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I got my VTP tooth puller, common yank the brand name out of you azz. This is the third time I ask you. Don't make me track you down with my Best Detective.😂
Location: Colorado Springs Colorado/Thousand Oaks Ca
Posts: 1,721
Originally Posted by wr1970
I got my VTP tooth puller, common yank the brand name out of you azz. This is the third time I ask you. Don't make me track you down with my Best Detective.😂
A friend of mine bought those headers on Ebay a few years back so we could dyno Oldsmobiles, they cost 200.00 at the time, don't know the name though, look on Ebay. In the mean time forget about the detective, just tell me which track your racing at and I could show up with the Vortecpro Shop Truck....
447 tall deck SBC. AFR heads, LS firing order Solid roller, 9.75:1, Kinsler intake, 2 3/16 throttle bores, AEM Infinity EFI, made just shy of 700, 633tq.
Tom Nelson in CA did the original build. I did a top end redo and intake install a few years ago. Owner decided to do a freshen up and cam change. I’ve done the tuning since day one. Goes in a ‘67 Chevelle.
Last edited by cutlassefi; November 5th, 2020 at 06:30 PM.
Location: Colorado Springs Colorado/Thousand Oaks Ca
Posts: 1,721
Originally Posted by cutlassefi
447 tall deck SBC. AFR heads, LS firing order Solid roller, 9.75:1, Kinsler intake, 2 3/16 throttle bores, AEM Infinity EFI, made just shy of 700, 633tq.
Curious as too the pushrod length? Looks like you got a lot going on there, you know I know Tom Nelson, his shop was about 30 miles from mine in California.
Last edited by VORTECPRO; November 5th, 2020 at 06:34 PM.
Location: Colorado Springs Colorado/Thousand Oaks Ca
Posts: 1,721
Originally Posted by wr1970
I use a aluminum tray and two piece intake gaskets. Tray is to keep oil off intake. I throw turkey trays in the trash. I doubt it any hp is gained with one or the other. Blocking hot air on heads i think does help. Carry on VTP you're in the spot light. Waiting for your next build. This one not to bad. If your customer is happy that is all that matters.
Location: Colorado Springs Colorado/Thousand Oaks Ca
Posts: 1,721
Originally Posted by Bernhard
The aftermarket intakes outperform the stock intake just some more than others. There has been lots of testing over the years, some dyno some track.
I have read that the aftermarket W30 intake does not flow as well as the original W30 but this is second hand info so take it as such.
As I've said before I like dyno tests to be "verified" so one knows where the numbers come from, and that goes for myself as well. When this 455 was tested I thought it would be a good idea to have the dyno test independently "verified". In the future I think it would be a good idea if some other engine builder would also do the same.
Last edited by VORTECPRO; December 9th, 2020 at 07:23 AM.
As I've said before I like dyno tests to be "verified" so one knows where the numbers come from, and that goes for myself as well. When this 455 was tested I thought it would be a good idea to have the dyno test independently "verified". In the future I think it would be a good idea if some other engine builder would also do the same.
I wish a certain builder would put a lift value with his cylinder head flow estimate, but we can’t always get what we want...
Location: Colorado Springs Colorado/Thousand Oaks Ca
Posts: 1,721
Originally Posted by Bubba68CS
I wish a certain builder would put a lift value with his cylinder head flow estimate, but we can’t always get what we want...
Well we know one thing for sure: Starting @ the carburetor entrance through the exit of the intake valve there was at least 248 CFM @ 28 inches @ .510 lift to make 547 HP. Now exactly what could "you"really do with that information?
Well we know one thing for sure: Starting @ the carburetor entrance through the exit of the intake valve there was at least 248 CFM @ 28 inches @ .510 lift to make 547 HP. Now exactly what could "you"really do with that information?
Doesn’t answer the question. Question was specifically at what lift your 290 cfm cylinder head flow estimate came from? It is the simplest question a builder could be asked. The fact you refuse to answer is quite telling.
Location: Colorado Springs Colorado/Thousand Oaks Ca
Posts: 1,721
Originally Posted by Bubba68CS
Doesn’t answer the question. Question was specifically at what lift your 290 cfm cylinder head flow estimate came from? It is the simplest question a builder could be asked. The fact you refuse to answer is quite telling.
Its really not that simple of a question...............seeing I never flow tested the heads......................so why guess. The math shows 248 CFM through the whole intake tract @ .510 lift from the verified dyno test data. Again...what could you possibly do with that data?
Its really not that simple of a question...............seeing I never flow tested the heads......................so why guess. The math shows 248 CFM through the whole intake tract @ .510 lift from the verified dyno test data. Again...what could you possibly do with that data?
Yes...why guess? Why did you guess on the flow number when you were unwilling to guess on the lift?
The number was pulled out of thin air with no basis in reality. Thanks for confirming my suspicion.
Location: Colorado Springs Colorado/Thousand Oaks Ca
Posts: 1,721
Originally Posted by Bubba68CS
Yes...why guess? Why did you guess on the flow number when you were unwilling to guess on the lift?
