Seff

Given the daily driver status of my Supreme, old front end bushings and even the backwards geometry is dangerous. So, I ordered a set of UMI control arms, with the tallest ball joints they offer.




This is what a long winter of salted roads did to the driver's side. A touch-up is in order, I think.

xqGPqcg.jpg



Speaking of rust - just look at that color! But more importantly, look at that unfastened nut. No wonder my steering was sloppy and clonky. o.O

VF0wx4O.jpg





With the brake disc, steering arm and wheel bearing gone, we can work on the ball joints. Remember to leave the nut on the end of the ball joint in place if you don't have a jack under the spring.

rDgFB9k.jpg



With both ball joints disconnected, it's a matter of lowering the jack to decompress the spring.

9e8dSkV.jpg


At this point the upper arm comes off easily, just a matter of rusty nuts. :P

RtxIEfe.jpg



No wonder my front end didn't line up - those are some pretty gnarly bushings.

pU9ccN8.jpg
wQkNJEr.jpg
5KIf1JK.jpg
Zb2mNuS.jpg




And finally - what's the torque rating on this nut? Can't seem to locate it, and three of the four I've removed so far (two sets of front suspension, to find the best parts) have been hand-tight, no more. Bearings are fresh-looking.

Gk8ro94.jpg

jag1886

Your old stuff was really FU. Keep showing photos as you can.

oldcutlass

The torque rating on the spindle nut? Basically it's a small preload, and yes they do loosen easily sometimes. I just pack the bearings, reassemble, install the tire and wheel. Then tighten the nut while turning the wheel until I feel it start to bind, loosen a bit and then retighten until there is no vertical play, and then tighten till the cotter pin hole lines up. I use 100#'s on lug nuts.

Yeah, it was time to change the bushings, perhaps a bit past that time. Looks like your progressing well.

Seff

Yeah, the old bushings were way past their prime.

Thanks for the run-down on wheel bearings and spindle nuts, I'm gonna need that.

Seff

Spindle and steering arm all ready for some Hammerite. Not sure how it compares to stuff you have over there, but it's rust-resistant, thick, heavy, sticky paint.
UhIxyCw.jpg


All ready to be installed. It has a rubber spring insulator in there already. The bushings need lubrication before you install the arm in the frame - luckily it's included.
98TV75B.jpg


The springs on the left is the set I took off the car - the set on the right is from the original car. One car had FE2, the other did not. Both were 350 cars. The set on the right has one flattened end, while the other set has normal ends. I'm better off reinstalling the set on the left, yes?
IOK4BuQ.jpg


Ten minutes of mucking about resulted in upper and lower arms being fitted, ready for spring and spindles. Waaay too easy.
MFaUF7s.jpg

oldstata

Love the pallet jack ! Now that's thinking

Seff

That's the only jack I own, and how I took apart and put together this car in the first place. :P

Seff

All painted and ready to go.
UvkSt9n.jpg

Wham, bam, thank you ma'am! Took all of ten minutes to button that up. Notice the tall ball joint clearly visible on the upper control arm.
kY0lXwq.jpg

But what's that? The shock doesn't fit through the LCA? Do I REALLY have to take it apart again? Fiine.
(Two hours later)
WHY WILL THIS MOTHERFUCKING THING NOT LINE UP?! I JUST DID THIS A MINUTE AGO!! >:O
vULHmcw.jpg

Run to Rund

Check the service manual for spec on the spindle nut. It is usually 30 ft lb while spinning the hub, then loosen, take to finger tight, and loosen enough to put in a cotter pin. There won't be any preload on the bearings.

oldstata

I ve done it this way but have always went tighter to install cotter pin

Seff

I had a hard time finding it in the service manual, because I didn't know the name of that nut. Advice duly noted, both of you. Thanks.

Seff

By the time I got back to the workshop today, I'd been thinking and wondering about my springy conundrum. The first thing I tried was smearing bearing grease on the outside of the rubber spring seat. Lo and behold, it worked! It worked so well, in fact, that I forgot to take pictures as I put the steering knuckles together.

Look how close my steering is to the sway bar. With the tires hanging free it rubs. I haven't tried turning the sway bar upside down, and I don't know if that's advisable. The immediate thought is that it doesn't matter which way it's turned, since it's just a big torsion bar.
Jto3vKC.jpg
pyUmUf4.jpg

With the steering wheel centered, this is how the tires stood. Talk about different geometry.
SHE9ToO.jpg
7KUoMe4.jpg

I'm doing rough toe adjustment first, then approximate camber and caster. When these are so-so, I'll take it to an alignment shop, I think. If nothing else to make sure the measurements are accurate.

The control arms came with three different recommended settings; "street/show", "street/performance", and "mild competition (not recommended for street)".

