Originally Posted by olds 307 and 403

You made my point, obviously you like the BBC the best. Why bother with a 455, when you have your BBC customers? Actually, I personally prefer the Small Block Oldsmobile V8. Smaller mains, rod journals, most oversquare, lighter parts, same oil system under less demand. The heads are old school, racers move the ports a bunch and the chambers want a lot of timing. The factory 70's Olds 350's ran circles around the sbc factory motors durability wise, big part of why I like them, they took a hell of a beating. There are fewer high performance builds than the 455 but way, way less bottom end failures on those Olds 350 builds vs the 455. Yes, it has been a horrible, negative year, sorry if I give a guy who puts Olds racers and their favorite V8, the thumbs down. I am not the only guilty party here, not by a long shot, many contributors. I am saying **** it, getting proper heat to my shop right away, gas line just layed today. Then polish my ported #6 heads chambers, get everything figured out, like push rod length for the roller cam, I will get Cutlassefi to do, have delt with him, many times and get my 403 block to the machine shop before spring. Sorry, there is an extremely good shop an Hour and a 1/2 away. They have many, many months for a waiting list. If I put my block in line, maybe I would get it by Summer. Yes, Battle Runner, our local shop probably isn't near as good as his shop. I plan on getting a bore gauge and mics to check the work. I need to check the grind job Smitty got Ohio crank to do on my stroker 330 crank, he likes .002 to .0025", which is on the tight side but the pistons are light, 550 gram, Scat rods and will only see 5500ish rpm. And yes, it may make it to SIR in Saskatoon for a few 1/4 mile runs once I get this 70 put together. This is good build, like I said, do a thread about your old Olds powered race car, what worked and what didn't. That is something we would all enjoy.

Originally Posted by 69CSHC

I agree with that, I would be proud to put this engine in any Olds.

Vortec what are you likely looking at when you fine tune it ? I'm thinking you already hit a homerun so guessing maybe another 25 HP tops as is, getting right around 550 HP ... Is that realistic ?

Originally Posted by VORTECPRO

The 403 bore is very interesting, too bad the block looks to be weak, if that block had solid mains I would build one of those with ported production heads. I really want to see how Dans 403 runs at the track, I might have to make some calls down to Florida to find out................very curious!

Originally Posted by sherlock1212

Nice looking engine love it I have a question i hope you might be able to tell me I have a 1970 455 olds motor with E heads it was just rebuilt a year ago they put an edelbrock manifold on it I did not like the way it ran so took off the heads to take a look I found out there was no turkey tray between the heads and manifold does it matter if it's there or not Please let me know thanks Bob

Originally Posted by Inline

Vortecpro, i really appreciate your input at this forum. Learned alot from you at here and various other forums, what i read but dont write at.
I always, always rank an real stand-up machinist and racer higher than some assembler and market guy. Even the sign-line tells about a guy alot, does he need to market the stuff he sells, or does he let his skills and track-records do the marketing, As i see it, other has great track-record, other has non-verified dyno-numbers.

Please continue with us Vortecpro, and dont mind the lap dogs.

Originally Posted by VORTECPRO

Yes the production BBC is my passion, but I also have raced a 1970 W-30 in NHRA D/SA in the 80s. I race a F/SA 1971 Buick GS in NHRA stock today. I race other cars as well. But I like engines, all engines, I'd run a AMC 360 in stock too. This above

Olds build would easily run 10s in my Buick, I might have to build one just for fun.

Originally Posted by sherlock1212

Just for you.
Nice looking engine love it. I have a question I hope you might be able to tell me. I have a 1970 455 olds motor with E heads it was just rebuilt a year ago they put an edelbrock manifold on it. I did not like the way it ran so took off the heads to take a look and I found out there was no turkey tray between the heads and manifold. Does it matter if it's there or not. Please let me know thanks
Bob
sherlock1212 is online now Report Post

Originally Posted by Inline

Vortecpro, i really appreciate your input at this forum. Learned alot from you at here and various other forums, what i read but dont write at.
I always, always rank an real stand-up machinist and racer higher than some assembler and market guy. Even the sign-line tells about a guy alot, does he need to market the stuff he sells, or does he let his skills and track-records do the marketing, As i see it, other has great track-record, other has non-verified dyno-numbers.

Please continue with us Vortecpro, and dont mind the lap dogs.

Originally Posted by Bubba68CS

Yes, the guy whose screen name is his business name, who brags incessantly about his equipment and Chevy builds isn’t trying to market himself...

