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Went to go to a show last Sat. Running great on Frid. Sat morn Bat was dead. Replaced with a good and off we were. Started after the show, drove home, disconnect the Bat and closed the door.
Yesterday installed a NEW - CHARGED - GOOD Bat. And - YES + to pos and - to neg Car is DEAD. All i have is Horn and Key Busser
ANY IDEAS ????????????
Just had this car for 9 months so not that familiar with it.
Last edited by OLDsBARRY; July 16th, 2022 at 11:54 AM.
Measure the voltage on the battery without the car running - what is the voltage?
Measure the voltage on the battery with the car running - what is the voltage?
What year? Up through 67/68 the main positive cable goes to a stud on the horn relay where the main power wire for the car, and cable for the starter are also connected. If this is how your car is set up, it would seem the connection at the post on the horn relay is corroded and the horn relay is getting power but the main power for the car and starter wire are not. Later cars also pick up power for the car from the horn relay post just not the main power for the starter. I would guess either a bad connection at the horn relay positive post or a bad fisible link which is located on the main power wire feeding the fuse box within a few inches of the horn relay. The horn and key buzzer are both ground activated circuits and get power directly from the positive post on the horn relay so that is where I would start.
Last edited by Loaded68W34; July 16th, 2022 at 11:53 AM.
Measure the voltage on the battery without the car running - what is the voltage?
Measure the voltage on the battery with the car running - what is the voltage?
Hard to get a voltage measurement with the car running when the car will not start and the OP does not know why.
Measure the voltage on the battery without the car running - what is the voltage?
Measure the voltage on the battery with the car running - what is the voltage?
I didn't specifically state this, does car start if you jump it? I got a little ahead on my answer - my bad.
Loaded made a good suggestion...
As has been suggested by Loaded, suspect corrosion on the horn relay distribution block or the fusible link has blown. I recall from earlier posts you have a history of some electrical gremlins (door jam switches, horn relay plug). I recall suggesting you purchase the 1971 CSM which has the full color wiring diagram. NOTE: There are small deltas between the wiring of all 1971 A-Body cars & the 1971 442; but, I don't believe there exists a delta in the power feed terminals, wiring at the distribution block (referred to as the Power Take Off in the wiring diagram).
If you still haven't purchased the 1971 CSM, review the 1971 wiring diagram - it's quite simple. Review the cables. NOTE: Direct cable to starter from battery (red) and power cable to distribution block. Note also the location of the fusible link.
Extra Door Jam Switchs r gone along with their feed. Believe they were there for an alarm that long gone.
Do have the wiring sch.
Was hoping this was a norm and someone could lead me in the right direction.
Terms r all clean.
Ill keep looking. Its always something simple when u find it.
Starting to think ignition switch which will be fun.
Hopefully these images can assist in addressing your issue by providing a visulization of the distribution (junction/Power Take Off) block, horn relay, protective cover & fusible link. I have identified the fusible link path w/ branch points. NOTE: The fusible link is a black wire on its terminus where it connects to the junction/distribution block.
Last edited by Vintage Chief; July 16th, 2022 at 01:38 PM.
Starting to think ignition switch which will be fun.
Consider this. The headlights should turn ON without the IGN SW turned to the ON position. Do your headlights turn ON without the IGN SW in the ON position?
Consider this. The headlights should turn ON without the IGN SW turned to the ON position. Do your headlights turn ON without the IGN SW in the ON position?
Note location of the headlamp wiring - independent of the IGN, HORN & Buzzer wiring. You have no headlamps which is a direct feed off the horn relay. I would replace both the horn relay & the distribution block. Ensure your wiring end terminals are in good condition. It's difficult to know from a desk armchair what a previous owner may have hooked up to the car at the distribution block, condition of the horn relay (these things look like toast inside after 50 years) and distribution block, etc. Bottom line is the headlights are independent of IGN, HORN & BUZZER and your headlights do not turn on. Suspect relay distribution/junction block. Your buzzer works, your horn works your headlamps do not work.
