NiceOld(s)Car

Looking at a 75 442 that is possibly for sale as a project car.

The 455 engine currently in the car reportedly came out of a 1970 Delta 88 Royale and that is what originally got my attention. It has E heads on it. Some quick internet research indicates Delta 88 Royale in 1970 455 options may have included 310 Hp, 365 HP and 390 HP versions, but I am not sure how to identify which this one might be. I know some of the excellent Oldsmobile knowledge on this site, someone or several someone's, can guide me on that. This engine reportedly was running but after sitting for a decade is not currently running. I know... I know. It was left sitting because a car with no working AC in the Gulf Coast is not something a cool college kid could deal with in these times (my interpretation). BTW, I drove a pickup truck with no AC in college, so we all know my lack of coolness.

The car also comes with a second 455 which came out of a 75 Toro and has been bored 30 over and comes with a full kit of rebuild parts. Again, a slight amount of internet research indicates that motor "may" be originally 230-270 HP, 370 Ft-Lbs Torgue but only 8.5:1 compression.

My thoughts are the 70 Delta 88 Royale motor would be a better candidate to rebuild, and likely a much stronger motor on the other side of that rebuild but wanted to get insight from this community.

Thanks in advance for your input and any you can give is appreciated.
Thanks,
Jack

ajr2820

Either will be fine for your build. Doesn't really matter what the original configuration was since you will be rebuilding anyway.

SY2455

For the 1970 engine the 310 would have been a 2 barrel carburetor, the 365 hp engine would have been the same as the regular 442 engine and the 390 hp engine would have been the W-33 option that was usually found in the police option Delta 88. With the distributor if it is still original to the engine you can better break down the engine. The 2 barrel engine would most likely have been changed to a 4 barrel intake. Carburetor numbers can also be useful in breaking down the engine if it is original.

joe_padavano

Carb, intake, and distributor can be changed. Unfortunately the best way to tell is to measure the specs on the cam. Obviously that's not easy to do. And yes, even the cam can be changed.

oddball

"strength" really isn't an issue. The later block might be a bit lighter with a bit less reinforcement (maybe, I don't know how much the castings really changed after 72). Folks argued for a long time that 70 and earlier blocks and cranks were "better" (better materials, thicker castings), then 73-ish they did another round of trying to remove weight to increase mileage. Whether any of that is really true - or even matters - is pretty difficult to tell.

Really you should either just run one like it is or plan to do a rebuild.
If you do a rebuild, tear both down and take the best parts from each. Then decide your goals and budget, and that will guide you on everything else. It's almost always worthwhile to get an aftermarket cam (standard warnings about current flat tappet lifters are relevant) and an aftermarket intake - especially if you have room for the Performer RPM under the hood.

Fun71

The only significant difference between the 1970 engine and the 1975 engine would be the heads:
E for 1970 and J for 1975.

The J heads have more restrictive exhaust flow and therefore are not as desirable as any other BBO head.
The blocks, cranks, and rods are the same, so it wouldn't matter which of those you used.
The pistons are obviously different, but you said "rebuild" so the originals would be replaced.

NiceOld(s)Car

Thank you all for your feedback. All good information and I have gotten more information from the seller including a few pictures. The 75 Toro motor is obviously already torn down as there is a bare block with an intake manifold sitting on it. The rebuild kit he mentions was shown with an edelbrock carb, and all the names you want to see in parts if you are not necessarily looking to build a classic restoration type car Lunati, Melling, Sealed power, Engle, etc. and has all the parts in boxes, but no specs listed. So I will make a trip down and try to get a look at all the parts. For a 75 442, I wouldn't be worried about building a stock type car, but more of a fun driver. And this looks like it could be that. All your comments about the build seem to fit. The E heads from the motor on the car and the rebuild parts may make a pretty decent running car. My comments about a strong motor may have been less than the best choice of words. I meant a strong Running (translated HORSE POWER and TORGUE). I figured the 70 heads would be better and that was confirmed by you all. If I'm going to rebuild ...70 motor said to be not running from sitting and 75 motor is already disassembled the new parts kit seem like the most likely best way to go.

I'm moving back to Texas soon so I will need to figure out why that AC isn't working, but not too worried about that. It's only money right? Paper with numbers on it my brother says.
The 75 442 body and interior looks to be in good condition, but will have to get a closer look than from a few photos. He says he is thinking 12 k as a start, but is open to offers so sounds like for the whole thing, it may be a fair deal depending on how flexible he really is when we get down to it.

Thank you all for your insights.
Jack

NiceOld(s)Car

Correction "Torque".It's late, I'm sleepy. It happens.

OLDSter Ralph

Personally, that Edelbrock carb is not desirable.
Keep in mind that you are buying a "core" engine. One is complete and the other is dis-assembled and you don't know if all the bolts and miscellaneous is there. Is the assembled block seized up or will it turn over ?

Check the prices of a running 1975 Cutlass online to base what you pay. Pictures don't always show things.

SY2455

Best statement ever, often the pictures will only show the best parts of a car. It's what not shown that you have to worry about, it's everything else. Spend some time writing questions down that you can ask the current owner. Like where did the car spend most of it life? What major/minor/repairs work has been over the years. Try and get pictures from underneath the car. You will find out alot about the car by the questions you ask and your own pictures.

I once went and looked at a 1970 442 W-30 in Fontana, California in 1981. The car was lifted to clear the L60 - 14 tires on Super Stock 2 wheel on all 4 corners. There were 4 finger clearance above the tire in the front. I was interested because it was a 4 speed W-30 as stated in the sale ad in the same color as our automatic W-30. The car was converted from an automatic to a 4 speed with the console and everything else done to make it appear legit. The appearance of A/C and cruise control killed the sale. I often wonder what happened to that car.