Anyway, VTP, curious why you didn’t increase the intake valve size, given it’s well known (among the Olds community) how well the Edelbrock heads respond to such an increase with very little work? Seems odd to “fully port” a head, but do nothing with the valve sizes. From your description of the work, it doesn’t sound like they’re “fully ported”. Thus far all you’ve specified is a valve job. Again, curious exactly what was done.

Also, you should know better than to post flow numbers without corresponding lift...

Originally Posted by oldsmoboogie

what is the suspension set up on this car that would help 525 hp run 10,70’s? I’m looking to get a little more serious with my 72 at the track this spring.

Originally Posted by VORTECPRO

Bubba

I do brag, and I think I do because EFI tries to portray me as a hack that doesn't understand dyno data. Its not for work though, I have more work than I can handle, I think its more I like what I do, I REALLY like hunting cores, machining, building, testing, then racing the engines.

I was going to put bigger valves in the heads, but my customer didn't want to test with the Edelbrock intake with a Holley carb, so since the factory aluminum intake was going to used I figured it would be the cork so I used the 2.07 valve. Theres another reason I didn't change valves, The only oversize valve I could get at the time was a SI industries valve, I don't like their quality, I didn't want to compromise on the stem dimensions, and cause a potential problem for my customer. I should have taken pictures of what I did to the crank!


I never posted flow numbers...................

Originally Posted by VORTECPRO

Thanks! Not sure if the tray would effect it or not, others on here should know, maybe they will chime in.

Originally Posted by VORTECPRO

Bubba

I do brag, and I think I do because EFI tries to portray me as a hack that doesn't understand dyno data. Its not for work though, I have more work than I can handle, I think its more I like what I do, I REALLY like hunting cores, machining, building, testing, then racing the engines.

I was going to put bigger valves in the heads, but my customer didn't want to test with the Edelbrock intake with a Holley carb, so since the factory aluminum intake was going to used I figured it would be the cork so I used the 2.07 valve. Theres another reason I didn't change valves, The only oversize valve I could get at the time was a SI industries valve, I don't like their quality, I didn't want to compromise on the stem dimensions, and cause a potential problem for my customer. I should have taken pictures of what I did to the crank!


I never posted flow numbers...................

Originally Posted by wr1970

Again LOL and calling bs on valve available. Nobody else ever complaining about not being able to get valves.

Originally Posted by wr1970

LOL not knowing VTP speaks volumes. Turkey tray adds nothing to performance. Wasn't the op's problem. Carry on guys interesting thread.

Originally Posted by VORTECPRO

Ok....so I finished the 455 Oldsmobile build today, the customer drove down to my shop and we made a few more pulls to finalize the tune up, then he loaded it up and headed home. I need to thank a few people for their help.

Ryan/Battenrunner
My Customer
Harold Bettes
Redline
Bernard Mondello
Bill Travoto

Originally Posted by VORTECPRO

Ok....so I finished the 455 Oldsmobile build today, the customer drove down to my shop and we made a few more pulls to finalize the tune up, then he loaded it up and headed home. I need to thank a few people for their help.

Ryan/Battenrunner
My Customer
Harold Bettes
Redline
Bernard Mondello
Bill Travoto

Originally Posted by Bernhard

Bernhard wrote
Some cut the gasket area off and use the tray. They then install the intake manifold gaskets that are seperate. The idea behind this is it keeps the hot oil off the bottom of the intake.
Some say it helps manifold warping others claim HP gain in a cooler intake charge.

Originally Posted by cutlassefi

All worthless if you’re using stock heads without the crossovers filled. Exhaust coming thru the intake is much hotter than the oil hitting the bottom.
VTP, I’m pretty sure I never said you were a hack. Nice build.
Inline-, I know you don’t like me too, and I really don’t care. My sole focus in bringing parts to market has been for the avg Olds enthusiast to have the availability to page thru a Summit or Jegs catalog and buy the quality pieces they’ll need to do a respectable build, just like the Chevy, Ford, and Mopar guys can do today. If you want to criticize that effort then go right ahead. Again I really don’t care what you think. But I don’t see anyone else on here making that same push, including VTP, Bill Travato, Dick Miller and others. So, you might want to ask yourself, if they truly have the knowledge needed, and they claim to be doing things for the betterment of the Olds community, then how come they don’t take the time to do what I’ve done? Simple, because they don’t benefit from things like that unless it comes thru THEM, get it?
Have a nice day all.

