluctant to purchase a part from a "ad with no pictures" posted, "freshly over restored" parts, and "blurry pictures posted" of a part while "avoiding the very critical areas" i.e. "I.D. stampings"



#1 7040257 known original


7040257_zpsd74f2f32.jpg


#2 7040257 on eBay now, original or re-stamp?


7040257I_zps76b33626-1-1.jpg


#3 7040257 on eBay now, original or re-stamp?

7040257II_zps8739a5e2-1.jpg

jensenracing77

If it will make you feel better I will post a FS thread with several REAL W parts on it,lol

442rocketdave

Thanks Rocket Vapor, Nothing beats a known original and on that restored one on Ebay I would be wary because of the spacing of the serial numbers I know there are some variables but when you compare alot of them you see a pattern. We have to stick together to stop this crap!!! Like Jensen racing said they started popping up like gumballs it is because of the opportunity for dishonest people to make a buck! I was wondering were all the W parts came from suddenly?

Koda

Pogo, 72xw,

I appreciate your and others' efforts. I don't have anything to submit on my own, as I don't have a W car and the only W stuff I have for it is some 67 track pack stuff which is obviously what it is and came from a good source. It's not my place to suggest when to end the "amnesty" as I don't have a dog in the fight, and I do think allowing people to come clean is good.

72xw30

#1 - original as can be

#2 - poor restamp !!!

#3 - from this one picture looks original, would need a different angle picture to confirm, but I'm leaning towards it being legit.

Look at the #2 on the three carbs and compare; you will see the difference.

Cheers,
Sam

StickW31

Yes Dean, I can't believe the overwhelming response to this thread in such a short period of time. It's hard to believe that it’s been going on for so long. Could you imagine if the OCA had these numbers verified as part of the judging at a National event??????
This is getting very serious and have a feeling it's one big can of worms, One case at a time Sam to try to help out ones that have been taken. I agree with the source being exposed but only after some of the major Oldsmobile enthusiasts have been fully compensated. Keep the pics coming. I have found a couple more rear end discrepancies, more to come.
You should also consider putting this on other sites like ROP and the OCA page of Facebook.

Steve

442rocketdave

Good Idea Steve, this thing may turn out to be larger than anyone thought and I hope that isnt the case because that would indicate that its not just a couple of bad eggs! Most Oldsmobile people are very honest and I have found them to be some of the best people I have ever met. But there are always a few bad apples in the barrel. These people should be called out and they should come clean and make it right for the people they have cheated.

pogo69

fwiw...this is an orig 853 alt the pics are not great the observation made is the numbers and letters are not stamped very deep and are hard to read it may help as a comparison

jensenracing77

Here is a real OW I sold to another member here. I didn't see much posted for OW tags so here is one.

72xw30

Hey Steve, hope things are well. The new ride will be here on Friday- keep you posted.

You folks that feel that you have been taken, please forward pictures to confirm!

So far, I hear through the grapevine that one individual as received a refund for approx 4K. It will be worth your while to forward pictures to confirm authenticity. Come on guys , keep the pictures coming.

Things are happening fast - keep posted.

Sam

72xw30

Very authentic OW tag.

Sam

72xw30

Agreed, nice original alternator with the font the way it should be.

Thanks for posting,

Sam

Octania

Are we sure we are not condemning real parts as falsified?



Please explain how to TELL the above is restamped.

This below I am wanting to say restamp, because the number surface is too smooth, and the crossbar on the "4" resides in a different location than the others.

Again, do we KNOW whether the originals perhaps were stamped with completely different stamp sets depending on where and when they were made? One would imagine that when making production, if it looks like a "4" then use it. As long as it fits my machine and makes a "4" in the part, who cares what the exact shape of the character is.

I don't want to see this swing too far the other way, and have legit parts called fake because of assumptions and some [mislabelled?] photos found on the interwebs...

On the '1933 distributor, I measured the diameters and to me that proved w/o a doubt that it had been turned down. There's not a chance the factory would make one that small. The details of the font/ shape of the characters is something I never even got to.