Rallye469

I think it’s time to start my ‘65 f-85 resto...
As you know there’s not a lot of OE support for these cars and the f-85 deluxe is probably the worst.

So I’ll probably be left with re-chroming as my only choice.
The bare-bones rear facia trim, tail lights, grill pieces, shorty hood spear(if I can find one) plus bumpers etc. will all need help.
How does it work to rechrome the pieces made of pot metal? They’re all pitted. Do THEY fix them or do I have to?

Any help, tips, vendors would help a lot!
Thanks!
-Pete

edzolz

Rechroming pot metal is expensive. If it is pitted, all of the corroded, pitted metal has to be removed, usually be hand. Then the pits are filled with another metal, either lead or copper, then nickel plate, then chrome. A long and expensive process especially if the part has lots of pits.

Rallye469

Thats what hood spears and tail light bezels are made of though in 65 right?

jcdynamic88

most of the trim on the 65 is potmetal except if you have the "H" trim or trim on the door posts .parts with the least pitting will be the best to start with,replating pitted potmetal is brutally expensive.it is worth finding parts that need replating with the least amount of pitting.final product is also better.the trim on the face of the front fenders is reproduced but that's it for trim.

joe_padavano

Fixing pits in pot metal is a time consuming and expensive process. Few shops do it correctly. They have to strip the part, grind out the corrosion in the pits, plate the part with copper, then hand fill each pit with solder. Once the pits are filled and sanded down, the part is replated with copper then the normal nickel and chrome. You can imagine how labor intensive this is. I've had pitted parts redone by Qual Krom in Erie, PA and can recommend them. They are NOT inexpensive. They can also repair broken pot metal parts - they did an amazing job on a friend's Jetfire emblems. Of course, pits in the textured tail panel are impossible to repair without destroying the texture. In all cases, it's financially to your advantage to find better or NOS pot metal parts than to pay to repair pitted ones. Unfortunately, sometimes that isn't an option.

Daiv8or

In order of preference IMO-

1. Nice NOS pieces. Pay whatever they want. It's worth it.
2. Quality reproductions. Pay whatever they want. It's worth it.
3. Quality re-chrome. Do not shop by price, shop by reputation and pay whatever they want, it's worth it.
4. Nice used original pieces. This is only in the number 4 position because most used pieces you find will be flawed, but obviously if you can find an excellent used piece, it goes up to number one. Again, pay whatever they want, it's worth it.

If you want your restoration to be something you're really proud of, brightwork is going to be one of your bigger expenses. If you're just going for a presentable driver that looks great at a distance, just search out good used parts.

One other point about used trim, sometimes you can find pretty decent trim that isn't really shiny anymore, or has fractures in the plating but isn't pitted. These can be worth buying because if you do decide to re-chrome them, they will be cheaper to do and ultimately turn out better than crusty pitted pieces. Again, all of this is just my opinion based on my experience.

I'm actually kind of surprised that in this day and age of 3D scanning and 3D printing that people aren't creating files to print hard to find trim for less popular models. Once the files are perfected, they could freely shared with others that need the same part. Once the part is printed in metal, the owner could do the finish sanding to get the part smooth and then send it out to plating. The finished part might be pricy though.

Koda

A 3D metal printer is near 100k for a capable model. A 3D image scanner, a good one, is also that expensive, or a full time CAD modeller will need to be paid close to that a year. That's 200k in the hole, right there. Plus, you would have to find absolutely baller originals, or you'd have to fix the 3d scan model (again time and money.)

Once all that is done, there is no way on earth any vendor would "freely share perfected files" because that is intellectual property and financial suicide.

I wouldn't invest in such a business as it is dependent on original parts, and it is in many people's best interests NOT to loan out good parts for templates because of possible theft, damage, and not doing so keeps their car more rare and thus valuable.

This is why Oldsmobile doesn't have many repro parts available, and this is also why businesses driven on idealism and the desire to provide a service fail.

joe_padavano

There are vendors today who will print a metallic part if you provide the 3D CAD model. Here is one.

