When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
I would literally set my car on fire before I would LS swap it.
Yet you run a Chevy or Ford based rear-end in that race car It's definitely a non-Oldsmobile differential and axles. They barely handled factory stock HP
I bet there are plenty of non-Olds parts in that car/drive train. Probably running Chevy big block connecting rods
Not to mention the tons of aftermarket accessories and parts throughout the vehicle.
The pushrod LS engine is what kept the muscle car scene alive in the 90's and beyond and still does to this day.
I understand keeping the Olds car, Olds powered, but the LS engine is still a GM engine, just like the no longer produced Olds engine. If you put in a Ford or Chrysler engine into an Olds, that would cause concern but at least an LS is still GM.
What gear set & axles are you using? The housing might be sheet metal but the gears & axles are not.
My point was simply that your car has many non-Olds parts, some are Chevy based and aftermarket based, which means they are not Oldsmobile parts.
Putting an LS engine in an Olds is not akin to committing Hara-Kiri. If it is truly a 100% Olds car, no aftermarket non-Olds parts can be on the car, which we know is not the case. Most Olds high HP engines will run Chevy 12 Bolts or Ford 9" differentials since the Olds differentials were timebombs when it comes to high HP and sticky tires. Let alone guys running Chevy connecting rods in an Olds 455
Some of us aren't LS fans in general. I thought they were gutless turds in trucks, they felt way overrated. Add in the wonderous 4L60-70E, you have something meh with a fragile transmission, goodbye 3rd and 4th. The Gen 5 engines are much better, way more power with better mileage. I would rather buy a new car and it would not be GM, then do a LS swap in my Olds.
But a LSX co-designed by Warren Johnson “The Professor”. 6-bolt mains, six bolts per cylinder, reinforced main webs and deck, a true priority main oiling system. I feel is the closet thing to a modern Old's engine. Designed by an Oldsmobile guy. If it's good enough for WJ, its good enough for me. This or 350 D, DX.
Yet you run a Chevy or Ford based rear-end in that race car It's definitely a non-Oldsmobile differential and axles. They barely handled factory stock HP
I bet there are plenty of non-Olds parts in that car/drive train. Probably running Chevy big block connecting rods
Not to mention the tons of aftermarket accessories and parts throughout the vehicle.
The pushrod LS engine is what kept the muscle car scene alive in the 90's and beyond and still does to this day.
I understand keeping the Olds car, Olds powered, but the LS engine is still a GM engine, just like the no longer produced Olds engine. If you put in a Ford or Chrysler engine into an Olds, that would cause concern but at least an LS is still GM.
The 12 bolt chevy is a corporate diff. Many GM A body's built in Canada came with the 12 bolt corporate diff. The type O has retained axles and might be just as strong as the 12 bolt Chevy.
The big difference is aftermarket support, this were Chevy has always been a leader.
Last edited by Bernhard; Jun 11, 2021 at 09:43 AM.
The reality is that if Oldsmobile was still around and had a rear drive platform car, it would have an LS engine in it, just like the Chevy's & Cadillac's have and Pontiac had. GM went with "corporate" engines and was stuffing the same engine design into GMC trucks, Corvettes, Cadillac's, Camaro's, Pontiac, etc. So if Oldsmobile was around today, it would 100% have a "corporate" engine that shared the platform with the remaining GM brands.
In the early 90's the Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme shared the exact same 3.1L or 3.4L engine into Oldsmobiles, Chevy's, Pontiac's, Buick's.
Nobody was setting their Olds on fire or committing vehicular Hara-Kiri because there was a non-Olds specific powertrain in their Oldsmobile.
Now, if someone is running a Ford differential in their Oldsmobile, that is blasphemy to the highest order and should be flogged.
Add in the wonderous 4L60-70E, you have something meh with a fragile transmission, goodbye 3rd and 4th.
The 4L80E is the way to go if making power. The 4L60E are not bad but have their power limits (450HP max in stock Stage 1 but around 900HP in Stage 4 builds). They make a 4L80E that will handle over 1,600 HP No doubt, the 4L80E is the way to go if your making good power but you will need a computer controller box ($800) as that is what controls the trans line pressures and shifting. About $6,000 all in for a Stage 3 trans, controller and converter.
A 2004R (stage 3) can handle about 1,000HP or 850 ft.lbs and it's a little lighter and smaller than a 4L80E. You don't need a controller box but need a TV cable to control the trans line pressures and shifting. All billet hard parts are a must or it will fail. Billet input shaft, billet forward drum, are a must.
