Carb choice for mild 455 build - street driven

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Old Nov 12, 2017 | 09:10 AM
  #1  
VinMichael's Avatar
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Carb choice for mild 455 build - street driven

Build:
60 over
stock replacement shallow dish pistons
stock GA big valve heads
headers
2500 stall
3.73 gears
cam Erson Hi Flow 1, 228/228@.050 with .504 lift on both
ebay China HEI
performer intake
stock mechanical fuel pump

would an 870 Street Avenger be too much? I ask because I can get one that’s practically new for $250.00.

Last edited by VinMichael; Nov 12, 2017 at 09:12 AM.
Old Nov 12, 2017 | 01:51 PM
  #2  
BangScreech4-4-2's Avatar
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I had a 670 CFM Street Avenger on a SBC Camaro and it was a great carburetor. Ran great right out of the box and if that wasn't enough, it was just about infinitely fine-tunable. Very crisp and linear throttle response -- better than EFI! Your build sounds like it could probably handle 870 CFM.

Last edited by BangScreech4-4-2; Nov 12, 2017 at 01:54 PM.
Old Nov 12, 2017 | 02:53 PM
  #3  
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Originally Posted by '69442ragtop
Very crisp and linear throttle response -- better than EFI!.
Then you had a lousy Efi. 870 is fine but buy a wideband and tune it the right way.
Old Nov 12, 2017 | 04:02 PM
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Originally Posted by cutlassefi
Then you had a lousy Efi. 870 is fine but buy a wideband and tune it the right way.
Okay, maybe not better, but pretty damn good.
Old Nov 12, 2017 | 08:02 PM
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a properly calibrated quadrajet, period.

bill
Old Nov 12, 2017 | 08:20 PM
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Firewalker's Avatar
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Originally Posted by VinMichael
Build:
60 over
stock replacement shallow dish pistons
stock GA big valve heads
headers
2500 stall
3.73 gears
cam Erson Hi Flow 1, 228/228@.050 with .504 lift on both
ebay China HEI
performer intake
stock mechanical fuel pump

would an 870 Street Avenger be too much? I ask because I can get one that’s practically new for $250.00.
You may not need that much carb, but thats not the same thing as being too much, and at the same time if it doesn't make you happy then you can probably sell it easy and get your money back. But would advise to get it get looked over first by a friend of yours that knows something and check the number on it to make sure it is what it is claimed.
Old Nov 12, 2017 | 09:09 PM
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Seller said carb came with 78 jets and a 4.5” PV in the primary and 82 jets and a 3.5” PV in the secondary
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 10:41 AM
  #8  
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Get a properly rebuilt Q-jet, one that is calibrated for your application
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 11:36 AM
  #9  
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picked up the Street Avenger 870. Almost looks new.

A lot of people talk up the Q jets. one day I’d like to try one but for now I need something to bolt on a go.
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 11:51 AM
  #10  
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Originally Posted by VinMichael
picked up the Street Avenger 870. Almost looks new.