The problem with printed parts is that the surface finish is rough like a cast part and would require a lot of hand finishing to look like a pot metal trim piece. This thread on AACA is interesting.

Daiv8or

I wasn't suggesting starting business doing this. 3-D printing is widely available and they don't care what you're printing. You don't have to buy the printer and they don't have to just print car trim, they print everything. I have used these services and it's all done online and pretty easy.

I have never paid to have somebody scan anything, so I am assuming the service is available. Maybe not. I admit that I don't know how good 3-D scanning technology is now. However I was watching Jay Leno's Garage the other day and he was going over the cars in his restoration shop right now and he was saying that they use 3-D scanning and printing now to make unobtainable parts for truly orphaned cars, so some people are doing it. Maybe the restriction now is the scanning, I don't know.

Daiv8or

Agreed on the roughness. The printed parts are nowhere near ready to plate. I was thinking that a way to save some money on the part, the owner/consumer could do all the grinding, sanding, polishing themselves. Just another project.

joe_padavano

I'd suggest working this with your preferred plating shop first. Most plating shops are reluctant to accept parts that have been worked like that by the owner, because, frankly, most people suck at that sort of thing and have no idea how perfect the parts need to be. The plating shop does not want to be arguing over who's responsible for a crappy finish.

Daiv8or

Good advise to consult with the plater first. Totally agree on getting their input on such a project.

Koda

I guess I misunderstood you then.

bry593

I've used Tri-City Chrome in Tennessee. This was for bumpers, but they did nice work and the price was reasonable. You might send them some high res pics and dimensions to get a ballpark estimate.

OLDSter Ralph

Good information !!!!!!!!!!!

Rallye469

Really appreciate the first hid experience guys. Thank you.

Daiv8or...this sounds like really good yet almost common sense...yet we all through common sense to the wind when it comes to getting a “deal”...which never turns out to be.
Pay for the level of detail you want. Makes sense to me. Thanks
-pete

edzolz

It all boils down to how much do you want to spend on a quality restoration? I was watching the Mecum last Thursday from Dallas. The first day of auction and the cars were going for very reasonable prices. Lots less than cost to restore them. Looks like that might be the best way to get into a nicely restored car.

joe_padavano

With only a handful of exceptions, it's ALWAYS cheaper to buy a car already done than to restore it yourself - ESPECIALLY if you have to pay someone to do the work. For some people, having the car done is what they want. For others, like myself, it's the journey. I tell people that I still build model cars, but now they are 1:1 scale. I'm not suggesting that one method is better or worse than the other, just different ways that people enjoy the hobby.

Charlie Jones

X2 Joe .
And this way you can build it exactly the way YOU want .

jcdynamic88

i may have some nice original side moldings i could part with but depending on where you are you likely can find decent parts.jc

Daiv8or

With some exceptions, it is almost always cheaper to buy a restored car then do you it yourself. Most restored cars can't ever recoup what you put into it much less the labor. If you pay somebody to restore a car, it's even worse. I have done a fair amount of restoration work when I was younger and like many, saw potential in rotting, derelict cars. Now I'm older and looking for a new car. There is no way I'm taking on another restoration. I'll gladly buy somebody else's finished, or nearly finished car.

Rallye469

My ‘70 has always been a rush job to getting running...make it fast...get it ready for the track...

With the ‘65, I want it to me exactly what Joe said- a 1:1 model kit. It’s a plain Jane f-85. Not a 442. But I just want it to be a beautiful cruiser that stands out and makes me happy. So...I’ll spend the money and do most of it myself.
I’ll never make a profit on this car.

Rallye469

Thanks SO much man! But it has zero side trim...barely any trim at all. Just a low option f-85
-pete

bry593

It is usually cheaper to buy one already restored. But, you won’t know how good of a restoration it is until you’ve spent some time with the car. At least if you do it yourself, you know exactly what you have.

Many restored cars won’t make a hundred mile trip without issues. Restored cars being flipped are rarely sorted. Another issue is aftermarket repop parts. A nice original driver is usually better than a shiny restored car made from Chinese reproductions.

