Spring Compressor problem - urgent
November 9th, 2011, 12:10 PM
#41
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Montreal, QC
Posts: 2,175
Thanks Allan! Oh man, that's one thing that i forgot, is the upper control arm bolts... Would you have an idea of which ones to buy?
I'm definitely going to need to visit my local store to get tool rentals. Noone i know seems to have the tools, and i'm very apprehensive about buying chineasium spring compressor and balljoint tools on Ebay.
I've got a nice warm spot for the car for the next 2 weeks (or at least until the snow falls.) So i'm hoping to get the work done over the next week or so.
With the balljoint tool did you find yours came out easily? I'm hoping i wont need to cobble up a tool to get mine out. From the looks of the Rivets in there i think they're the original Pair.. I actually wouldn't be surprised if my shocks were original too. They sure look like the ones in the CSM.
I'm definitely going to need to visit my local store to get tool rentals. Noone i know seems to have the tools, and i'm very apprehensive about buying chineasium spring compressor and balljoint tools on Ebay.
I've got a nice warm spot for the car for the next 2 weeks (or at least until the snow falls.) So i'm hoping to get the work done over the next week or so.
With the balljoint tool did you find yours came out easily? I'm hoping i wont need to cobble up a tool to get mine out. From the looks of the Rivets in there i think they're the original Pair.. I actually wouldn't be surprised if my shocks were original too. They sure look like the ones in the CSM.
Wish I was there to help you Tony. Do you have a heated work area? I saw the temps in Quebec were quite nice for the last while, but you know that soon it's going to change. I really don't like working on the car in the cold.
On your list of parts, make sure you have ALL the upper, lower CA bushings, stabilizer bushings, and new link kits. If you need new locking nuts or bolts check your local bolt supply house. I went to the one here and got new locking nuts (11/16) for the upper control arms cheap like borscht. (gr 8) Also, you want to keep Partsource in mind. They have 'free' tool rentals and you'll need a Ball Joint press kit, + a bushing press kit. They have both and this makes the bushing and ball joint work easy. Other than that, I found that an air ratchet and impact driver + assorted wrenches/sockets are your basic friends on a rebuild. For some strange reason, you will find that some nuts or bolts on your car may not be standard, they might need a metric socket/wrench instead. It baffles me too.
Do you have access to a bead blaster? That will make your cleanup work really easy. Follow up with a light sanding to smooth out the surfaces that were blasted. If there are good powder coaters that will give a deal, I'd seriously look at them for the Control arms. Paint does work well too; I guess it comes down to what is affordable and practical.
On your list of parts, make sure you have ALL the upper, lower CA bushings, stabilizer bushings, and new link kits. If you need new locking nuts or bolts check your local bolt supply house. I went to the one here and got new locking nuts (11/16) for the upper control arms cheap like borscht. (gr 8) Also, you want to keep Partsource in mind. They have 'free' tool rentals and you'll need a Ball Joint press kit, + a bushing press kit. They have both and this makes the bushing and ball joint work easy. Other than that, I found that an air ratchet and impact driver + assorted wrenches/sockets are your basic friends on a rebuild. For some strange reason, you will find that some nuts or bolts on your car may not be standard, they might need a metric socket/wrench instead. It baffles me too.
Do you have access to a bead blaster? That will make your cleanup work really easy. Follow up with a light sanding to smooth out the surfaces that were blasted. If there are good powder coaters that will give a deal, I'd seriously look at them for the Control arms. Paint does work well too; I guess it comes down to what is affordable and practical.
November 9th, 2011, 12:56 PM
#42
Just an Olds Guy
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Edmonton, AB. And "I am Can 'eh' jun - eh"
Posts: 24,525
Thanks Allan! Oh man, that's one thing that i forgot, is the upper control arm bolts... Would you have an idea of which ones to buy? Yup, you can get them new from In Line Tube for around 24.00. If you're going to order parts though make it worth your while and combine them into one order. If you run into a problem with the UCA bolts, I have 4 old ones left from my build I can send you. They are not bad shape, but I replaced them on principle. They're probably still good. Shipping from ILT takes about 2 weeks, so if you only have the shop for a short time, ordering new ones is going to be tough. There was a dealership in Chicoutame?? sp?? that has them, but they wanted 9 bucks a bolt and that didn't include the locking nuts. Thats why I went with ILT. You can't get these from a nut/bolt supply house. Check NAPA or Partsouce, but don't hold your breath
I'm definitely going to need to visit my local store to get tool rentals. Noone i know seems to have the tools, and i'm very apprehensive about buying chineasium spring compressor and balljoint tools on Ebay.
