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I've recently added vintage air to my 72 cutlass. It has a 455 nothing high performance at all. I drove it for the first time yesterday. When I pulled up the driveway I started smelling antifreeze, opened the hood and I have a pen hole leak. I was told that I needed to install an aluminum radiator because they cool better than the originals. The guy also stated it's to much pressure on the on the brass/copper one that I have now. Is this true?
Yes a big two core aluminum rad or a 4 core aluminum if your car is so equipped will out cool your 40+ year old rad. I have been using 7 psi caps in a few of my older vehicles due to leaks, it slows or stops them completely with stop leak. The aluminum rads can leak as well, especially certain brands. My 88 has a leaky 2 core aluminum that is leaking between the fins. Basically unfixable, a couple of bottles of stop leak with a 7 psi cap stopped the leak. Now it barely cools a 260, it cooled really well before the stop leak. Where is it leaking? If it is the factory rad and a local shop can recore it, that is a option as well. My 70S has the factory rad recored but it has seepage near the passenger tank. I cleaned it out with acid to maximize cooling since it is a two core. Why the previous didn't upgrade and add a 3 core at that time is beyond me since the tanks are the same. Mine is getting replaced with the Champion 2 core with 1" cores since mine is a factory 2 core. They also have a 4 core which a huge rad that should fit where a factory 4 core was. The Champion rads have few if any leaking issues.
Last edited by olds 307 and 403; March 31st, 2018 at 06:08 AM.
This has been a debate throughout the years. Cap a Radiator in Farmingdale Long Island, NY has something on there website about this and they say there is no difference in cooling. My personal experience is I installed a 2 core Al radiator which is the same size as the 4 core Cu in my 71 Cutlass Supreme with a 455 when I did the engine swap. I run a 180 thermostat and the car never seems to run above 170 averaging about 160. I ordered mine through Pep Boys because I read on a thread here they had Cu rads for sale. When it came it was Al. Some guys sent them back, I waited to long and wound up using mine. It was under $200 and fit like the original, once I installed the 4 core brackets on the lower part of the supports. I used the top plate from my 442 but will eventually need to get another when I start to put that car back together. The repro Cu rads are in the $5-700 range so it didn't pay. As for the AC I haven't restored mine yet but my guess would be there shouldn't be any issues.
Fusick sells the 4 core lower brackets and the top plate. I drilled mine out and mig welded the new ones in from the bottom through the drilled holes.
kbdecatur, unless he is referring to your radiator specifically, it is BS too much pressure on a Brass/Copper rad. Aluminum radiators generally radiate heat better, but a copper core rad still gets the job done if the cores are not all corroded.
GM used literally millions of these radiators back then, if they did not do the job, they would have made appropriate changes.
You can get yours checked and possibly repaired by a radiator shop, or you could get a replacement aluminum. There are many brands and some work better than others. Yes the aluminum is more efficient than the older brass/copper so you can get away with a 2 or 3 core. The brass/copper radiators were designed to withstand those pressures, I don't understand what your "guy" is talking about unless he's referring specifically to the condition of yours.
kbdecatur:
I have a brand new Champion 3-row aluminum radiator for sale if you decide to go that direction. Long story, but I ended up with 2 of these radiators and only need one. Here's a pic and a link to my for sale thread.
Thanks for all of your input guys. Yesterday I took the radiator to the shop. Found out I had 2 leaks. The leaks we're fixed, I put it back in the car got it back running and I forgot to tighten up the top hose tightly. When it reached 180 the electric fan kicked on the top hose blew off. I took it for a drive and it gets to hot while idling. I have a 'be cool' electric fan it's a PULL fan. I'm wondering should I have gotten a PUSH fan instead. I went to summit and purchased a radiator part number 384000. It's a 3 row aluminum radiator. Their house brand. Has anyone used this before?
Last edited by kbdecatur; April 1st, 2018 at 04:14 AM.
It's my experience, and your mileage may vary, that repairing leaking radiators is just a matter of delaying the inevitable.....
Far as the radiators go.....I just put an American Eagle 2 row (dual 1" tubes) in my 71 (455 w/factory AC) and so far so good. No having to bend/replace cradles......if you are going copper, pony up for the 4 row. Over here in Charleston, 3 row copper radiator during the summer with the AC blasting...the cooling system just can't shed the heat fast enough. Now, we haven't had any hot weather yet but so far the aluminum radiator has worked quite well.
The important thing isn't so much the material the radiator is made of but it's cooling capacity as determined by fin count/density and the size of the tubes. More fins and bigger tubes equal greater heat exchange capacity.
I don't think the fans are the issue......
Of course, this is all academic if the hoses are not secured tightly.
Well, material DOES matter. Thermal conductivity is a material property meaning ability to transfer heat. Copper is a superior material for heat transfer, but is structurally less strong than aluminum. Thus aluminum can be (now) made into a better shape and provide better cooling despite the material having less conductivity.
In other words, old radiators are better off with copper, and new radiators, of new design, are better off being aluminum. Paint hurts heat transfer. If you must paint it, don't put many coats on it.
Thanks for all of your input guys. Yesterday I took the radiator to the shop. Found out I had 2 leaks. The leaks we're fixed, I put it back in the car got it back running and I forgot to tighten up the top hose tightly. When it reached 180 the electric fan kicked on the top hose blew off. I took it for a drive and it gets to hot while idling. I have a 'be cool' electric fan it's a PULL fan. I'm wondering should I have gotten a PUSH fan instead. I went to summit and purchased a radiator part number 384000. It's a 3 row aluminum radiator. Their house brand. Has anyone used this before?
The Summit rads have good reviews, I believe they are Northern radiator's. After having a Champion 3 row in my G body, I would never go 3 core again, was marginal with my 403, 195 to 215, 230 towing in heat. The 2 core with 1" tubes that started leaking, out cooled it. In an A body with the larger width rad than a 3 core will probably be fine. I plan on going with the Champion 2 core, I don't even see the 3 and 4 core as options anymore, just the 2 core and 2 core with 1" tubes. Puller fans are what you want. How many amps are their fans rated for? The Derale fans pull nearly 50 amps and my Dodge Stratus fans, a lot as well, 40 amp relays don't seem to last worth a dam.
Last edited by olds 307 and 403; April 1st, 2018 at 09:43 AM.
I didn't mean to imply that material is irrelevant.....of course copper has better thermal conductivity, I'm just saying that there is more to the equation than just materials....
March 31st, 2018, 04:05 AM
