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At least that is what the Kia dealer tech thought when we had the oil changed in my wife's Kia Soul last Thursday. After the oil change I drove it home (about 8 miles). The next morning I used her Kia to drive to work (the 96 was in the middle of a trailer hitch install). The Kia made it another 15 or 20 miles at highway speed before the drain plug worked loose and the engine siezed.
I had the Kia towed to the dealer (after fighting Agero insurance the whole way). The service advisor was able to get us a courtesy car and said we would get the engine replaced on the house, but I still haven't gotten my questions answered. I want to know if the engine will be new or remanufactured. No way in HELL am I going to accept a junkyard engine. I also need to know if we will get additional warranty with the engine. I expect it to be a longblock; oil pan to valve cover and timing belt cover to flywheel.
Of course I never received an apology from the general manager or owner. I did praise the service advisor when I spoke to the owner for getting my wife and I a courtesy car. But the owner just wanted my picture because I'm SOOO TALLL! Should have figured as much from a guy who drives a Lamborghini Huracan.
So, here's the obligatory pics. I will keep everyone posted. I won't trash talk the name of the Kia dealer yet but there are only so many in OKC.
That's why I change my own oil, my everyday driver had the oil plug cross threaded during one of the very few times I didn't change my own oil (middle of a snowy winter). The plug is still good but must be carefully hand turned to start it properly in it's hole then wrenched. If I don't change the oil myself the plug will probably be ruined at some point.
My ex wife worked with a lady who always had her oil changed at a quick lube place.
One time after having the oil changed she noticed her oil light was one. She drove back to the shop. They had replaced the oil filter, but didn’t notice the old filter o-ring stuck to the block. She drove the car probably 10 miles total. They replaced the filter, topped off the oil level, and sent her on her way. She thought everything was great.
It wasn’t a month later before the engine was making some pretty unpleasant noises. It started out just rattling a little when cold, it didn’t take long before some nasty bottom end sounds started coming from the pan. Of course, she had no paperwork proving the oil filter issue, and of course nobody at the oil change place remembered her having the problem. I have no doubt running the engine low on oil caused the damage, and it simply took awhile before the damage become noticeable. I put a used engine in the car for her.
I always tell people that use the quick lube places that if the ever have problems, to either run the engine until it quits, or to absolutely get paperwork describing the problem. Her being nice ended up costing her a bunch of money she didn’t have. She assumed that replacing the filter and lost oil meant all was well. Expensive lesson.
Yeah that stinks who puts the plug in but doesnt tighten-it ?
A previous car we bought new came w ‘free maintenance’ for two years. So the dealer did the oil changes. After the 2 years idid the oil changes. The underside engine cover is held on by 8 torx screws that screw intoa plastic retainer. A good idea i think so those torx screws never seize or rip out like happens w similar j nut fasteners here in the northeast. Anyways all 8 are so stripped that the torx screws are either half hanging out or can be pulled out by hand! Not one of them could be threaded in and be expected to hold reliably. I suspect an batterypowered tool was used to run the fasteners in stripping out the carefully thought out plastic retainers.
i would expect within a short time the cover would have flopped off and be lost. You would think the dealer would do better!
These Dealerships never did use Brain Surgeons to do the oil changes. Buuuuuuuut! I use to have the oil changed on my corvette where I bought the car. NO LONGER Went in for oil change and when I got it home I put it on my 4 post lift to get it out of the way. I went to do something and when I came back out in the garage I noticed something white on the rocker panel. The tech never used the pucks to raise the car up and punched a hole in the rocker, cracked both rockers and never said a word. They did fix the car (half a*s) and said everything was good to go. It wasn't. I do change the oil on my Oldsmobile's and if there is something I just can't do I take it to my loco restoration shop. I pay more but they have to put up with my acid personality got rid of the corvette. Bought a new one.
In the mid-90s I managed a quick lube that processed about 40 cars per day on average. In my one year there, we only had one catastrophic mistake, and it was due to a double gasket on the oil filter where the old gasket stuck to the engine. The company policy was to make it right for the customer, and they got a new engine out of it. The company knows that mistakes are going to happen, and they should be prepared to pay for their mistakes. If anything like this happens to you, stay firm that you need them to return the car to the prior condition and do your best to control your temper. If your car had a high mileage engine, it is not uncommon nor should it be unexpected for the shop to offer you a remanufactured engine or even a salvage engine with fewer miles than what your car had. I do not recall our exact policy, but our position was to make the car as good or better than when we made the mistake.