NOOOO. No NO NO. Do not buy a spring compressor - you DONT NEED IT. The balljoint tools are 'free' rentals at Partsource. You pay a deposit when you take them, and they return the deposit when the tool comes back. It's their way of guaranteeing they don't get ripped off
I've got a nice warm spot for the car for the next 2 weeks (or at least until the snow falls.) So i'm hoping to get the work done over the next week or so.
You are very ambitious. This is a lot of work and very time consuming - especially when you haven't done it before. Too bad you didn't do this before you put on that shiny new Bamboo paint. Make sure you have protective mats draped over the front fender when you're working there.
With the balljoint tool did you find yours came out easily? I'm hoping i wont need to cobble up a tool to get mine out. Piece of cake. Use the BJ press to remove the lowers - took less than 30 seconds and they came right out so easy I almost reinstalled them to try it again
From the looks of the Rivets in there i think they're the original Pair.. I actually wouldn't be surprised if my shocks were original too. They sure look like the ones in the CSM. Probably. Some shops would rivet them back in when the did upper BJs in the old days, but nuts/bolts/washers are much better to work with. I found that drilling out the rivets from the TOP (not bottom) was a better way to do it. You can see your work easier. Punch a drill point in the middle of the rivet. Use a 1/8" drill and Drill down about 3/8" then switch to a 1/4" drill and drill down to where the rivet head spins onto the bit. Use a drift and punch the rivet though the CA. Use a metal chisel to get separation between the UCA and the BJ to speed up the process. When you put the new BJs in there will be 2 washers for each bolt/nut. One goes on the top, one on the bottom with the nut. This helps distribute the load on the bolt head/nut.
Shocks can be a PITA to get out. Not the bottom, the top. If they are original shocks you will have clips with a welded nut on the LCA. The shock bolt goes through it. If that's the case, douse them with penetrating fluid for a couple of days to break them loose - they will fight hard to stay in. The top shock nut may be a pain. Same as before with the penetrating oil. Use a deep socket to turn if off. You will have to clamp the shock piston with a vice grip to keep it from turning at the same time. Don't worry if you damage the shock, you're going to replace it anyway. New shocks come with the upper hardware including bushings, but not the lower bolts or nuts.
Pressing in the new LCA BJs was as easy as pressing them out. When you put the LBJ boot on, lube the inside first. I used the BJ press adapter to push it into place. Slick.
It's the bushings that are the most fun. If yours are as rusty as mine were, you're going to have your heart pounding thinking somethings wrong. It takes a LOT of force to get them out, even when you cold chisel the sides to collapse them. Sounds like a gun going off beside you when the bushing breaks loose. You also have to MAKE SURE you have spacers between both ears of the CA so you don't end up collapsing them taking out and pressing in the new bushings. I found a really simple way that works and only cost about 3 bucks using deck/plumbing parts at Rona. When you're ready, I'll go through it with you
I'm definitely going to need to visit my local store to get tool rentals. Noone i know seems to have the tools, and i'm very apprehensive about buying chineasium spring compressor and balljoint tools on Ebay.
NOOOO. No NO NO. Do not buy a spring compressor - you DONT NEED IT. The balljoint tools are 'free' rentals at Partsource. You pay a deposit when you take them, and they return the deposit when the tool comes back. It's their way of guaranteeing they don't get ripped off
I've got a nice warm spot for the car for the next 2 weeks (or at least until the snow falls.) So i'm hoping to get the work done over the next week or so.
