72 Olds 442 clone (with Gen III swap)
November 15th, 2010, 11:29 PM
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72 Olds 442 clone (with Gen III swap)
First post here................
I picked up a 72 442 clone that looks to have had a partial restoration. New suspension, steering, brakes, paint, etc, but no motor.
So going in the direction of resto-mod. Putting in new wiring harness, Vintage Air, and a 6.0 fuel injected GM vortec engine.
Spent today removing the steering column and dash (partially).
A pic of the project as I got it. It came with original hood as well as this glass one, and a rear wing. Still debating which hood to use.
DSCN0106.jpg
I picked up a 72 442 clone that looks to have had a partial restoration. New suspension, steering, brakes, paint, etc, but no motor.
So going in the direction of resto-mod. Putting in new wiring harness, Vintage Air, and a 6.0 fuel injected GM vortec engine.
Spent today removing the steering column and dash (partially).
A pic of the project as I got it. It came with original hood as well as this glass one, and a rear wing. Still debating which hood to use.
DSCN0106.jpg
November 16th, 2010, 12:04 AM
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Thanks.
Yep, I want something that's comfortable, practical, reliable, gets good milage, etc. a mid life crisis car. So I'm going for fuel injection, modern AC, cruise control, etc. But I am keeping the 4 speed.
Yep, I want something that's comfortable, practical, reliable, gets good milage, etc. a mid life crisis car. So I'm going for fuel injection, modern AC, cruise control, etc. But I am keeping the 4 speed.
November 16th, 2010, 05:28 AM
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Welcome aboard - looks like the makings of a good driver.
The OAI hood is great, but it is a costly thing. For daily use, i might opt for the std hood. Of course i live in a very accident, vandalism, theft, and hail proned area....
Keep your thread up to date - other's progress helps build my motivation levels.
The OAI hood is great, but it is a costly thing. For daily use, i might opt for the std hood. Of course i live in a very accident, vandalism, theft, and hail proned area....
Keep your thread up to date - other's progress helps build my motivation levels.
November 16th, 2010, 07:28 AM
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Yep, but after putting a 6.0 LS motor in my 68 corvette(explains "Garys 68") , going with a modern FI motor was an easy choice. Easy starts, 26mpg hiway, 22 mpg city, and torque similar to a big block.
Pics of the 6.0 and Richmond 6 speed in the corvette. Planning something similar with a Muncie.
enginetrans.jpg
front.jpg
Pics of the 6.0 and Richmond 6 speed in the corvette. Planning something similar with a Muncie.
enginetrans.jpg
front.jpg
November 16th, 2010, 08:34 AM
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Actually I agree. That's why I basically put an 06 corvette engine into a 68 corvette.
But if Olds was still around today and building a new "retro" hi performance 442, you can bet they would drop in the best GM has to offer, an LS series V8 (like the 2010 Camaro).
BTW, I love this forum! I spent the morning reading on how to get the dash out.
But if Olds was still around today and building a new "retro" hi performance 442, you can bet they would drop in the best GM has to offer, an LS series V8 (like the 2010 Camaro).
BTW, I love this forum! I spent the morning reading on how to get the dash out.
November 17th, 2010, 05:01 AM
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Rebuilt column, new upper bearing, replaced ignition (now matches the door keys), added cruise control/turn signal lever and wiring (for drive by wire TB cruise control), and new coat of paint.
DSCN0115.jpg
DSCN0115.jpg
November 17th, 2010, 05:18 AM
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The dishwasher does a great job on interior trim parts.
November 17th, 2010, 06:03 AM
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The muncie looks like it had a recent rebuild, gears and syncros look nice.
DSCN0116.jpg
Now the bad. The case was cracked and welded. Even worse, I was able to move the countershaft with my finger.
I could have the countershaft hole bushed for under $100, but on a previously cracked case it's not worth it. I can get a new muncie "supercase" for $225. If thet's all it needs I'll go that route. If not, I'll get a 5 speed.
And yes, I am single. But the kitchen just happens to be between the basement workshop and the garage, and the lighting is better.
DSCN0117.jpg
DSCN0116.jpg
Now the bad. The case was cracked and welded. Even worse, I was able to move the countershaft with my finger.
I could have the countershaft hole bushed for under $100, but on a previously cracked case it's not worth it. I can get a new muncie "supercase" for $225. If thet's all it needs I'll go that route. If not, I'll get a 5 speed.