In order to be a manager, I had to do every job in the place (greeter / vacuum, upper bay, lower bay, sales, cashier and podium.) I had a blast doing all of them except for sales. The manager at the podium would look up filter numbers, capacities, etc., as well as direct employees and cars to different bays depending on what types of services were being performed and to ensure that cars were worked in the order in which they arrived. This was sometimes tricky when we had multiple cars behind every bay, and one of the cars would need extra services like transmission, A/C or radiator services. Our guys were very good, and even though we serviced all makes and models, virtually everyone there could tell you what oil filter or air filter a car used without having to look it up.
In case you did not know, the busiest day of the year for these places is the day before Thanksgiving. For my one Thanksgiving week in that job, we did 77 cars in 12 hours with an average hood time of 5 minutes. The only thing keeping us from going any faster was waiting for the oil to drain. Of course, we probably lost money that day since no one wanted any additional services, but it was a lot of fun.
The funny thing is that for the first 75k+ miles of the cars life we had the oil changed by the same place. I changed the oil ONCE by myself with a Wix filter and O'Reilly's brand synthetic oil. I drove it 1500 miles in the past 6 months on that Wix filter. When the Kia dealer changed the oil again the engine gernades with less than 40 miles on the Kia filter.
The funny thing is that for the first 75k+ miles of the cars life we had the oil changed by the same place. I changed the oil ONCE by myself with a Wix filter and O'Reilly's brand synthetic oil. I drove it 1500 miles in the past 6 months on that Wix filter. When the Kia dealer changed the oil again the engine gernades with less than 40 miles on the Kia filter.
That really sucks. Good luck with getting the dealer to make it right for you. Definitely don’t accept less than a good equivalent engine.
So, I spoke with the shop foreman that is going to install the engine. He verified that I will get a new longblock. Unfortunately it won't have any additional warranty on it, but it's coming straight from Kia. I also spoke with the general manager of the dealership for the first time. He was apologetic and told me that he and his staff would keep me updated through out the entire process.
For such a $#!++Y thing to happen it has been as painless as possible.
In other news I drove my 96 98 to the exhaust shop and the owner installed a modified muffler hangar in about 20 minutes for a helluva price! Definitely returning after the holidays to get dual exhaust installed (after the cat of course).
So you had an engine with 75,000 miles on it and you are getting a brand new engine. To me it would seem a little unreasonable to expect to get additional warranty. With a new engine you should expect to get additional miles out of the car. It is good to hear of a dealership that stepped up and did what is right.
To me it would seem a little unreasonable to expect to get additional warranty.
Perhaps. Interestingly Jasper engines sells their remanufactured engines with a 3 year / 100k mile warranty. Also, pretty much any part you buy at a chain auto parts store includes some kind of warranty if not a lifetime warranty. Unfortunately, I was unable to find a place to buy a 2.0l Kia engine online. It's such a new engine it might not be readily available in the aftermarket yet.
Ultimately, I'm glad the dealership didn't try to squeak by with a junkyard engine. If so, I was going to demand full disassembly and measurement with precision tools to determine the health of the engine before install. I would probably be satisfied with honing the cylinders and installing OE sized rings and bearings on my Olds 455, GM 3.8l v6 or Ford 6.9l IDI without any machine work, but a daily driver that's not a big boy toy is another story.
Guys, think of it like this. The dealer has a liability to replace the engine due to the fault of one of their employees. Once the engine is replaced that liability is gone. If they warrantied the engine they assume additional liability. Why would they add to the liability. If you paid for the engine then there would be a warranty because they received consideration. I understand your thought that you would get a warranty with a new engine but I would be on the side of the dealer on this one. From the sideline that is how I see it.
This was at a Honda dealer I worked at briefly. The drivers window was open and it took a week to detail the interior. The lube monkey ran it with the oil cap off. Take note of the ceiling.
Think of it like this guys. If the original warranty is lets say 100,000 miles and they replace your engine at 90,000 under warranty, does that extend your warranty. No.
This was at a Honda dealer I worked at briefly. The drivers window was open and it took a week to detail the interior. The lube monkey ran it with the oil cap off. Take note of the ceiling.
That's crazy!