You are very ambitious. This is a lot of work and very time consuming - especially when you haven't done it before. Too bad you didn't do this before you put on that shiny new Bamboo paint. Make sure you have protective mats draped over the front fender when you're working there.
With the balljoint tool did you find yours came out easily? I'm hoping i wont need to cobble up a tool to get mine out. Piece of cake. Use the BJ press to remove the lowers - took less than 30 seconds and they came right out so easy I almost reinstalled them to try it again
From the looks of the Rivets in there i think they're the original Pair.. I actually wouldn't be surprised if my shocks were original too. They sure look like the ones in the CSM. Probably. Some shops would rivet them back in when the did upper BJs in the old days, but nuts/bolts/washers are much better to work with. I found that drilling out the rivets from the TOP (not bottom) was a better way to do it. You can see your work easier. Punch a drill point in the middle of the rivet. Use a 1/8" drill and Drill down about 3/8" then switch to a 1/4" drill and drill down to where the rivet head spins onto the bit. Use a drift and punch the rivet though the CA. Use a metal chisel to get separation between the UCA and the BJ to speed up the process. When you put the new BJs in there will be 2 washers for each bolt/nut. One goes on the top, one on the bottom with the nut. This helps distribute the load on the bolt head/nut.
Shocks can be a PITA to get out. Not the bottom, the top. If they are original shocks you will have clips with a welded nut on the LCA. The shock bolt goes through it. If that's the case, douse them with penetrating fluid for a couple of days to break them loose - they will fight hard to stay in. The top shock nut may be a pain. Same as before with the penetrating oil. Use a deep socket to turn if off. You will have to clamp the shock piston with a vice grip to keep it from turning at the same time. Don't worry if you damage the shock, you're going to replace it anyway. New shocks come with the upper hardware including bushings, but not the lower bolts or nuts.
Pressing in the new LCA BJs was as easy as pressing them out. When you put the LBJ boot on, lube the inside first. I used the BJ press adapter to push it into place. Slick.
It's the bushings that are the most fun. If yours are as rusty as mine were, you're going to have your heart pounding thinking somethings wrong. It takes a LOT of force to get them out, even when you cold chisel the sides to collapse them. Sounds like a gun going off beside you when the bushing breaks loose. You also have to MAKE SURE you have spacers between both ears of the CA so you don't end up collapsing them taking out and pressing in the new bushings. I found a really simple way that works and only cost about 3 bucks using deck/plumbing parts at Rona. When you're ready, I'll go through it with you
November 9th, 2011, 06:50 PM
#43
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Montreal, QC
Posts: 2,175
Yup, you can get them new from In Line Tube for around 24.00. If you're going to order parts though make it worth your while and combine them into one order. If you run into a problem with the UCA bolts, I have 4 old ones left from my build I can send you. They are not bad shape, but I replaced them on principle. They're probably still good. Shipping from ILT takes about 2 weeks, so if you only have the shop for a short time, ordering new ones is going to be tough. There was a dealership in Chicoutame?? sp?? that has them, but they wanted 9 bucks a bolt and that didn't include the locking nuts. Thats why I went with ILT. You can't get these from a nut/bolt supply house. Check NAPA or Partsouce, but don't hold your breath
You are very ambitious. This is a lot of work and very time consuming - especially when you haven't done it before. Too bad you didn't do this before you put on that shiny new Bamboo paint. Make sure you have protective mats draped over the front fender when you're working there.
For some reason the lower control arms are more intimidating since they're pressed in instead of riveted/screwed. But i actually got some pretty nice looking balljoints and matching bushings from Rockauto and i'm hoping they install nicely. Shocks can be a PITA to get out. Not the bottom, the top. If they are original shocks you will have clips with a welded nut on the LCA. The shock bolt goes through it. If that's the case, douse them with penetrating fluid for a couple of days to break them loose - they will fight hard to stay in. The top shock nut may be a pain. Same as before with the penetrating oil. Use a deep socket to turn if off. You will have to clamp the shock piston with a vice grip to keep it from turning at the same time. Don't worry if you damage the shock, you're going to replace it anyway. New shocks come with the upper hardware including bushings, but not the lower bolts or nuts.
