griffey57

What does everyone think about the idiots here in California that voted on this

redoldsman

That they are idiots and I am glad I don't live in California. It is unfortunate that such a nice state has become what it is. I am sure this post will be closed because it is political which it is.

HighwayStar 442

After seeing what is going on in the world now. Supply chain issues and retirement of workers. Who know how to build things. EV will not be ready by 2035. This is a change in my thinking from a year ago.

Fun71

I saw on the news this morning that the electrical infrastructure in CA needs 10-15x improvement in order to handle that level of EVs. And it will take billions of dollars to enact those improvements.

matt69olds

Assuming nothing changes between now and then, California plans to outlaw the sale of new ICE cars in 2035. Considering the average age of a car is something like 15 years old, it’s safe to say gas powered cars and trucks will be on the road for at least another 25 or so years. Who knows what will happen then?

OLDSter Ralph

I think its 13 years away.

joe_padavano

1) Everyone seems to forget that CA passed a similar law mandating zero emission vehicles in 1990. That law required that by the year 2003, at least 10% of cars sold in CA had to be ZEVs. It was repealed shortly thereafter.
2) With the possible exception of the 2004-06 Ford GT, there hasn't been a new vehicle built this century that I have the remotest interest in owning.
3) The more EVs on the road, the more oil for the rest of us. Win-win.

fleming442

I like #3!

Bfg

Hopefully California will break off and drift into the ocean soon!

Ap6954

I think that zero in 2035 is an unrealistic, pie in the sky campaign slogan. Zero fossil fuel vehicles in 50 yrs I think is still unrealistic. Will there be less in 2035? I think so. But it will take generations to build the technology and systems to support eliminating fossil fueled vehicles. I think those unrealistic goals are thrown out there to get people talking about it which it did.

lshlsh2

They will not be able to pull it off. The electricity is not there, especially when you consider the rivers behind the dams that produce it are drying up. Then you will have all the eco-warriors that wont let them build the electric plants to keep everything going. Even if they did it would take 20 years for permits and studies before they could build one new plant. my .02

442Harv

I live in Cal. I have seen many things that probably won't work, or is not reasonable to do, but the people vote for it anyway, and the government makes laws,that make no sense, but they don't care what problems they cause. Like the Bullet Train, they just trough more money at it, and will probably never work like they think it should. If it was not for grand kids, I think I could leave, not sure where I would go? I grew up in S Dak, like they way of life there, but I don't think I could go back to the winter weather.

Supernice88

I read that it said no more gas powered vehicles will be "sold" by 2035.

briane

New York State and especially New York City doesn't want to be upstaged by California. So all new residential and commercial buildings will shortly need to be powered by electric energy:
The new law sets restrictions on fossil fuel usage in newly constructed residential and commercial buildings by phasing in strict emissions limits beginning in 2023, bringing immediate climate and health benefits to New Yorkers at launch. The benefits exponentially increase as more buildings are covered by the law and as the grid gets cleaner in line with the City’s existing commitment to 100% clean electricity. Buildings of all sizes must be constructed fully electric by 2027.

joe_padavano

You are correct. People that think this is a ban on all ICE vehicles apparently need to practice their reading comprehension.

bw1339

As far as #3 goes.... Who thinks there won't be all kinds of obstacles added every year to those owning ICE non self-driving vehicles? Every cost will be artificially increased and everything will be made more difficult. There will be no need to ban them, because most people will be forced to give them up.

We will not be left alone.

442Harv

That is also why some of these law are a problem. I have seen some laws in order, and a few years later, they come anlong and say things like, after looking at the problem, we are not meeting are goals, so the change the law, like they did on smpg checks on diesel trucks. They said they were exempt, than a couple years later, they said we are not meeting our goals, so than they include diesels. No stopping them.

bw1339

These mandates are pie in the sky fantasies, since there are many mind boggling problems that they are very unlikely to resolved by then.

The problem (one of many) is that with such mandates in the horizon, who in his right mind is going to invest in fossil fuel exploration, infrastructure and new technologies? These industries are being condemned to death.

Cosmic Charlie

Currently, Massachusetts and California are only requiring that new vehicles sold by 2035 be electric. Used car sales of gasoline-powered vehicles will still be allowed.

LOL and maybe the gasoline will only be $20 a gallon then and minimum wage will be $40 +-

Of the Earth's 29,000 coal fired power plants, 1500 emit 75% of earth's airborne carbon. Those 1500 are what me need to address. In North America, renewables only represent about 18% of energy. We have nothing to replace oil and gas.