BTW, regarding previous owners attempts at wiring (which are unknown), I'd ensure you can locate and have a fusible link on your car. The fusible link is what I'd refer to as required. Easy to assume/suggest a PO may have even removed the fusible link. I'd look for it and determine if it is or it is not there - it should be. It could save you from an electrical fire - those are not good & there's a reason a fusible link is installed in the circuit.
Consider this. The headlights should turn ON without the IGN SW turned to the ON position. Do your headlights turn ON without the IGN SW in the ON position?
The headlights work no matter if the key is in the ignition or not.
Look, once again this isn't a problem that can be diagnosed by remote control. There are nearly a bazillion possible places where the power is interrupted. It takes less time to get a test light and trace the circuit than we've spent talking about it. And all caps or lots of question marks isn't going to get an answer any more quickly. The horn works, which means power is getting to the horn relay. Now figure out why it isn't getting from there to the fuse box.
There is only one fusible link on your car and it's located on the horn relay end of the red wire that feeds to the bulkhead connector. That or a loose bulkhead connector is the likely cause of your issue.
There is only one fusible link on your car and it's located on the horn relay end of the red wire that feeds to the bulkhead connector. That or a loose bulkhead connector is the likely cause of your issue.
Yes, the issue could lie in the main power feed connection in the bulkhead connector (corrosion, loose, etc.), but remember the horn and key buzzer still work. Both of those connections are also made in the bulkhead connection (in the same "plug 1/2" as the main feed).
There is a Inline Blade Fuse i did not know about to the rear of the Horn Relay. Vint. Chief put me onto it. Tried to get it/fuse out and just got it to move a hair. Shoved it back in an everything was back to normal/working at least when i was out in the shop a few min ago. Let hope everything stays status quo
Thanks for all the help guys. Im sure ill b back with another question.
Now i have to figure out why the Battery drained from Frid night to Sat morn.
and
Why my Vintage Air only works at low RPM - thinking belt
and
Why no light not lighting up on the Vintage Air panel.
There is a Inline Blade Fuse i did not know about to the rear of the Horn Relay.
I will say that no one except the person who installed it knew about it before now - that is not a factory setup. My guess is someone replaced the fusible link with that fuse.
Here's a link with pictures and GM diagrams of the horn relay, and you will see there is no fuse anywhere:
I will say that no one except the person who installed it knew about it before now - that is not a factory setup. My guess is someone replaced the fusible link with that fuse.
Agree w/ Kenneth (as I suggested above):
BTW, regarding previous owners attempts at wiring (which are unknown), I'd ensure you can locate and have a fusible link on your car. The fusible link is what I'd refer to as required. Easy to assume/suggest a PO may have even removed the fusible link. I'd look for it and determine if it is or it is not there - it should be. It could save you from an electrical fire - those are not good & there's a reason a fusible link is installed in the circuit.
The OP would be served well to install a proper fusible link into it's original position. There's no telling why a PO did what they did &/or any departures from original wiring. Obviously there's an issue with the supposed In-Line Blade Fuse which is not a correct replacement for a fusible link. Review the wiring diagram carefully, remove extenuating wires which don't align to the original wiring schematic. Noting previous threads/posts regarding wiring on this car, there most likely were and most likely remain some gremlins. I note you stated the car has Vintage Air installed - which could be the issue or contributing to a wiring issue. No telling the capabilities of a PO with installation & any other items which were modified on the car, you need to at some point get back to basics of the original wiring diagram/schematic to perform further diagnoses as you move forward. It's time consuming being in your position but getting back to basic wiring is, IMO, the place to begin - follow the original wiring diagram, look for departures and validate why those departures were made (Vintage Air [etc.] wired correctly?). There are many CO members available to assist.
Regarding this:
Now i have to figure out why the Battery drained from Frid night to Sat morn.
Most likely a parasitic draw (and most likely part & parcel to currently mis-configured wiring)
July 16th, 2022, 11:33 AM