Is the shock supposed to be able to be removed without removing the spring? I think this might be the first part of the suspension that i tackle.
My rear springs actually look brand new. They're nice and painted black. I was shocked, so i guess the PO changed them out before i bought the car. I'll probably be leaving those alone.
3 dollars for bushing removal hardware! Let me in on the secret so i can run over there now!
I actually prefer rona to Home depot, especially when i was buying 10 gauge welding wire last week. I think i saved 2 dollars a foot!
Last edited by Tony72Cutlass'S'; November 9th, 2011 at 07:00 PM.
November 9th, 2011, 07:46 PM
#44
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Plano, TX
Posts: 11,798
Tony, take some deep breaths and locate the thread "Lady gets a front end job".
Read the whole thing, step by step, while sober... Your suspension will be the same as mine, so disassembly and reassembly will be similar.
Take note of the tips and tricks i did. I did it on a budget, so i got the $3 worth of pipe fittings and a couple big washers.
You need a rented ball joint press for sure to remove and install ball joints and bushings.
You can try the pickle fork thingie, but BFH works better.
A friend of mine lost two of my lower shock nuts, which are made of unobtainium it seems. I had to use a generic part and they were ill-fitting.
I also had an upper control arm shaft bolt snap on me a few years back and the wheel fell off. Now this is bad. These bolts are stressed differently than all the others, so just change them if they have not ever been. The nuts can be reused if not rusty...
Make up a thread so we can all watch the fun. Actually i will not even need to watch - I lived it........ (and still have nightmares of it).
Allan and I can give you plenty of guidance, and locations to whack stuff with the BFH's.
Read the whole thing, step by step, while sober... Your suspension will be the same as mine, so disassembly and reassembly will be similar.
Take note of the tips and tricks i did. I did it on a budget, so i got the $3 worth of pipe fittings and a couple big washers.
You need a rented ball joint press for sure to remove and install ball joints and bushings.
You can try the pickle fork thingie, but BFH works better.
A friend of mine lost two of my lower shock nuts, which are made of unobtainium it seems. I had to use a generic part and they were ill-fitting.
I also had an upper control arm shaft bolt snap on me a few years back and the wheel fell off. Now this is bad. These bolts are stressed differently than all the others, so just change them if they have not ever been. The nuts can be reused if not rusty...
Make up a thread so we can all watch the fun. Actually i will not even need to watch - I lived it........ (and still have nightmares of it).
Allan and I can give you plenty of guidance, and locations to whack stuff with the BFH's.
November 9th, 2011, 07:51 PM
#45
Just an Olds Guy
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Edmonton, AB. And "I am Can 'eh' jun - eh"
Posts: 24,525
Tony,
There is no 'policy' on reusing the bolts. Basically if you think they're ok, clean them up and reused them. Lots of guys replace them because of the stress the bolt takes over the years. When you go to loosen off the UCA bolts, photo everything. Note the alignment shim positions. Take them out as a group, tape them together and lable them. They need to go back in exactly the same as they came out. I put all my loose parts - bolts , nuts, cotter pins, bearings etc in Glad sandwich baggies, sealed them, labled them and kept them in a large shoe box so they didn't get lost.
I said it took me 30 seconds to pop out the lower ball joint. It took several hours to get the all the bushings out of all 4 control arms. Thats 8 bushings, and 4 ball joints. 16 hours (2 days?) is plenty of time to get the bushings out, cleanup and paint, then reinstall bushings. The reinstall is much easier than removal.
A ball joint separator (pickle fork) is used between the boot of the ball joint and the other surface. It is not a cold chisel, which is what I used after drilling the top rivets. You tap the chisel between the top plate of the ball joint and pry up. That loosens the rivet even more. Then take a 1/4" drift and punch the rivet through the hole. Simple. When you go to separate the upper ball joint from the spindle, use your BFH on the top of the spindle connection. Loosen the castle nut to where it's only on by about 3 full turns. Then whack the front of the spindle lobe where the ball joint seats itself. About 5 GOOD whacks - don't be gentle and it will POP loose. The spindle will drop to where the castle nut is.