My opinion of course and you know what they say about opinions.

That said, I prefer to restore clean drivers.

Gpc1

X2; I have enough experience fortunately to do most of the work myself. I fixed all rust, did what bodywork was needed,
painted the dash and interior, new dash pad glove box, etc. Had an upholstery shop install the original style seat coverings.
($500). Only other thing I paid someone else for was the body shop to shoot the color (single stage white) $750 for that plus I already bought the paint. Oh also a trip to the muffler shop to straighten out the exhaust system $250.
All mechanicals have been either rebuilt or replaced. Most expensive part for me was $3400 to have the original bumpers redone. Overall I have less than 10k into it. So it is possible to restore one on a budget if you can save in some key areas where others have paid thousands , paint and bodywork, engine rebuilding are good examples.

Daiv8or

This is the truth. You are so right. Unless there is serious documentation about a restoration, a buyer really has no idea what they're getting, but that's true of any used car.

Thankfully the vintage and collector car hobby is not one for financial gain, but rather personal enjoyment and accomplishment. Otherwise there would be no restored cars. The hobbyist, working mostly all by themselves, just for the love of it, are responsible vast bulk of surviving and restored cars we have now and most of the ones we'll have in the future.

jcdynamic88

this is a club coupe then?

Rallye469

Yes it is. Very few options at that.

jcdynamic88

i thought you referred to it as a f85 deluxe which usually has all the trim a cutlass does.the club coupe is the stripped model(usually) although you could option them with various trim.i am currently putting together a 65 442 club coupe,4 speed that came with quite a few options for a club coupe.

Rallye469

The emblem on the dash just says F-85...no “deluxe”...my bad.

joe_padavano

Yup, that's a base club coupe. Base steering wheel and no pot metal tail panel. Don't see these very often. Very cool.

Rallye469

Thanks Joe...
yeah. Something about this car just speaks to me. It’s just such an average 60’s car. It’s the epitome of everyday man automobile for that era.
I’ll toss all the silly gauges. Probably treat it to Steelies and center caps. Want to keep the bench and column shift.
Probably low 12’s, high 11’s with a GV overdrive for long cruises. Vintage air....
Formulating the big plan every day.
-Pete

joe_padavano

What it NEEDS is three-on-the-tree.

joe_padavano

Full disclosure on that last post. My dad bought a brand new 1965 F85 club coupe like this. It was our family's second car (mom had the 63 Super 88 Fiesta wagon). Same color blue but with a white painted top. V6, three-on-the-tree, and nothing else.

Rallye469

I love this color Joe. Bet yours with the white top was stunning.

Yeah. Not many options here aside from the V8 & radio.
I’m not really sure what WAS an option and what wasn’t actually...it does have back up lights.

Any way to figure out if it was offered? I know there’s a lot of things that could be deleted.
-pete

Daiv8or

AGREED!! That's what this car is all about.

Rallye469

As you can see...there’s not a lot of info here.
(BTW...those are 442Bro’s comments/deciphering not mine. I gave him this years ago for his data base)
Any way to figure out what other things this car came with?
-pete

JATA

Realistically, your not talking big bucks for the trim you have. Tail lights most expensive. Shorty hood spear and tail panel bars should be reasonable. I’m in the process of having one restored now. 1965 F85 Club Coupe. I would guess you could get decent rechromed on everything for 800 or so unless you are going high end show. Better cores cheaper the price as mentioned above. Pm me if you like...I probably have some upgrades for your tail light center bars.

Daiv8or

The only other way to know what the car had originally is if you get lucky and find the build sheet for it somewhere in the car. Often times people have found them under the rear seat. Sometimes they are still pretty legible and other times they are rotted by time and moisture. The build sheet and the body tag will tell you exactly how the car was put together. Sadly, build sheets from the '60s are rare.

Daiv8or

Agreed. The OP's car won't be that bad. It's already pretty naked. He should just be glad he's not working on this project-