The number was pulled out of thin air with no basis in reality. Thanks for confirming my suspicion.
Actually my guess was based on the production G head I had flowing over 290 CFM, based on what my G port looked like it seemed resonable my Edelbrock could flow as well, in the 290 CFM range. I can understand you probably have no idea what your looking at in a port, but me on the other hand..........I know what I'am looking at.
Actually my guess was based on the production G head I had flowing over 290 CFM, based on what my G port looked like it seemed resonable my Edelbrock could flow as well, in the 290 CFM range. I can understand you probably have no idea what your looking at in a port, but me on the other hand..........I know what I'am looking at.
Location: Colorado Springs Colorado/Thousand Oaks Ca
Posts: 1,721
Originally Posted by Bubba68CS
Useless without lift.
\
Bubba's bench, thats what we will call this, we can start you on a QA 50 head and you can work your way up to a set of J heads, provided you learn as you go, maybe even cutlasefi will let you keep it over at his new dyno facility. LOL Bubba's Bench
Last edited by VORTECPRO; December 10th, 2020 at 06:24 AM.
Bubba's bench, thats what we will call this, we can start you on a QA 50 head and you can work your way up to a set of J heads, provided you learn as you go, maybe even cutlasefi will let you keep it over at his new dyno facility. LOL Bubba's Bench
Wow, a picture of a flow bench. Can’t find hundreds of those on Google...
cutlassefi actually answers my questions. You are apparently incapable of doing so, even on the absolute simplest of inquiries. Pretty sad for anyone claiming to be a competent builder. But apparently you aren’t one...
Curious as too the pushrod length? Looks like you got a lot going on there, you know I know Tom Nelson, his shop was about 30 miles from mine in California.
And I met Harvey Crane when I was 14, my childhood friends’ step father went to high school with him. So what the hell does that mean? Big fricken deal.
Ten years ago that engine was 17k to start with carbed from Tom and the rear seal leaked and it had excessive blow by from Day One. So I’m not sure I’d brag about knowing him. But even with that what he does is waaaaaaaaaaay over your head.
And I’ll bet you talked EFI with him though right LOL!!!!!!!!!!! Amateur.
Last edited by cutlassefi; December 10th, 2020 at 04:19 PM.
Location: Colorado Springs Colorado/Thousand Oaks Ca
Posts: 1,721
Originally Posted by cutlassefi
And I met Harvey Crane when I was 14, my childhood friends’ step father went to high school with him. So what the hell does that mean? Big fricken deal.
Ten years ago that engine was 17k to start with carbed from Tom and the rear seal leaked and it had excessive blow by from Day One. So I’m not sure I’d brag about knowing him. But even with that what he does is waaaaaaaaaaay over your head.
And I’ll bet you talked EFI with him though right LOL!!!!!!!!!!! Amateur.
Mark
Not bragging about knowing Nelson, I would see him in the parts store on occasion and say hi, never can remember talking any tech with him. I've never seen any of his work. Since you mentioned Harvey, my cam grinder was very tight with Harvey Crane.
" And I’ll bet you talked EFI with him though right LOL!!!!!!!!!!! Amateur "
I don't talk EFI with anyone, when something needs to be done with EFI in my shop I make a call to Harold, and I say I need a EFI deal setup.........he says when you need it done. I could also call Battenrunner as well, either one would run circles around you!
Last edited by VORTECPRO; December 10th, 2020 at 04:54 PM.
Location: Colorado Springs Colorado/Thousand Oaks Ca
Posts: 1,721
Originally Posted by cutlassefi
Well the first thing is you have to call someone else, that says it all right there.
Bring em on brother.
Yes......I know nothing about EFI.
Do you have any examples of fast drag cars with your EFI, if so can you post pictures. We have two NA drag race cars with EFI, both full weight, nine inch tires. One has not been down the track yet, the other has been 9.02 @ 147.
For the last time, drag racing ain’t my gig. I tune local road race stuff.
My Dyno is capable of being a “track Dyno”, so looking forward to doing even more of that. Have your boys try that. It’s a bit more difficult than the simple straight line stuff, like grade school vs college.
Location: Colorado Springs Colorado/Thousand Oaks Ca
Posts: 1,721
[QUOTE=cutlassefi;1299993]For the last time, drag racing ain’t my gig. I tune local road race stuff.
My Dyno is capable of being a “track Dyno”, so looking forward to doing even more of that. Have your boys try that. It’s a bit more difficult than the simple straight line stuff, like grade school vs college.[/QUOTE
You can call "Harold Bettes" a boy but he's quite accomplished and very well known in the automotive industry from Nascar to the OEMs, any search will verify this]. Can you post detailed pictures of road racing cars that specifically utilize your fuel injection setups? Infact can you post pictures of your "track dyno".
Sorry but i dont know what to vendetta for. Im only against the one and only-way to do stuff. If everyone would do as always- nothing would improve- or if not improve- all would be the dull same old.. Hes done alot on the parts-department to Oldsmobile, theres zero denying about that.