If you have brand new shocks installed, they should come out really easy. You probably won't need penetrating fluid. I thought you still had the originals still in there.
The shock has to be removed to take out the spring. Right now my car is sitting with just the upper / lower control arms attached to the spindle holding it all together. Just remember when you're removing castle nuts and separating the ball joints, put a jack under the shock bowl to support the arm. I would loosen the LCA bolt and nut before doing this, you want maximum lowering on the control arm to take out the spring. Once you break the ball joint connection and take off the castle nut, lower the control arm slowly. The spring will be easy to get out then.
Rear springs are way easier to do than fronts, same with rear shocks. If yours are good, leave them for now.
The $3.00 secret? a 2" plumbing end cap and a small 4" square steel plate used on decks. Also pick up a short length of 2" pvc piping (you need less than a foot - maybe you know someone who has a short piece?) Cut the piping into a section that is wide enough to fit between the CA ears where the bushings are. Then cut the piping in half - ending up with 2 sections that look like crankcase bearings. Tap them between the ears of the CA to act as spacers when removing and installing bushings. Keeps the ears from crushing together. When you get to the install I'll tell you about the 2" cap and plate.
If you start a thread on this, I'll monitor it regularly and offer whatever help I can. PM me the name of the thread so I can follow along.
Rob has a thread 'Lady gets a front end job' and I have one still in progress that you've seen "disc plate backing plate'. Both will help you through some of the tough times and maybe give you a laugh when you need it.
There is no 'policy' on reusing the bolts. Basically if you think they're ok, clean them up and reused them. Lots of guys replace them because of the stress the bolt takes over the years. When you go to loosen off the UCA bolts, photo everything. Note the alignment shim positions. Take them out as a group, tape them together and lable them. They need to go back in exactly the same as they came out. I put all my loose parts - bolts , nuts, cotter pins, bearings etc in Glad sandwich baggies, sealed them, labled them and kept them in a large shoe box so they didn't get lost.
I said it took me 30 seconds to pop out the lower ball joint. It took several hours to get the all the bushings out of all 4 control arms. Thats 8 bushings, and 4 ball joints. 16 hours (2 days?) is plenty of time to get the bushings out, cleanup and paint, then reinstall bushings. The reinstall is much easier than removal.
A ball joint separator (pickle fork) is used between the boot of the ball joint and the other surface. It is not a cold chisel, which is what I used after drilling the top rivets. You tap the chisel between the top plate of the ball joint and pry up. That loosens the rivet even more. Then take a 1/4" drift and punch the rivet through the hole. Simple. When you go to separate the upper ball joint from the spindle, use your BFH on the top of the spindle connection. Loosen the castle nut to where it's only on by about 3 full turns. Then whack the front of the spindle lobe where the ball joint seats itself. About 5 GOOD whacks - don't be gentle and it will POP loose. The spindle will drop to where the castle nut is.
If you have brand new shocks installed, they should come out really easy. You probably won't need penetrating fluid. I thought you still had the originals still in there.
The shock has to be removed to take out the spring. Right now my car is sitting with just the upper / lower control arms attached to the spindle holding it all together. Just remember when you're removing castle nuts and separating the ball joints, put a jack under the shock bowl to support the arm. I would loosen the LCA bolt and nut before doing this, you want maximum lowering on the control arm to take out the spring. Once you break the ball joint connection and take off the castle nut, lower the control arm slowly. The spring will be easy to get out then.
Rear springs are way easier to do than fronts, same with rear shocks. If yours are good, leave them for now.
The $3.00 secret? a 2" plumbing end cap and a small 4" square steel plate used on decks. Also pick up a short length of 2" pvc piping (you need less than a foot - maybe you know someone who has a short piece?) Cut the piping into a section that is wide enough to fit between the CA ears where the bushings are. Then cut the piping in half - ending up with 2 sections that look like crankcase bearings. Tap them between the ears of the CA to act as spacers when removing and installing bushings. Keeps the ears from crushing together. When you get to the install I'll tell you about the 2" cap and plate.