I was told the car will be detailed after installing the engine. There's oil all over the back hatch right now. We'll see if they detail it or just run it through the speedy wash. They offer two different services and charge accordingly.
Yeah that stinks who puts the plug in but doesnt tighten-it ?
A previous car we bought new came w ‘free maintenance’ for two years. So the dealer did the oil changes. After the 2 years idid the oil changes. The underside engine cover is held on by 8 torx screws that screw intoa plastic retainer. A good idea i think so those torx screws never seize or rip out like happens w similar j nut fasteners here in the northeast. Anyways all 8 are so stripped that the torx screws are either half hanging out or can be pulled out by hand! Not one of them could be threaded in and be expected to hold reliably. I suspect an batterypowered tool was used to run the fasteners in stripping out the carefully thought out plastic retainers.
i would expect within a short time the cover would have flopped off and be lost. You would think the dealer would do better!
Had that very thing happen to my 11 F150 Larait. Oil change at the dealer and somewhere down the road the whole under engine cover disappeared! Went back down to the dealer for it and they replaced it and all the brackets and fasteners. My cost on those parts would have been over $300.00.
I went to pick up momma's Kia yesterday and they used a remanufactured short block and the original head. The servicer manager was trying to feed me some baloney that the computer would shut the engine down without oil pressure before internal damage occurred. They showed me a DOHC 4 cylinder head without cams. I noted there weren't any bearings in the head. I was told that Kia engines don't use bearings in the heads anymore. They must think I fell off the truck yesterday!
My wife and I sat down with the general manager, owner and service manager and now we're considering trading it in on a new Telluride. What kind of BS is that? Do car dealers intentionally sabotage the vehicles of customers to make sales now?
Just think of all the improvements I could make to my Oldsmobiles and my Ford truck for the price of a new Telluride... Heck, I could take my family on a fun filled week to the Caribbean for a fraction of that price if not for this dang virus.
Anyways, this is what I got at the dealer yesterday. Of course they didn't detail it, they only ran it through the speedy wash and left it outside over night. There were water spots all over it and grass and kid detritus on the floorboard. Here's the pic. Updates to come.
Time to get in touch with the ZONE or Regional Manager.. Start a fire under your local dealers ***. Did you refuse delivery and keep loaner car??
Hope you had / do have some documentation along the way as to what was to be done.
Cause and extent of damages.
Replace KIA blown motor with Complete new engine etc. Obviously verbal is not enough of an agreement now.
I feel for you
I was sold a "lemon" olds bravada when I worked at an oldsmobile dealership
Went all the way to grievance with UAW what a pain in the ***
On the other side of this is the too tight drain plug. There is a recommended torque value for the oil drain plug on most recent vehicles. Case in point our 2008 Hyundai Santa Fe 2.7L. The vehicle had just over 100K miles on the clock when I returned from a routine oil change/tire rotation and noticed some oil on the driveway under the engine. Crawling under the vehicle I saw the drip was coming from the oil drain plug area so I grabbed the correct size metric box wrench, verified the plug was tight and wiped off the oil. Next day there was more oil leakage....what could be the problem? I decided to check the oil drain plug gasket which of course required me to drain out all this fresh engine oil which I was able to capture in a clean container. The aluminum gasket was crushed to wafer thin so off to the parts store for a replacement. New gasket on, drain plug torqued to spec, crankcase refilled, problem solved!
re: cam bearings: that's actually true. Many current heads do not use bearings on the overhead cams. The cams just ride on the bare aluminum head and cap. The load on these cams is relatively low, so apparently no need for bearing shells. I expect the journals are machined better than a traditional journal.
I would inspect the head to make sure the valves didn't seize and the cam journals didn't score. If all is good, then it "should be just fine".
I figured I would update this thread given my current circumstances.
Momma and I actually bought a used Hyundai Palisade from that Kia dealer, even though they put us through such a fiasco. Here's a picture of when we bought it with our youngest daughter.
It actually turned out to be a good purchase. Not because it was an exceptional car, but because of the timing of our purchase. We only had it about a year, but given the COVID pandemic we were able to sell it for more than we bought it for. We made enough that we were able to put over $10k down on my 20 Ford F150.
The problem is that now my 20 F150 is having transmission trouble. Yesterday I took it into the dealer for the 3rd time! They already reprogrammed the transmission, and then they rebuilt it.