This is a great LS swap into a 1968 442. Plus it has a 4L80E trans which is a bulletproof combo.:
We are well aware of the LS boost potential and modern sequential EFI. Unless the LS were severly torque managed stock, my 94 Z71 with a less than ideal tune with an 8.5 to 1 Olds 350, stock 307 5A heads, 204/214 cam, Sanderson shorties and 2.25" dual exhaust embarrassed the 5.3 with the same trans and rear gears idle to the 4200 rpm shift points. My truck actually had slightly taller tires. Over 4000 rpm was a flip flop for the LS. Most of us don't see the point of owning an Olds without an Olds engine. Pretty much any GM transmission other than the TH400 and TH4L80E fail without modifications behind any kind of power above smog junk. I have personally cooked the 3/4 clutch pack in the 4L65E in our 04 GMC towing a light load. My 94 Z71 had the dreaded weak reverse in the 4L60E, it was already a GM reman. I've had 3 TH2004R trans die. I have seen enough TH250/350's die behind even mid 70's 350's. As soon as any car with any trans issues came in with the TH200, they were instantly replaced with a TH350, even with just leaks. We have to be patient, I had to light a fire under the machine shop again. Hopefully next week for the block. Their crank guy is sick, so that won't be ground and who knows when Mahle will have the pistons done to balance the crank.
We are well aware of the LS boost potential and modern sequential EFI. Unless the LS were severly torque managed stock, my 94 Z71 with a less than ideal tune with an 8.5 to 1 Olds 350, stock 307 5A heads, 204/214 cam, Sanderson shorties and 2.25" dual exhaust embarrassed the 5.3 with the same trans and rear gears idle to the 4200 rpm shift points. My truck actually had slightly taller tires. Over 4000 rpm was a flip flop for the LS. Most of us don't see the point of owning an Olds without an Olds engine. Pretty much any GM transmission other than the TH400 and TH4L80E fail without modifications behind any kind of power above smog junk. I have personally cooked the 3/4 clutch pack in the 4L65E in our 04 GMC towing a light load. My 94 Z71 had the dreaded weak reverse in the 4L60E, it was already a GM reman. I've had 3 TH2004R trans die. I have seen enough TH250/350's die behind even mid 70's 350's. As soon as any car with any trans issues came in with the TH200, they were instantly replaced with a TH350, even with just leaks. We have to be patient, I had to light a fire under the machine shop again. Hopefully next week for the block. Their crank guy is sick, so that won't be ground and who knows when Mahle will have the pistons done to balance the crank.
Both my Hughes TH350 600 hp rated and the newer TH2004R from Extreme Automatics 650 hp rated. Have held up great. That with me using Lighting Rods to 6,000 rpm. I have been know to run cars so hard and kill them. Talk to Lonnie at Extreme.
Yes, Yes it is.
But I find it odd that a Company that owns the Foundry And can Do all the Machining in house. Can't say when The heads will be Avail.
I can see that from a company that is waiting on a shipping container of castings from China, Not having any idea.
But when you Own the Foundry and set the Job orders to be filled daily.
It seems ODD. I'll leave it at that.
I understand other job orders are more important Than a limited buying pool item. But the job order would be on the schedule calendar .They are not new at this. They have a good idea of time from cast, Q/C checks, all go, and machining, to in box and on pallet ready to ship. , But I have a good idea that the Aftermarket automotive end of the foundry business is not it's bread and butter and hasn't been for a long time. If the Edelbrook brand performance parts takes a back seat to other paying customers, It might be a long long time before Any job order for an Edelbrook part is penciled in.on the job order schedule . That is more than likely the reality.
They very well could have a years plus amount of work orders in the back log,That are not Edelbrook anything. That is fine, business is business and paying customers come first. just give a solid time line of when they be avail. So say someone like me, knows to go find a better set of factory heads to slap on or rebuild my smoger heads now as the new heads might be late 2022.
I know my 350 heads need 15 guides so all 16, a port clean up at the bowl, and new springs and such, I have no problem doing that if the new heads are a few seasons off, but I rather not, get it all buttoned up, and then after dumping 1000.00(give or take) on the iron heads. to have 2 nice door stops, That no one will want. And got little use before they come back off. for the alum heads.
ATM I'm in limbo. Admittedly, I should have never pulled the running engine till the heads were shipping, that is on me. no one else.