And yes, I am single. But the kitchen just happens to be between the basement workshop and the garage, and the lighting is better.
DSCN0117.jpg
Last edited by garys 68; November 17th, 2010 at 06:05 AM.
November 17th, 2010, 08:31 AM
#16
Actually I agree. That's why I basically put an 06 corvette engine into a 68 corvette.
But if Olds was still around today and building a new "retro" hi performance 442, you can bet they would drop in the best GM has to offer, an LS series V8 (like the 2010 Camaro).
BTW, I love this forum! I spent the morning reading on how to get the dash out.
But if Olds was still around today and building a new "retro" hi performance 442, you can bet they would drop in the best GM has to offer, an LS series V8 (like the 2010 Camaro).
BTW, I love this forum! I spent the morning reading on how to get the dash out.
The olds 455 will still beat it. Nice looking car though.
November 21st, 2010, 06:44 AM
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Engine showed up.
DSCN0130.jpg
DSCN0130.jpg
November 21st, 2010, 08:22 AM
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This should be an interesting build thread. I always wanted to see what it really takes to get one of these motors into an A body. WOn't be easy, but it sounds like you are willing to accept the challenge.
I saw a guy who put a highly modified LS1 motor into a Pinto and got outstanding 1/4 mile times! Talk about sandblasting a soup cracker...
I saw a guy who put a highly modified LS1 motor into a Pinto and got outstanding 1/4 mile times! Talk about sandblasting a soup cracker...
November 21st, 2010, 07:10 PM
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First post here................
I picked up a 72 442 clone that looks to have had a partial restoration. New suspension, steering, brakes, paint, etc, but no motor.
So going in the direction of resto-mod. Putting in new wiring harness, Vintage Air, and a 6.0 fuel injected GM vortec engine.
Spent today removing the steering column and dash (partially).
A pic of the project as I got it. It came with original hood as well as this glass one, and a rear wing. Still debating which hood to use.
I picked up a 72 442 clone that looks to have had a partial restoration. New suspension, steering, brakes, paint, etc, but no motor.
So going in the direction of resto-mod. Putting in new wiring harness, Vintage Air, and a 6.0 fuel injected GM vortec engine.
Spent today removing the steering column and dash (partially).
A pic of the project as I got it. It came with original hood as well as this glass one, and a rear wing. Still debating which hood to use.
In what form. This motor with the right cam, tune and headers will make 500HP run low12's high 11's easy and still get 20+ MPG. Sure you can build a 455 that will do that (except the MPG) but you are looking at a pretty built motor. You want to do a little head work on the 6.0 you can make 550-575 HP.
Let the man build his car. You guys might just learn something.
November 22nd, 2010, 04:58 AM
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I was considering the T56 or TKO, but the previous owner just replace the floor and trans tunnel (converted from auto to 4 speed) and both those require too much hacking.
It's got a 2.73 rear gear so a T10 with the 3.42 1st would be a good budget choice. Other than that the Richmond 5 speed (3.27 1st, 1.00 5th) or Richmond 6 speed (3.27 1st, 0.86 6th) should fit without cutting the tunnel.
And you are correct on hp potential of these motor. My 6.0 LQ9 is at 400hp with a tune and headers. And the newer LY6 (variable valve timing) is 385hp right from the factory. Simple cam swaps put that motor at nearly 500hp
It's got a 2.73 rear gear so a T10 with the 3.42 1st would be a good budget choice. Other than that the Richmond 5 speed (3.27 1st, 1.00 5th) or Richmond 6 speed (3.27 1st, 0.86 6th) should fit without cutting the tunnel.
And you are correct on hp potential of these motor. My 6.0 LQ9 is at 400hp with a tune and headers. And the newer LY6 (variable valve timing) is 385hp right from the factory. Simple cam swaps put that motor at nearly 500hp
November 22nd, 2010, 08:59 AM
#21
In what form. This motor with the right cam, tune and headers will make 500HP run low12's high 11's easy and still get 20+ MPG. Sure you can build a 455 that will do that (except the MPG) but you are looking at a pretty built motor. You want to do a little head work on the 6.0 you can make 550-575 HP.