Originally Posted by Inline

God, you need to come clean my pc, i laughed so hard that i spewed coffee to keys when seeing this Nice one!

And nice build, congrats to new happy owner.

About the valves, interesting coincidence, I also ordered SI Industries valves to my build, and the head-guy wasnt impressed at all. He even showed me, how some valves were like "barrells" from stem, narrow at tip and the valve "plate", and thicker at middle ( thicker than they should be). He had to grind them to correct size. I was there to mic the stems when he called to see it, so its not like he lied about it.

Originally Posted by Inline

All praise the GOD, above anyone else. Thats all i can say. Well i know already few lap-dogs who do..

Have a nice day too.

Originally Posted by VORTECPRO

Valve size is 2.07 1.62. From the porting I've done on Olds production heads I'd say your looking @ maybe flow in the 290 range @ 28 inches. The valve job from Edelbrock was un runnable in my opinion, I put my valve job on there with a back cut on the intake just shy of the lap line. Surfaced and set the CCs. Set the springs up for 160/400.

Originally Posted by VORTECPRO

Thanks! When I was buying parts for this build I asked Bernard if he had valves, he said they were on back order, we both knew SI had valves but then again Bernard and I have standards and know not to use the SI valves due to demension problems, so I have to agree with you. As it turns out it made plenty of power and the customer is happy with the results.

Originally Posted by Bernhard

Originally Posted by Bernhard View Post
Bernhard wrote
Some cut the gasket area off and use the tray. They then install the intake manifold gaskets that are seperate. The idea behind this is it keeps the hot oil off the bottom of the intake.
Some say it helps manifold warping others claim HP gain in a cooler intake charge.




Cutlassefi wrote:
All worthless if you’re using stock heads without the crossovers filled. Exhaust coming thru the intake is much hotter than the oil hitting the bottom.

Bernhard wrote
Since this is the High Performance thread I would speculate that they blocked the cross over as this is basic hot rodding 101.

Originally Posted by Bernhard

Bernhard wrote:
Hi Mark
What brand of valves do you use in your shop and how would you rate them.

Originally Posted by Bernhard

Bernhard wrote
Some cut the gasket area off and use the tray. They then install the intake manifold gaskets that are seperate. The idea behind this is it keeps the hot oil off the bottom of the intake.
Some say it helps manifold warping others claim HP gain in a cooler intake charge.

Originally Posted by VORTECPRO

Ok....so I finished the 455 Oldsmobile build today, the customer drove down to my shop and we made a few more pulls to finalize the tune up, then he loaded it up and headed home. I need to thank a few people for their help.

Ryan/Battenrunner
My Customer
Harold Bettes
Redline
Bernard Mondello
Bill Travoto

Originally Posted by Inline

All praise the GOD, above anyone else. Thats all i can say. Well i know already few lap-dogs who do..
Have a nice day too.

Originally Posted by 69CSHC

Vortec what are you likely looking at when you fine tune it ? I'm thinking you already hit a homerun so guessing maybe another 25 HP tops as is, getting right around 550 HP ...

Originally Posted by VORTECPRO

I don't see that, but the HEI that were running does pull 1 degree of timing for every 1000 RPM, so I'am running about 31 degrees timing @ 5000 RPM, so it might want more timing, we will find when I get back to more testing. You have to understand this engine has a 232 @ .050 cam, not real big. I have no doubt that would run 10.70s in my Buick @ 3650.

Originally Posted by Bubba68CS

Still waiting on the lift to go with the flow VTP...

Originally Posted by Bubba68CS

Still waiting VTP. As I said, you should know better than to quote a flow rate without lift...

You love bragging about the power, but can’t describe in any detail what you did with these heads...

Originally Posted by VORTECPRO

I did explain what was done to the heads, I also explained I didn't flow the heads, but thought they might flow in the 290 CFM @ 28 inches based on production heads that I have ported and flowed. As far as bragging goes I just posted what the engine made for power, personally I wouldn't get excited over 1.189 HP per inch, although there were concessions made with the induction. This engine build was far from a max HP effort, it was built as a mild driver for the Customers 71 Cutlass, and that it delivered on.

Originally Posted by wr1970

I use a aluminum tray and two piece intake gaskets. Tray is to keep oil off intake. I throw turkey trays in the trash. I doubt it any hp is gained with one or the other. Blocking hot air on heads i think does help. Carry on VTP you're in the spot light. Waiting for your next build. This one not to bad. If your customer is happy that is all that matters.