Dumping 1000.00 in iron heads if they be used for a season or two waiting on the new heads, I can get behind. doing that, and then pulling them to sit in a corner, I rather not.
It is looking more and more, find a better set of pre smog heads, rebuild them, clean the bowls up, good hardware and call it good.
I am not getting any younger. And I rather drive my olds than look at it.
The reality is that if Oldsmobile was still around and had a rear drive platform car, it would have an LS engine in it, just like the Chevy's & Cadillac's have and Pontiac had. GM went with "corporate" engines and was stuffing the same engine design into GMC trucks, Corvettes, Cadillac's, Camaro's, Pontiac, etc. So if Oldsmobile was around today, it would 100% have a "corporate" engine that shared the platform with the remaining GM brands.
In the early 90's the Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme shared the exact same 3.1L or 3.4L engine into Oldsmobiles, Chevy's, Pontiac's, Buick's.
Nobody was setting their Olds on fire or committing vehicular Hara-Kiri because there was a non-Olds specific powertrain in their Oldsmobile.
Now, if someone is running a Ford differential in their Oldsmobile, that is blasphemy to the highest order and should be flogged.
I think there be a lot of bruised brand chest thumping ego's if they ever looked at a Hollander interchange manual.
Both my Hughes TH350 600 hp rated and the newer TH2004R from Extreme Automatics 650 hp rated. Have held up great. That with me using Lighting Rods to 6,000 rpm. I have been know to run cars so hard and kill them. Talk to Lonnie at Extreme.
Never said I run her on the drag strip. Red light to red light at 3 am. I am more highway driving. I designed fire sprinkler systems, up and down the east coast. Years ago. High speed interstate driving 1am to 5am. 4 high beams and 2 low beams.{green toggle on dash}. Lights up the road like daylight.
Looking forward to building a D - DX block with new BBO heads. With the best parts at the end of the year. Think I go with the forged crankshaft from 400 or 425. And the cost to go that way. This is my last engine build. PM me and talk me into an all forged internals LSX around 600+ hp. And I can bolt my 2004R to it and my Rochester carburetor. Vortecpro
The dirty secret about manufacturing shortages currently seen is not just material shortages, but labor shortages.
When these factory workers can sit at home getting extra Covid pay bonuses added to their unemployment they get from being laid off, that is a lot more than they can make going back to work.
I think this can easier explain the unknown deliverable dates for parts easier than just saying materials shortages.
The ugly truth is that manufacturers can’t tell customers and industry that they can’t get people to show up for work to make things that customers want to buy, as that is not PC in today’s world of Covid-induced fear and current socially acceptable excuses.
the dirty secret about manufacturing shortages currently seen is not just material shortages, but labor shortages.
When these factory workers can sit at home getting extra covid pay bonuses added to their unemployment they get from being laid off, that is a lot more than they can make going back to work.
I think this can easier explain the unknown deliverable dates for parts easier than just saying materials shortages.
The ugly truth is that manufacturers can’t tell customers and industry that they can’t get people to show up for work to make things that customers want to buy, as that is not pc in today’s world of covid-induced fear and current socially acceptable excuses.
This extra government money is also why machine shops are absolutely slammed as well. A 6 month wait is insane, I better have my block on Friday. I sure hope they got a nice surprise at income tax time for their hand out. Before the Pandemic, Maple Foods processing plant in Brandon, Manitoba had new car draws, the employees were entered if they came to work for a certain consecutive number of days, ridiculous and shows the state of our society. My Daughter's all have jobs, we made them get part time jobs as teenagers. Faith, my middle daughter is working at Harvest Meats, an assembly line job like Maple Leaf for the Summer. She has one more year for her Art degree🤷♂️. She is very talented, it runs on both sides of the family. One of my ancestors was a portrait painter for an English King, my Great Uncle did the research. Victoria is doing Summer classes to finish her teaching degree sooner. She is working in the retail store for the same company I do, Prairie Coop, the new store has been a disaster, so many bad decisions. Amber is working part time in a food truck, hoping more jobs open up for her Environmental Science degree she just completed. Yes, it is off topic but so was an LS swap🙄. The world is a mess, hopefully once our governments pulls the plug on these programs people will have no choice to go back to work and cast our cylinder heads.