Let the man build his car. You guys might just learn something.[/quote]
Hey u are right the only thing the ls motor has is mileage. i have a 02 camaro with a ls1 in it. and it is more expensive to fix then my old 455. the roller cam are more expensive, the headers are more expensive there are alot more aftermarket heads for them but a good set of heads are more, coil paks, injectors, its all more expensive then a old olds. do the same amount of work to a 7.5 that u do to a 6.0 and the 7.5 will beat it. there is no replacement for displacment. but the 6.0 will get better mileage. but how far am i going to drive my olds and if i do drive it far, i'm not worried about mileage. also if i went and looked at a 72 olds 442 (clone) if it didnt have a olds engine in it. i wouldnt buy it or i would ask him to lower the price by alot or ask him to sell it to me with no engine so there is three ways the 455 has him beat.
Let the man build his car. You guys might just learn something.[/quote]
Hey u are right the only thing the ls motor has is mileage. i have a 02 camaro with a ls1 in it. and it is more expensive to fix then my old 455. the roller cam are more expensive, the headers are more expensive there are alot more aftermarket heads for them but a good set of heads are more, coil paks, injectors, its all more expensive then a old olds. do the same amount of work to a 7.5 that u do to a 6.0 and the 7.5 will beat it. there is no replacement for displacment. but the 6.0 will get better mileage. but how far am i going to drive my olds and if i do drive it far, i'm not worried about mileage. also if i went and looked at a 72 olds 442 (clone) if it didnt have a olds engine in it. i wouldnt buy it or i would ask him to lower the price by alot or ask him to sell it to me with no engine so there is three ways the 455 has him beat.
November 22nd, 2010, 01:43 PM
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all4442, you hit the nail on the head.
This is the car I'll be driving to the lake every weekend (2 1/2 hrs each way). That's also why I'm adding Vintage air, cruise control, dynamat, etc. I'm getting old enough to appreciat a reliable, comfortable ride that gets 25mpg.
BTW, you guys have been really nice about this engie swap. I thought I was going to be kicked off corvette forum when posted a build thread on my LS/Richmond swap in my 68 corvette.
This is the car I'll be driving to the lake every weekend (2 1/2 hrs each way). That's also why I'm adding Vintage air, cruise control, dynamat, etc. I'm getting old enough to appreciat a reliable, comfortable ride that gets 25mpg.
BTW, you guys have been really nice about this engie swap. I thought I was going to be kicked off corvette forum when posted a build thread on my LS/Richmond swap in my 68 corvette.
Last edited by garys 68; November 22nd, 2010 at 01:48 PM.
November 29th, 2010, 11:21 AM
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Hot Rodding = Express yourself. And do so however you feel fit!
Corvette purists are a funny breed, eh!?! Heh-heh!
I'm with you Gary, let it rip. Want some insight? A build I've followed over time and is also a well-documented build is a '70 GTO with LS power. If you need any pointers, sure Andrew will be willing to share his experiences:
http://www.popularhotrodding.com/fea...gto/index.html
http://forums.performanceyears.com/f...d.php?t=553683
I'm a Pontiac guy, but like almost all makes, and appreciate talent and drive.
By the way, my daily driver, the LeMans, gets 22 on the highway, but I have to work at that! Barely breathe on the pedal on flat surface! Heh-heh! Still though, I've documented a 21+ mpg in a 461 big block and a 4L80E. Had to prove it to the nay-sayers!
.
Corvette purists are a funny breed, eh!?! Heh-heh!
I'm with you Gary, let it rip. Want some insight? A build I've followed over time and is also a well-documented build is a '70 GTO with LS power. If you need any pointers, sure Andrew will be willing to share his experiences:
http://www.popularhotrodding.com/fea...gto/index.html
http://forums.performanceyears.com/f...d.php?t=553683
I'm a Pontiac guy, but like almost all makes, and appreciate talent and drive.
By the way, my daily driver, the LeMans, gets 22 on the highway, but I have to work at that! Barely breathe on the pedal on flat surface! Heh-heh! Still though, I've documented a 21+ mpg in a 461 big block and a 4L80E. Had to prove it to the nay-sayers!
.
November 29th, 2010, 12:20 PM
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Make up an engine / tranny conversion thread for us all to see!
I do not think i saw all of the work it takes to do this. It is involved, but you are up for it and already have the motor.
A 442 clone is no longer original, so why not a resto-mod. That was what I thought about mine, too.
I can tell you a lot on the dynamat part - my interior thread tells the twisted tale...
Time to get busy!
November 29th, 2010, 12:50 PM
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I know Andrews build from LS1tech. I even kind of copied his idea for a cowl induction on my 68 corvette.
