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1st - thanks for letting me join. 2nd - I am assisting a neighbor and have fallen in love with the car. Long story short - I’m a car guy (GM is my one and only) my neighbor Gary was also a car guy. He liked them all, Porsche, etc. His last project was a 1970 Cutlass Supreme convertible with a 455 and automatic. Sadly he found out late last year he had cancer and he passed early this year. His wife has been working through the different cars, motor home, etc. This 70 Olds just finally got back from the shop after having a new top installed. She is looking to sell this car as nobody in the family shares the love that Gary had. Anyways, i am a Chevelle guy, so I know values there, I would like to see if you can help me put a value on this car so she can get an appropriate price for it. I don’t want her getting taken advantage of. I have decoded the VIN to be the 70 Cutlass convertible made in Fremont, CA. Looking over the trim tag - the paint code is shown as — and the top code is A for a white top. The code stamped on the front of the 455 is 396021F which is in the right range. How can I tell if the engine is numbers matching to the car? Same for the transmission. The car was repainted last Fall in orange and the top is black, the car was not frame off restored either. What else should I be looking for to help get her a value? Thanks for any help y’all can give me.
Frank
Last edited by frankf72malibu; June 6th, 2020 at 05:34 PM.
Reason: Predictive text on an IPad....
Location of the car . A lot of pictures. List of all known maintenance. History. Title status. All listed items are necessary for a value. Good luck in sale. Bless you ,for your help to the widow.
The vin will tell you if the car is a big block car. The block has an engine vin stamp pad at the drivers front. Its probably hard to see w the alternator inthe way (assuming an ac car)
The vin will tell you if the car is a big block car.)
No it wont, no engine ID until 1972.
The partial VIN is located on the drivers side of the block, below the number one cylinder. The power steering bracket may be in the way(not the altenator)
The trans VIN is on the Drivers side, above the trans pan, behind the shift linkage. The trans ID taf should be on the passenger side towards the rear of the trans.
Thanks for the replies. Will be out of pocket today, but will get pictures, and look at the engine and trans data. I can tell you that it drives and shifts like butter!
The vin will tell you if the car is a big block car. The block has an engine vin stamp pad at the drivers front. Its probably hard to see w the alternator inthe way (assuming an ac car)
A 1970 VIN won't tell you what engine was in the car. A VIN derivative on the block WILL tell you if that block is original to the car.
Quick update - my neighbor is in Oklahoma with her grandkids. I have attached a few of the pictures I had previously taken. The car is located in Richardson Texas (Dallas). It has a clear Texas title. Here you go and give me a day or two and I will get more pictures and any additional information she has.
Last edited by frankf72malibu; June 25th, 2020 at 03:50 PM.
Reason: removed VIN picture
Ok, you have a Cutlass Supreme Convertible, as opposed to a 442 convertible, from 1970. Special point code which will not be that extremely bright red on there now and A for white top I think, not black that is on there.
The picture you posted of the engine casting code, which identifies it as "a" 455. All engines from that series have that code. The stamping, as in letters hit in with a hammer, is found via one of the above posts, but, I am fairly certain the engine is not original as a 455 could not come in a Cutlass Supreme that year, being locked to performance models like 442.
You have a nice condition Cutlass Supreme convertible painted Resale Red with a hot rod engine and faked 442 badges. I would need many more pictures to appraise, but I think that a $15k car.
You have a nice condition Cutlass Supreme convertible painted Resale Red with a hot rod engine and faked 442 badges. I would need many more pictures to appraise, but I think that's a $15k car.
Accurate, but could be put a little more diplomatically. OP is just trying to help out a widow and has made no claim that the car is a 4-4-2, nor has he shown indication of any plan to pass it off as such.
Just to clarify - it is actually orange. The picture makes it look red. My neighbors husband wanted the 442 hood and badges. There is no deception or passing it off as a 442. He planned on driving this car for as long as he could. Due to his passing his wife has moved to selling the car. I believe it is a Cutlass SX which did come with a 455. Anyways, I will be able to take more pictures and verify that in the next couple of days.
Accurate, but could be put a little more diplomatically. OP is just trying to help out a widow and has made no claim that the car is a 4-4-2, nor has he shown indication of any plan to pass it off as such.
I think you are out of line with this statement. I made no implication that the OP was doing that.
To clarify, by fake badges, I meant badges that were put on by the previous owner, as in, not real.
Frank, SX cars are rare, and usually 2 barrel, so the odds of a 4 barrel 455 being the original engine are slim. VIN stamp will tell the tale. Good luck.
I think you are out of line with this statement. I made no implication that the OP was doing that.
To clarify, by fake badges, I meant badges that were put on by the previous owner, as in, not real.
Frank, SX cars are rare, and usually 2 barrel, so the odds of a 4 barrel 455 being the original engine are slim. VIN stamp will tell the tale. Good luck.
Thanks Koda, will post more pictures and motor and trans vin info as soon as I can.
I think you are out of line with this statement. I made no implication that the OP was doing that.
To clarify, by fake badges, I meant badges that were put on by the previous owner, as in, not real.
My apologies. Normally I agree with your stance on clones, tributes and fakes, but I just thought your tone was a little confrontational. In retrospect, I'm sure I misinterpreted.