Show:
Camber: 0 to 1/4 degrees
Caster driver's side: +4 degrees
Caster pass. side: +4.5 degrees
Toe: IN 1/8" total

Performance:
Camber: 1/2 degrees
Caster driver's side: +5 degrees
Caster pass. side: +5.5 degrees
Toe: IN 1/16" total

Competition:
Camber: -1 to -1.5 degrees
Caster driver's side: +5 to +6 degrees
Caster pass. side: +5.5 to +6.5 degrees
Toe: OUT 0" to 1/16" total (Autocross)

68conv455

Any reason you chose the tallest ball joint available?

Seff

To get the most performance-oriented setup they offered. I want my car to handle, since it's a daily driver it needs to keep up, safety-wise as well.

Taller effective spindle height raises the roll center and diminishes the camber change during suspension travel, in conjunction with the different UCA. The lower is merely stronger, but the same shape as the factory LCA.

oldcutlass

I like these settings:

Camber: 0 - 1/4 degrees
Caster driver's side: +5 - 7degrees
Caster pass. side: +5.5 - 7.5 degrees
Toe: IN 1/16" - 1/8 total

Seff

Are those on factory control arms?

oldcutlass

In general, I upped the caster settings because you can never get to 7 on factory control arms but you can on yours. Caster helps to keep the car going straight and adds road feel. The camber and toe are standard daily driver to performance settings.

Seff

I can certainly try both, see which I like better. :P

Seff

Does anyone know why they went from asymmetric camber to asymmetric caster? The camber asymmetry was because of road crown, but does caster asymmetry take care of this as well?
pFlKh4B.jpg


Steering is rubbing. Longer/taller sway bar links in order? I'll start by getting my alignment sorted out, then see if it's still an issue. This picture is with the weight of the car on the wheels, mind you.
lQe6RHJ.jpg

oldstata

Caster does pull to the negative side . When doing alignments I try and keep equal
But every tech is different

Seff

I can always, and easily, change it.

oldcutlass

The reason for caster settings being different on the passenger side is to compensate for the crown of the road.

You don't want any interference with the sway bar or any other object with steering components at either extreme of suspension movement. You can get some GR8 all thread rod and make a longer standoff with tubing to extend it up. Or buy some adjustable sway bar links.

Seff

So I gathered - but why compensate for road crown through caster instead of through camber, like in the old days? I'm just wondering.

oldstata

Not positive here so please forgive me if this is incorrect. on this style of set up if you adjust camber or caster it affects each other, so I would think that they leave room for corrects on either side ?

Seff

Well, according to the CSM, shims behind the rear UCL bolt only changes the caster, but I could go check that fact quite easily.

oldcutlass

No they are 2 separate adjustments. Caster is the angle from the top ball joint to the bottom with relation to the ground, it controls the amount of force necessary to turn the steering wheel and it aids in the wheels to remain straight. Camber is the angle from the top of the tire to the bottom with relation to the ground. You want this slightly tipped in at the top or perpendicular to the ground, it will effect tire wear.

oldstata

I realize they are different adjustment but I though that when I added shims for caster that it changed my camber readings ?

Seff

Basic trigonometry says it will, but there might be other factors involved. :P

TeleThunder

Hi everyone
I am new here and I do not try to be an smarta... but isnt his swaybar mounted upside down? I think if it was turned the other way it would not rubb, or?

Seff

Heh, I thought the same thing TeleThunder, but when I turned the sway bar around, it rubbed on the idler arm and the pitman arm. It's a very healthy 1 1/4" bar.

With the camber and toe dialed in, neither side touches, but I suspect the driver's side will come closer as caster is adjusted. I extended the sway bar end links 3/4" to make life easier, but it didn't eradicate the problem, and making the link longer will cause other problems.

With the history of a broken frame, this car has lost all symmetry in the front end, so I'm not bothered by the sides acting different.

Seff

I fashioned 8½ inch sway bar end links, it seems to work just fine. I moved the sway bar up and down without the end links mounted, no frame contact.

There IS a sound that consistently appears when I drive over speed bumps - a rubber against metal kind of sound, not a metal on metal clonk. I'm assuming this is the poly bushings talking to me?

First I set rough toe, then camber. Went to the alignment guy, he didn't have time until Wednesday, so I pulled the wheels off and set rough caster, then went back to setting camber and then finally toe. 20 round trip last night, the car hugs corners very nicely.

ent72olds

Seff, just make sure you torque all suspension with weight on wheels...I'm sure you did, but sometimes, the noise you hear could be the bushings screaming....as you were soldier...

Seff

I did indeed, but always had a re-torque in mind, once everything has settled and the bolts have stretched a bit, etc. You suggest loosening them up before re-torquing?

ent72olds

If the car was resting on its full weight, on all fours, when you originally torqued , you should be good. If you didn't, yes, loosen and retorque while on all fours. Definitely cool too see you using it as a DD!

Seff

I had 'jacks' under the front wheels and rear wheels on the floor, bounced it up and down a bit to set everything, then tightened it. Will see how it develops.

As for DD use; these cars were made to be driven. :P