A lot of people talk up the Q jets. one day I’d like to try one but for now I need something to bolt on a go.
This would be probably hard to beat for bolt on and go https://www.ebay.com/itm/Factory-Ref...-/361537275602
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 12:53 PM
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Question, why do you all think a lot of these carburetors are bolt on and go? As good as the Quick Fuel stuff is that I use, I normally have to make a jet and or air bleed change to make the fuel curves correct. And those are much higher dollar carburetors than what you guys are talking about here. I'm thoroughly confused how people can say that most of these, if not all, are bolt on and go.
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 01:01 PM
  #12  
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Originally Posted by cutlassefi
Question, why do you all think a lot of these carburetors are bolt on and go? As good as the Quick Fuel stuff is that I use, I normally have to make a jet and or air bleed change to make the fuel curves correct. And those are much higher dollar carburetors than what you guys are talking about here. I'm thoroughly confused how people can say that most of these, if not all, are bolt on and go.
Do you call fine tuning them, to be the same as bolt on and go is my question??? Or did you just confuse apples and oranges??
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 01:14 PM
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It's always a good practice to disassemble a new carb and verify jetting, cleanliness and proper gaskets. Mass produced anything is subject to mistakes. Good luck with your project.
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 01:19 PM
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Originally Posted by shiftbyear
It's always a good practice to disassemble a new carb and verify jetting, cleanliness and proper gaskets. Mass produced anything is subject to mistakes. Good luck with your project.
Don't trust but verify and learn. I try to learn first, as much as possible before verifying by reading and looking at videos and pictures, and then try and verify. It can be a good lifetime approach and investment.
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 01:27 PM
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Originally Posted by cutlassefi
Question, why do you all think a lot of these carburetors are bolt on and go? As good as the Quick Fuel stuff is that I use, I normally have to make a jet and or air bleed change to make the fuel curves correct. And those are much higher dollar carburetors than what you guys are talking about here. I'm thoroughly confused how people can say that most of these, if not all, are bolt on and go.
What I meant by bolt on and go is get the engine started to break in the cam, and get the timing and carb in the ballpark until I am ready to get serious about tuning the car. Which will involve a wideband o2 sensor.
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 01:41 PM
  #16  
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Originally Posted by VinMichael
What I meant by bolt on and go is get the engine started to break in the cam, and get the timing and carb in the ballpark until I am ready to get serious about tuning the car. Which will involve a wideband o2 sensor.
Thought thats what ya meant, or something quickly drivable. But what ever you choose you probably need to use a current running carb, if available. Or a new carb after you tear it down to make sure it is clean inside and the floats are set right. On breaking in the cam if you have any troubles shut the process down fast, and then restart once fixed. The 20-30 minute breakin time doesn't have to be all on the first go, without a shutdown. The latest recommendations in fact advise 10 minutes and let it cool down and then another 10 minute segment I recently learned. Once started and rpms sets check timing first and get it in the ballpark. Watch oil and water temps and set a timer.
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 01:50 PM
  #17  
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Originally Posted by Firewalker
Thought thats what ya meant, or something quickly drivable. But what ever you choose you probably need to use a current running carb, if available. Or a new carb after you tear it down to make sure it is clean inside and the floats are set right. On breaking in the cam if you have any troubles shut the process down fast, and then restart once fixed. The 20-30 minute breakin time doesn't have to be all on the first go, without a shutdown. The latest recommendations in fact advise 10 minutes and let it cool down and then another 10 minute segment I recently learned. Once started and rpms sets check timing first and get it in the ballpark. Watch oil and water temps and set a timer.
I can can use the Edelbrock 600 that I ran for years on my 350 for the cam break in. The trouble is I sold my stock HEI distributor with my 350. So unfortunately whichever distributor I receive I won’t be confident that it will fire right up.
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 02:45 PM
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Originally Posted by VinMichael
I can can use the Edelbrock 600 that I ran for years on my 350 for the cam break in. The trouble is I sold my stock HEI distributor with my 350. So unfortunately whichever distributor I receive I won’t be confident that it will fire right up.
Old carbs can stick on the floats so at least turn it over in in you hands a few times to hear both floats are free, and not sticking. An electric to pump gas in it before firing it is a good idea to make sure no drips while the pump is turned on. And make sure the shooters both squirt fine still. You can install a distributer and put the engine by turning by hand to 15 degrees or so advance. Then with power only to the ignition see which spark plug spark by rotating the distributer cap counterclockwise slowly. The sparkplug that snaps is number one (the way you have your distributer sitting) and the timing should be about 14 advanced when lock down. But a fast double check once started is always smart.
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 03:23 PM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by Firewalker
Old carbs can stick on the floats so at least turn it over in in you hands a few times to hear both floats are free, and not sticking. An electric to pump gas in it before firing it is a good idea to make sure no drips while the pump is turned on. And make sure the shooters both squirt fine still. You can install a distributer and put the engine by turning by hand to 15 degrees or so advance. Then with power only to the ignition see which spark plug spark by rotating the distributer cap counterclockwise slowly. The sparkplug that snaps is number one (the way you have your distributer sitting) and the timing should be about 14 advanced when lock down. But a fast double check once started is always smart.
Do you mean set the timing marks on the balancer pointing to 15 degrees BTDC, then rotate distributor counterclockwise until plug #1 fires. By the time I lock it down after I see a spark I will have ignition advance at around 14 degrees BTDC.
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 03:36 PM
  #20  
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EFI, all day.
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 03:37 PM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by VinMichael
Do you mean set the timing marks on the balancer pointing to 15 degrees BTDC, then rotate distributor counterclockwise until plug #1 fires. By the time I lock it down after I see a spark I will have ignition advance at around 14 degrees BTDC.
Pretty much and you can do this before the carb. The timing will move some, as you tighten it down but you should be in the ballpark. Anyone with a better way lets hear it now LOL
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 03:59 PM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by Firewalker
Do you call fine tuning them, to be the same as bolt on and go is my question??? Or did you just confuse apples and oranges??
You can bolt just about 4150 flange style carb on just about anything. So you would potentially bolt on a carb that could be running dangerously lean, especially during break-in. Really?
You're right, apples and oranges.

Last edited by cutlassefi; Nov 15, 2017 at 04:32 PM.
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 04:05 PM
  #23  
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I haven't seen a Holley type carb yet that is bolt on and go. I'm not down on Holleys at all but they all need to be tweaked.
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 04:37 PM
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Wink

Originally Posted by cutlassefi
You can bolt just about 4150 flanged carb on just about anything. So you would potentially bolt on a carb that could be running dangerously lean, especially during break-in. Really?
You're right, apples and oranges.
Take the engine to BTR for breakin on his dyno, if you want it done right
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 04:44 PM
  #25  
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My point is don't take anything for granted.
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 04:55 PM
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Originally Posted by cutlassefi
My point is don't take anything for granted.
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 05:53 PM
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Regardless, VinMichael, let us know how it works out. As I said above, I was pretty happy with mine.
Old Nov 15, 2017 | 08:49 PM
  #28  
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Originally Posted by BILL DEMMER
a properly calibrated quadrajet, period.

bill
X2 what Bill said
Old Nov 16, 2017 | 10:09 AM
  #29  
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Thanks. Hopefully I will be circling back with results sooner rather than later.
Old Nov 16, 2017 | 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by VinMichael
Thanks. Hopefully I will be circling back with results sooner rather than later.
Old May 8, 2018 | 05:46 PM
  #31  
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Alright, finally have this engine together and it’s down to getting it running. I ended up using ProComp heads with 1.65 rockers and will be using an OEM HEI. The converter is a TCI breakaway 2400-2600 stall.

My question how do I setup my 870 street avenger? It’s practically new but I’m going to take it apart and make a baseline for tuning. Also, what spark plugs/wires should I choose, and is there any type of kit I should consider buying for the HEI? I’m going to run an MSD Street Fire ignition box. Is there a certain mechanical fuel pump to buy with my aluminum heads?

compression ratio is around 9.8:1

Last edited by VinMichael; May 8, 2018 at 05:51 PM.
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