Koda

The reason for the heavy handed laws is that the technology is not there. If the technology were there, in terms of "there" being competitive in terms of cost and performance, then the technology would be not only adapted, but eagerly pushed by the people who want it. Laws mandating its use would be unnecessary. People of my profession and education tend to be on the more conservative side of things, as we are more grounded in reality. Too many people operate under a state of weaponized ignorance. I don't blame them, because it's nice to dream about how things could be. However, you can't make laws based on how things could be; you have to make laws based on how they are. This is why my employer is making strides in producing BEVs, but is keeping all cards on the table for if/when it doesn't work out.

The very first thing to do to have electric vehicles is to make the power grid robust. This means trillions of dollars into infrastructure and power generation. The only non-polluting power of that reliability and scope is properly done nuclear, and I've studied power gen. We can't do what is currently wanted without that first step. People who disagree with this basic fact are not only wrong, but dangerously uninformed.

PatL

One parr of this whole electric vehicle issue that does not seem to get much press is how road maintenance and construction going to get paid for ? At Federal level (Interstates, etc) it comes out of the 18 cents/gallon fuel tax. Pretty much the same, but at a higher level for states and cities. In essence a user tax, that electric vehicles are getting a free pass on. That will have to be replaced, and if they cannot an easy was to have an ongoing tax on electric vehicles is that they will go the easy route, income and sales taxes.

fleming442

How are the reservoirs and rivers drying up if the polar caps are melting?

Cosmic Charlie

Former Green Peace co-founder & ex-president Patrick Albert Moore outright said that Schwab's climate change is a fraud agenda !
He may not be THE Expert but it's an interesting watch - maybe food for thought (?) and "some " valid points +- (?) (I don't really know) One thing for sure is his thoughts are not within the beliefs of the majority of Americans

You Tube

HighwayStar 442

Albert Moore has earned his living since the early 1990s primarily by consulting for, and publicly speaking for, a wide variety of corporations and lobby groups such as the Nuclear Energy Institute.

Moore's business relations with "polluters and clear-cutters" through his consultancy. Monte Hummel, president of the World Wildlife Fund Canada, has claimed that Moore's book Pacific Spirit is a collection of "pseudoscience and dubious assumptions".

bw1339

Bjorn Lomborg is an old school enviromentalist who believes in man-made climate change, who says that humans trying to drastically de-industrialize to try to affect the climate is folly, that we should give mosquito nets to third world nations and that other much cheaper measures would be much better in alleviating human suffering. Oh, and that we should build lots of nuclear powerplants.

Both Lomborg and Moore have been summarily excommunicated from the environmentalist movement.

Fun71

Quoting this as I think it addresses the very heart of the matter.

bw1339

If the man believes nuclear power is good, why wouldn't he advertise it? He can make a heck of a lot more money on the orthodox green bandwagon saying nuclear is evil.

HighwayStar 442

More money in not cleaning up pollutants, your industry made. Nuclear is what it is. Put one in your neighborhood! Or out in the western desert with no water around or below ground.

Fun71

Yeah, who would do that?

https://www.paloverde.com/

HighwayStar 442

Sounds Great! Put one in your neighborhood!

The facility evaporates water from the treated sewage of several nearby municipalities to meet its cooling needs. Up to 26 billion US gallons (~100,000,000 m³) of treated water are evaporated each year. So it must be near a city. AZ is running out of water.

To address safety concerns, 58 nuclear sirens were installed within a 10-mile radius of the plant. This area is known to locals as the EPZ (Emergency Planning Zone). The sirens will wail periodically in the event of any nuclear emergency.

Fun71

Well obviously you haven’t looked at the location near my name.

In over 20 years here I haven’t heard of one person who has an issue with it. You seem to have doubts but since you’re not a local that doesn’t count.

bw1339

There is one not far from where I live and I lose no sleep over it.

HighwayStar 442

Good for you guys!

rocketraider

Koda has said it best. "Weaponized ignorance" Love it!😺

I don't get peoples' willful ignorance of reality when coming up with their save the world schemes. I don't get their self-flagellation and guilt over benefiting from progress made since the Industrial Revolution either. When they're willing to return to pre-industrialized society I'll be willing to take them seriously.

What's going to be fun to watch is when the governor of California and the Governor of the Commonwealth of Virginia throw their hats in the next presidential race. You can bet this will be one of their big campaign issues as Youngkin issued a statement on this today. Pepsi and popcorn anyone?

bw1339

I like to make energy decisions based on data, not sentiment.

HighwayStar 442

Three mile island, Chernobyl, Fukushima, Kyshtym, Windscale. Some data for you. Just five, many, many more. And the cost of the accidents? Fukushima just keeps giving. Even to the massive ocean.

I lived in St George, UT. last year. Almost no rain, water and fires. You guys need to be more concerned about drinking water!

Fun71

Yeah, I agree. I'm not worried about a tsunami taking out the Arizona nuclear plant.

HighwayStar 442

Three mile island, Chernobyl? And so many others?

nsnarsk65cutlass

It will become like Cuba,do whatever it takes to keep em running.

Oldzskool

California is using it all.