This extra government money is also why machine shops are absolutely slammed as well. A 6 month wait is insane, I better have my block on Friday. I sure hope they got a nice surprise at income tax time for their hand out. Before the Pandemic, Maple Foods processing plant in Brandon, Manitoba had new car draws, the employees were entered if they came to work for a certain consecutive number of days, ridiculous and shows the state of our society. My Daughter's all have jobs, we made them get part time jobs as teenagers. Faith, my middle daughter is working at Harvest Meats, an assembly line job like Maple Leaf for the Summer. She has one more year for her Art degree🤷♂️. She is very talented, it runs on both sides of the family. One of my ancestors was a portrait painter for an English King, my Great Uncle did the research. Victoria is doing Summer classes to finish her teaching degree sooner. She is working in the retail store for the same company I do, Prairie Coop, the new store has been a disaster, so many bad decisions. Amber is working part time in a food truck, hoping more jobs open up for her Environmental Science degree she just completed. Yes, it is off topic but so was an LS swap🙄. The world is a mess, hopefully once our governments pulls the plug on these programs people will have no choice to go back to work and cast our cylinder heads.
Its only going to get worse. In my business when I call to order a part I ask how many is in stock, after I get an answer, I say send them all. Pretty pathetic I have to run my business like this, and expensive as well.
I never stop working-ever
Last edited by VORTECPRO; Jun 15, 2021 at 06:10 AM.
Has anyone come across a stimulating Olds cylinder head thread recently? They’re always such plain vanilla!
FWIW - I’m predicting the SBO Eds spank the iron heads as long as the CR stays consistent on the mule.
Keep your chin up Mark, you’re doin it right! And, the Olds community as well.
—-
Thank you!
The SB heads are on my mule, I just haven’t had a chance to get it on my Dyno. Just finished that flex fuel coil on plug Stroker. Next is another sb Stroker with a Sniper. If I can squeeze it in after that I will. And yes compression will be within .15 of the iron headed combo.
Last edited by cutlassefi; Jun 15, 2021 at 08:38 PM.
The dirty secret about manufacturing shortages currently seen is not just material shortages, but labor shortages.
When these factory workers can sit at home getting extra Covid pay bonuses added to their unemployment they get from being laid off, that is a lot more than they can make going back to work.
I think this can easier explain the unknown deliverable dates for parts easier than just saying materials shortages.
The ugly truth is that manufacturers can’t tell customers and industry that they can’t get people to show up for work to make things that customers want to buy, as that is not PC in today’s world of Covid-induced fear and current socially acceptable excuses.
Maybe so, I have no idea, I never stopped working through it all, other than when I got it, and had to sit out 3 weeks.
But other than that it has been, work as many hours as you want unlimited OT.
I guess employers are going to have to pay enough to make it worth people's time to come to work. What a time to be alive....
Yup, Too many still think it is 2008-2011 and they could pay peanuts and get 100's to apply.
6o minutes had a story on welfare lifers that get full boat government help, including sec 8 housing, and it was 41k a year.
Those on unemployment from the 2020 covid mess, are not getting sec 8, and other welfare help.
So if your paying employees under 30k a year, that might be why they are picking sitting on their buts.
30k might be good living in fly over states, but in other areas, not so much.
577.00 a week gross, 424.00 take home. Maybe if I was 18 again. but otherwise I'd not get out of bed either.
From the grace of God, my job did not get cut, and I been working none stop all the o/t I can handle.
But they are still offering wages that they dropped the starting wage to in 2009, And now wonder why no one worth interviewing is applying .
I think many employers and industries are in this same boat. The wages are still set at resession economy levels.
Last edited by Grayghost; Jun 23, 2021 at 03:33 AM.
Yah, 30K is a terrible wage up here. I left my last job because I was just under 50K. I make 60K and my Wife 90+K. Even that is tough with a mortgage, new car and boat with our other debt. I saw a new diesel 3/4 with a big camper and big boat behind it. That is probably 250K up here new, food for thought. Hopefully we see the heads by year end. Mark is doing his part, close to testing them but he is a one man show.
Not hijacking this thread but parts in general made overseas are fixing to get real expensive. I have a 66 A-Body floor pan on order and they are cancelling all back orders because shipping containers that were 7K are now 17K. They can't give a new price because of the uncertainly of shipping costs. To the guys bitching about the delivery time for the new heads,give it a rest.
It's definitely a non-Oldsmobile differential and axles. They barely handled factory stock HP
No doubt, the 4L80E is the way to go if your making good power but you will need a computer controller box ($800) as that is what controls the trans line pressures and shifting. About $6,000 all in for a Stage 3 trans, controller and converter.
