pacekar

I have been looking for a 69 hurst olds for a while. I have found them in all kinds of shape from project to 100 point cars. while not all of them are in my price range I have found a few that im thinking about. one is a nice car but does not have the original block its a replacement block. then I found another one that has the original block. the price is about 7000.00 difference between the cars. both cars have the same options and they both look good so do the experts think that having the original block is worth 7000.00 more Im listening

Octania

Yes?
Things are only new once
These were often driven hard with problematic results.
In 1971, no one thought twice about putting a different unbroken engine in place of the original broken engine. Now, many moons later, the few that still bear the factory engine tend to hold more value.

Does it matter mance-wise? Not much.

If one is looking to verify an original block for a rare and valuable car, all the details need to be examined. Stamp font, spacing, angle, machine marks on the flat surface, block's date vs car build date, etc.

It is not unheard of to put a replacement engine in and grind away the engine's original VIN stamp and stamp the car's VIN derivative into the block- not to defraud, but to make that engine match that car in case of future theft problems or whatnot. I.e., if the car were stolen and chopped, and that engine found, a ck of its VIN stamp would show that the car it currently belongs to is listed as stolen, and the proper course of action taken from there.

Chesrown 67 OAI

The difference in $7k would probably be worth it IF the "original" block car is INDEED the ORIGINAL ENGINE Complete with the correct VIN derivitve.


Without it being the actual original block --- and just another 69 455 block, then answer would be NO -- not worth 7K diff
MOO

allyolds68

The corvette guys have been restamping blocks for years. When I had my 455 rebuilt the builder asked if I wanted it "numbers matching"

jensenracing77

For the car that does not have the original block, Does it have the correct heads and intake manifold? The intake alone is thousands of dolors. The D heads are also thousands. The car with the original block, Does it have the corect heads and intake?

pacekar

yes both cars have the correct intakes d heads trans and rear ends carb and distributors same cars like I said the one has the matching number engine and the other car has a replacement block but the guy with the matching number block wants 7000.00 more than the car with the replacement block is it worth that much more?

jensenracing77

Next question, What do you plan to do with it? On a very high end restoration on equal cars or a very nice unrestored survivor then yes, I think the $7000 would be worth it. Anything less than that and I would just go with the non original and save the $7000.

vette442

Even so, it's not too hard to spot the re-stamps if you know what to look for. The pad surface never looks the same.

I would pay $7k extra for the born-with engine on a Hurst or W car - you'll get it back later. I would be babying that thing though - ask my '70 W-31. If you plan to drive it aggressively, the $7k savings and non-original 455 may be right for you.

w30hurstolds

When talking about a repacement block does the same hold on a warrannty block. My 69 has a warranty block done two years after new. The stamp pad is blank

pacekar

my bad then not a replacement block but a warranty block that's what im trying to say the stamp pad is blank. . does this change things now that evevrybody knows what im talking about whats the difference between a replacement and warranty block ? thank you w30hurstolds for helping me out

pacekar

w30hurstolds one quick question should there be some kind of paper work from the dealer saying that this block was replaced by the dealer or what? thanks

joe_padavano

I don't care if it's a dealer-installed warranty motor or a shadetree replacement. It still ISN'T the original block. Whether having the alleged original block is worth $7K (out of what, $50K?) is up to you. I wouldn't pay that kind of premium. I MIGHT pay that much more if the car were a completely original, unrestored, unmolested car with complete paperwork. Those are few and very far between.

Contrary to what some of the non-enthusiast media may say, I seriously doubt that most cars are worthwhile as an investment. Just buy the car you want at the best price possible and drive the hell out of it. You'll get more personal value that way than buying an "investment" that you're afraid to drive.

tru-blue 442

After all, you only go-round-once, might as well enjoy the ride!

pacekar

hey joe tell me a little about your 69 hurst whats it worth? all original or. I have been looking for about a year all I can find is a hurst without all the hurst parts for about 25 grand then when you start looking for one you are talking about they start about 60 grand and up so any help finding me one would be helpful

jensenracing77

X 1000. Not many people are going to get a good return on there investment and even more so if you figure insurance and plates.

That being said, It don't hurt to ask the questions. If you want to buy one and enjoy it for some years and don't plan to keep it long term then it is best to try to find out the best chances for most return. For me, I would save the $7000. If not having the original engine will bother you then yes, Pay the $7000. Nothing worse than having one you are not happy with.

jensenracing77

Also, Anyone can machine off the VIN pad and claim it to be a replacement block.

pacekar

thanks for telling me about this jensenracing77

rocketraider

The dealer was supposed to 1) restamp a service block with the car's VIN derivative and 2) create an appropriate paper trail any time a warranty engine was installed. Not so much for numbers-matching purists down the road, but for GM's own warranty policy.

Translate: the first one is on us, the rest will be on you. Know a Chevelle guy who went thru this with a 69 SS396 he bought new and when he grenaded the second service engine within the car's original warranty period, GM said it's your baby. And the car sat for years after that because he couldn't even afford a junkyard engine.

Now, how much of that process actually got done is a different story.

Nilsson

On the replacement block the pad is not machined.

joe_padavano

The pad where the VIN derivative is stamped is machined as a matter of course when the bare block is machined. It wouldn't be possible to stamp the VIN derivative legibly if the pad were in the rough as-cast condition.

Run to Rund

One of the nicest remaining unrestored 66 W30s blew the engine while going home from the dealership. I don't know if the entire engine was replaced. Similarly, if you buy the more expensive H/O and the engine blows up, block turns out to be cracked, etc. what have you gained? I would be looking for other differences between the two cars before concluding one is worth 7K more. Some are Frankensteined with patch panels and bondo; I'd rather have a rust free car myself.

Octania

So, if your '69 H/O or equivalent lost its original engine, and the replacement block was then stamped to match the car, then THAT engine blew up, wouldn't the proper best course of action be to attain a 3rd block, with a proper date of casting, and put the car's VIN derivative on that block?

That way, the car most closely represents what it was when it was new.

Now, granted, even if that 3rd block was the NEXT ONE OFF THE ENGINE LINE after your original, and was originally fitted in a different H/O, it's not as valuable a package in its new home because it isn't **the** block the car originally was fitted with. Even if nobody can tell. Only the factory, only back in the day, had that kind of magic power.

oldsmobiledave

What percentage of the purchase price of these cars does $7000 represent?

Oldsmaniac

Man he must have stopped at the track on the way home!

As said it is your call, parts do wear out and break. I would have no problem paying 7G's less for an equally nice car but should the day come to sell that same 7 G difference should follow.

Nilsson

This is what I was referring to Joe. The pad is rough not smooth as a pad stamped from the factory. This is from my car.