BTW, here's the build thread on my 68. I'll do a similar one here for the 72 442.
http://www.vettemod.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2731
BTW, here's the build thread on my 68. I'll do a similar one here for the 72 442.
http://www.vettemod.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2731
December 5th, 2010, 05:22 AM
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OK, here's where you guys are really going to rip on me. I needed new gauges, liked the 3 gauge layout, but hated the woodgrain.
I'll be using the same overlay material on the center console and door woodgrain pieces.
DSCN0140.jpg
The vortec motors come with 140 amp up to 250 amp alternators. So an upgraded new wire harness is next to go in.
DSCN0138.jpg
I'll be using the same overlay material on the center console and door woodgrain pieces.
DSCN0140.jpg
The vortec motors come with 140 amp up to 250 amp alternators. So an upgraded new wire harness is next to go in.
DSCN0138.jpg
Last edited by garys 68; December 5th, 2010 at 05:25 AM.
December 7th, 2010, 12:36 AM
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Modified AC controls and compressor request cam plate to work with aftermarket AC unit.
DSCN0147.jpg
Finished dash panel.
DSCN0143.jpg
DSCN0147.jpg
Finished dash panel.
DSCN0143.jpg
Last edited by garys 68; December 7th, 2010 at 12:53 AM.
December 7th, 2010, 10:13 PM
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December 9th, 2010, 02:51 PM
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Interior cleaned out.
DSCN0149.jpg
And the engine compartment.
DSCN0150.jpg
The Classic Air system is due here next week, just in time for the coldest weather of the year....
DSCN0149.jpg
And the engine compartment.
DSCN0150.jpg
The Classic Air system is due here next week, just in time for the coldest weather of the year....
December 16th, 2010, 03:26 PM
#32
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Been cold here, so been doing wiring.
Started with this:
DSCN0151.jpg
Cleaned it up, and on the motor:
DSCN0158.jpg
And the dash panel, modded the original controls, added another harness for the dash.
DSCN0155.jpg
And a new fuse pael with relays. Going to try to fit it in the original spot on the firewall.
DSCN0156.jpg
Started with this:
DSCN0151.jpg
Cleaned it up, and on the motor:
DSCN0158.jpg
And the dash panel, modded the original controls, added another harness for the dash.
DSCN0155.jpg
And a new fuse pael with relays. Going to try to fit it in the original spot on the firewall.
DSCN0156.jpg
December 25th, 2010, 12:34 PM
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I stuck sound deadener on the firewall followed by jute/rubber insulation or foil backed insulation.
DSCN0162.jpg
I also got floor sound deadener along with carpet yesterday. Pic of the sound deadener. I'll glue it down after it lays down a little along with some more of the adhesive sound deadener where this stuff doesnt cover.
I want this to be a quiet, comfortable, squeek free ride.
DSCN0163.jpg
And you can see the Classic Auto Air evaporator/heater core mounted.
DSCN0169.jpg
And the harness is pretty much at the plug and play stage with all weather pack connectors. Might as well do it right.
DSCN0166.jpg
DSCN0162.jpg
I also got floor sound deadener along with carpet yesterday. Pic of the sound deadener. I'll glue it down after it lays down a little along with some more of the adhesive sound deadener where this stuff doesnt cover.
I want this to be a quiet, comfortable, squeek free ride.
DSCN0163.jpg
And you can see the Classic Auto Air evaporator/heater core mounted.
DSCN0169.jpg
And the harness is pretty much at the plug and play stage with all weather pack connectors. Might as well do it right.
DSCN0166.jpg
Last edited by garys 68; December 25th, 2010 at 03:43 PM.
January 1st, 2011, 09:33 AM
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Decided to keep the Muncie. $50 for a good used #325 case and a rebuild kit from ebay later.....
And the Hurst shifter is a work of art compared to the standard 4 speed shifters I'm used to, pretty close to the Long shifter on my Richmond.
DSCN0174.jpg
And the Hurst shifter is a work of art compared to the standard 4 speed shifters I'm used to, pretty close to the Long shifter on my Richmond.
DSCN0174.jpg
January 1st, 2011, 05:32 PM
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Interesting. I set mine up for aftermarket heat and air 2 years ago. Eliminated the box interior and exterior etc. and smoothed the firewall. Still waiting for $ to finish it. How is the Classic Auto air install going? They are the ones I am leaning towards. They also offer a compressor bracket for the 455. What model did you order? They told me that I would have to use a universal kit. Thanks
January 2nd, 2011, 12:38 AM
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I've installed a Vintage Air before and this is my first Classic Air.