Its only the cult-following after him- not the person so much. Few guys here would jump off the bridge if he would tell them to do so, without ever questioning him.
Last edited by Inline; December 11th, 2020 at 11:31 AM.
Sorry but i dont know what to vendetta for. Im only against the one and only-way to do stuff. If everyone would do as always- nothing would improve- or if not improve- all would be the dull same old.. Hes done alot on the parts-department to Oldsmobile, theres zero denying about that.
Its only the cult-following after him- not the person so much. Few guys here would jump off the bridge if he would tell them to do so, without ever questioning him.
...right. Because every reasonable discourse starts with name calling...
For the last time, drag racing ain’t my gig. I tune local road race stuff.
My Dyno is capable of being a “track Dyno”, so looking forward to doing even more of that. Have your boys try that. It’s a bit more difficult than the simple straight line stuff, like grade school vs college.[/QUOTE
You can call "Harold Bettes" a boy but he's quite accomplished and very well known in the automotive industry from Nascar to the OEMs, any search will verify this]. Can you post detailed pictures of road racing cars that specifically utilize your fuel injection setups? Infact can you post pictures of your "track dyno".
Let me tell you about your Boy Harold Bettes. He embarrassed the hell out of himself at the last REC in Charlotte. While waiting for one of the next entries to do a pull, he started spouting that “thinner rings actually produce more friction than thicker rings”. Before I could jump in, yes I was there, two KIDS from SAM school quickly corrected him. He shut up as quick as a ***** in church. I LAUGHED MY FRICKEN *** OFF! There’s your boy that knows everything! He was way out of his league on that one.
I know all about Harold and the general consensus is, while being a very knowledgeable guy overall, he really revels in hearing himself talk, just like you.
Inline- as mentioned I’m looking to do more things locally, ie there’s a local team that just started racing Lexus’ in IMSA. Seeing as how I’m only an hour away from Sebring that’s the market I want to target, and I have the tuning skills to do it. It’s a much greater challenge than tuning something that’s just going WOT to the other end of the track. A lot of people can do that, not much of a challenge there comparatively speaking.
Velcro- you can’t SEE a track Dyno moron, it’s in the software and mine has it. If yours is a 902 then I’m told there’s a software package for that too but you’ll need to install a throttle servo I believe if you don’t already have one. But again like EFI, that’s waaaaaaaaaaaay over your head. Just sayin.
Thanks.
Last edited by cutlassefi; December 11th, 2020 at 03:58 PM.
Location: Colorado Springs Colorado/Thousand Oaks Ca
Posts: 1,721
You know today actually when I was having lunch with Harold it finally came to me, your "The Tuner" yaaa- your the guy the import guys refer to as "The Tuner" I get it. So you caught Harolds saying something you didn't agree with LOL? Harold is your typical engineer, has his own ideas, sometime they work. He built me a carb (Q-Jet) so complicated I was afraid to try it, glad I did, fastest one I have. I can say this about Harold, he's very helpful and means extremely well, happy to have him around, and the best thing he's a gear head, and you don't have to agree with him, but he is one of us.
Can you post detailed pictures of road racing cars that specifically utilize your fuel injection setups? Infact can you post pictures of your dyno?
Last edited by VORTECPRO; December 11th, 2020 at 04:38 PM.
Location: Colorado Springs Colorado/Thousand Oaks Ca
Posts: 1,721
I"d say I have to agree, theres just one problem I have and its Panos, thats always been a problem between "The Tuner" and me. I also can't understand how not 1 person has ever had one of his engines to a drag strip, considering he's built several engines on here, thats just my way of determining what exactly he knows. But generally I agree with "The Tuners" advice. After all were all engines guys................
Can you post detailed pictures of road racing cars that specifically utilize your fuel injection setups? Infact can you post pictures of your dyno?
Here you go DUDE.
I never said he wasn’t knowledgeable, in fact I said he was VERY knowledgeable. BUT he also likes to hear himself talk just as much. And in that instance he was flat out WRONG! Thinner rings don’t produce more friction than thicker rings.
Question, why would I waste my time talking to YOU about EFI, for ANY car?
Dive into the Land n Sea Pro 2000 software and you’ll see it offers all kinds of options regarding testing sessions.
Last edited by cutlassefi; December 11th, 2020 at 05:11 PM.
There have been a few to track with his parts and expertise, does that count? If I can get my *** in gear, I may build my 350 first with pistons and rods that would not exist without his help. I have to go all the way to Saskatoon, 4 hours away to run the 1/4 mile.
Last edited by olds 307 and 403; December 11th, 2020 at 05:12 PM.
So thats it.........very nice! Lets see some data from that engine your testing.
Thank you.
Besides the fact that it’s not done, why would I post a Dyno sheet, you don’t know how to read one anyway, certainly not when it comes to HP vs TQ.
Last edited by cutlassefi; December 11th, 2020 at 05:21 PM.
October 25th, 2020, 01:21 PM