Frank, that's a nice looking car. Pre-COVID I would have said $20K, easy, but these days it's harder to say. I agree that it wouldn't hurt to dangle your toes in the water by posting a few more (detailed) pictures here and gauging the response.
Last edited by BangScreech4-4-2; June 10th, 2020 at 08:50 AM.
OK gentlemen, my boy had to do some contortionist moves and a little sandpaper but the motor vin derivative is a match. Does that make it the SX model? Liz shared that prior to Gary getting the car that the transmission was replaced. I could not find the vin derivative or the tag so not sure if the original was rebuilt or swapped. We also figured out it is a power top and has power windows as well. The color is rally red, sure looked orange to me. The frame and floor are in great shape. The interior is clean as well. Liz insisted we take it for a spin. Dang! Love that car. See pictures below and give me ideas on a realistic price. Liz and I talked, and if the car is worth less than she wants to get for it then it will stay in her family. Not sure what that number is but I want to give her a realistic number. Thanks for your help. If you knew Gary, shoot me a PM. He was an awesome guy and the best neighbor. And Liz is amazing and I would love to be able to share some car stories about Gary with her.
My apologies. Normally I agree with your stance on clones, tributes and fakes, but I just thought your tone was a little confrontational. In retrospect, I'm sure I misinterpreted.
Appreciated. I should have said "not original" as opposed to "fake."
Frank could you share the VIN? If you don't wish to, you can avoid the last six, as they are a serial, but, if you include the first six, we can tell what engine it had. If it's 3J67U2 etc, then it's a stock 455 equipped Cutlass Supreme.
Appreciated. I should have said "not original" as opposed to "fake."
Frank could you share the VIN? If you don't wish to, you can avoid the last six, as they are a serial, but, if you include the first six, we can tell what engine it had. If it's 3J67U2 etc, then it's a stock 455 equipped Cutlass Supreme.
Koda,
1st set of pictures I posted has the VIN. Putt for a walk with my wife so forgive any fat finger typos!
Nice vert!
Rally red is more orange than red. - - equals optional paint code color. Rally Red being one of them.
The vin stamping on the trans will be just above the pan rail where the shift cable bracket bolts to the pan.
The tag on the passenger side won't have the vin. It indicates other things though for a particular model. Can that tag be read?
Nice vert!
Rally red is more orange than red. - - equals optional paint code color. Rally Red being one of them.
The vin stamping on the trans will be just above the pan rail where the shift cable bracket bolts to the pan.
The tag on the passenger side won't have the vin. It indicates other things though for a particular model. Can that tag be read?
Bring that car up to the rust belt and add another 10K to the asking price.
That is what we refer to as a dry car.
i looked at the trans and could not find a stamping, even used my bore scope camera. And there is no tag. Liz remembers her late husband sharing the trans was replaced.
Doing some research and found that Gary stated the car is an SX. Not sure if he had found the sheet or not. And also found that the 4 barrel is original. I reached out to SX455 president and waiting to hear back if he has the car in their registry. What would that do to the suggested $15K to $20K pricing shared above? I just want to make sure that my neighbor gets a realistic price range so she can decide to either sell it or pass it along to someone in the family. Thanks for everyone’s help!
That is a clean example of a 50 yr old car, for that reason I'd say 18-22k is a fair price? There are a number of things we could pick apart as to its pedigree regardless. Not sure if SX docs would do much to affect price at this point?
It won't do much. Maybe 10%. SX is unknown and uncared about outside of Olds communities, and it doesn't help that it seems that over half of the Supremes for sale these days are SX's when it was like a 10% option. Sort of like the w-25 hood.
It won't do much. Maybe 10%. SX is unknown and uncared about outside of Olds communities, and it doesn't help that it seems that over half of the Supremes for sale these days are SX's when it was like a 10% option. Sort of like the w-25 hood.
Just a quick update and a big thanks to everyone. My neighbor is going to find a family member to take the car. I think in the end it is best as the car represents what Gary wanted and that his love of cars hopefully gets passed along and keeps his passion and the memories alive. Thanks again everyone. Much appreciated being able to help my neighbor and you all made that possible.
that car is worth high teens or 20k imo. i too have a 70 convert w30 clone that was born a lowly 3426 car lol. i had a real 70 442 convertible in the late 70s. but would need a home equity loan to buy (or second mortgage) to buy the same thing now. so i found this car locally and it does have it share of real 442 parts,a 455, og turbo 400 a factory w 25 hood, aluminum winters w30 intake and original red fenderwells. that being said,i call it a cutlass and have never tried to pass it off as anything more than what it is. this car i can drive and not have to worry about wear and tear on a collectible or how much mileage i put on it . btw, the absolutely gorgeous 70 w30 that graces the cover of your annual OPGI catalog (black with gold stripes) is a replica and was born a cutlass supreme.i would hold out for at least twenty for your car,it looks well worth it. best of luck. ......just noticed that the car is staying in the family. Congratulations to all
Last edited by Achcoastal; August 7th, 2020 at 05:12 PM.
Reason: Update
June 6th, 2020, 05:31 PM