Vintage Air is a couple hundred more but is a quite a bit more hi tech. The Classic Air is cable operated while VA has stepper motors to control the air doors. But then again, I prefer simple. The one downside of the Classic Air is that the defrost/heat/vent/AC control operates a single door that directs air between 2 sets of ducts, the defrost/heat and vent/AC ducts. So there is no separation possible between defrost and heat ports with their universal kit. Not a big deal to me since I'll most likely only use vent and AC.
The modification to the 2 lever heat/AC Olds controls was simple. I did change the AC request switch. Normally the unit only has AC when the air door is on full derfrost/heat or full vent.
Both companies were great to work with and substituted parts for my custom installs at no cost.
Bottom line for me was that the simpler Classic was probably going to be easier to modify and they offered the compressor bracket I needed (Kwik Performance) for half the regular price.
Vintage Air is a couple hundred more but is a quite a bit more hi tech. The Classic Air is cable operated while VA has stepper motors to control the air doors. But then again, I prefer simple. The one downside of the Classic Air is that the defrost/heat/vent/AC control operates a single door that directs air between 2 sets of ducts, the defrost/heat and vent/AC ducts. So there is no separation possible between defrost and heat ports with their universal kit. Not a big deal to me since I'll most likely only use vent and AC.
The modification to the 2 lever heat/AC Olds controls was simple. I did change the AC request switch. Normally the unit only has AC when the air door is on full derfrost/heat or full vent.
Both companies were great to work with and substituted parts for my custom installs at no cost.
Bottom line for me was that the simpler Classic was probably going to be easier to modify and they offered the compressor bracket I needed (Kwik Performance) for half the regular price.
January 2nd, 2011, 04:52 AM
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I've installed a Vintage Air before and this is my first Classic Air.
Vintage Air is a couple hundred more but is a quite a bit more hi tech. The Classic Air is cable operated while VA has stepper motors to control the air doors. But then again, I prefer simple. The one downside of the Classic Air is that the defrost/heat/vent/AC control operates a single door that directs air between 2 sets of ducts, the defrost/heat and vent/AC ducts. So there is no separation possible between defrost and heat ports with their universal kit. Not a big deal to me since I'll most likely only use vent and AC.
The modification to the 2 lever heat/AC Olds controls was simple. I did change the AC request switch. Normally the unit only has AC when the air door is on full derfrost/heat or full vent.
Both companies were great to work with and substituted parts for my custom installs at no cost.
Bottom line for me was that the simpler Classic was probably going to be easier to modify and they offered the compressor bracket I needed (Kwik Performance) for half the regular price.
Vintage Air is a couple hundred more but is a quite a bit more hi tech. The Classic Air is cable operated while VA has stepper motors to control the air doors. But then again, I prefer simple. The one downside of the Classic Air is that the defrost/heat/vent/AC control operates a single door that directs air between 2 sets of ducts, the defrost/heat and vent/AC ducts. So there is no separation possible between defrost and heat ports with their universal kit. Not a big deal to me since I'll most likely only use vent and AC.
The modification to the 2 lever heat/AC Olds controls was simple. I did change the AC request switch. Normally the unit only has AC when the air door is on full derfrost/heat or full vent.
Both companies were great to work with and substituted parts for my custom installs at no cost.
Bottom line for me was that the simpler Classic was probably going to be easier to modify and they offered the compressor bracket I needed (Kwik Performance) for half the regular price.
January 10th, 2011, 10:03 PM
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The old door panels were in pretty poor condition. And I really didn't want to spend money on new panels that I would probablt end up modifying. So I picked up a $50 4 x 8 sheet of pvc and started making my own this afternoon.
The plan is to reuse the armrest, hardware, and badges but update and simplify the looks.
I'll rivet/glue on a metal lip and the felts tomorrow, and add the chrismas tree fasteners..
DSCN0193.jpg
The plan is to reuse the armrest, hardware, and badges but update and simplify the looks.
I'll rivet/glue on a metal lip and the felts tomorrow, and add the chrismas tree fasteners..
DSCN0193.jpg
Last edited by garys 68; January 10th, 2011 at 10:07 PM.