If you start a thread on this, I'll monitor it regularly and offer whatever help I can. PM me the name of the thread so I can follow along.
Rob has a thread 'Lady gets a front end job' and I have one still in progress that you've seen "disc plate backing plate'. Both will help you through some of the tough times and maybe give you a laugh when you need it.
Last edited by Allan R; November 9th, 2011 at 07:55 PM. Reason: extra stuff
November 10th, 2011, 07:50 AM
#46
Seasoned beater pilot.
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Chicago
Posts: 5,468
The most fun you will have putting in front springs is on a frame off restoration, with no motor, or body, or ANYTHING to weigh the car down. It's not as simple as jacking the lower control arm up into place, because the whole frame will go up with it.
That's why I had to use the chains.
That's why I had to use the chains.
November 10th, 2011, 08:44 AM
#47
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Montreal, QC
Posts: 2,175
Rob,
I'm been subscribed to that thread for some time and have definitely been watching you progress and especially admired the final product. I will read through it again as i definitely have some questions that pop into my mind.
Up here in Montreal, we have to do a government mechanical inspection to get our cars on the road if they've been in storage more than a year. Suspension is one of the last things on my "must complete" list to get my cutlass in driving condition. So i do appreciate all the support from you guys, in hopes that i can get 'er done!
Sounds good allan, thanks for the description. I will try exactly that. Just to confirm. When i weild my BFH and get ready to give those 5 good whacks, i'm whacking the spindle lobe right? Not the balljoint? Is this to separate the balljoint from the UCA or the spindle from the balljoint?
Sorry for the confusion, what i meant to say was the original shocks are still on the car. But i have squeaky clean AC Delco shocks boxed and ready to go in! So i'm going to soak those with penetrating fluid tonight.
Okay cool, and the shock will come out the top control arm? The bottom hole is kind of slotted and looks to small for my shock..
So i dont need a spring compressor to remove the shock either? I will soak the LCA nuts tonight to help removal. Once the castle nuts are removed. I'll stand out of the way and make sure to lower it like i'm lowering the car off the jack stand. Should i be worried about the spring popping out? or will it stay in the control arms?
The shock has to be removed to take out the spring. Right now my car is sitting with just the upper / lower control arms attached to the spindle holding it all together. Just remember when you're removing castle nuts and separating the ball joints, put a jack under the shock bowl to support the arm. I would loosen the LCA bolt and nut before doing this, you want maximum lowering on the control arm to take out the spring. Once you break the ball joint connection and take off the castle nut, lower the control arm slowly. The spring will be easy to get out then.
I will definitely get a thread started on this and hopefully we'll get alot of laughs!
One question on the PVC mechanism to keep the control arm ears from buckling. Is a PVC pipe strong enough to withstand that crushing force? Or should i look for something a bit more sturdy??
I noticed in rob's post this picture, is that what you're talking about?
I really hope this isint going to turn into a "might as well" frame off 
I'm been subscribed to that thread for some time and have definitely been watching you progress and especially admired the final product. I will read through it again as i definitely have some questions that pop into my mind.
Up here in Montreal, we have to do a government mechanical inspection to get our cars on the road if they've been in storage more than a year. Suspension is one of the last things on my "must complete" list to get my cutlass in driving condition. So i do appreciate all the support from you guys, in hopes that i can get 'er done!
Tony, take some deep breaths and locate the thread "Lady gets a front end job".
Read the whole thing, step by step, while sober... Your suspension will be the same as mine, so disassembly and reassembly will be similar.
Take note of the tips and tricks i did. I did it on a budget, so i got the $3 worth of pipe fittings and a couple big washers.
Read the whole thing, step by step, while sober... Your suspension will be the same as mine, so disassembly and reassembly will be similar.
Take note of the tips and tricks i did. I did it on a budget, so i got the $3 worth of pipe fittings and a couple big washers.
You tap the chisel between the top plate of the ball joint and pry up. That loosens the rivet even more. Then take a 1/4" drift and punch the rivet through the hole. Simple. When you go to separate the upper ball joint from the spindle, use your BFH on the top of the spindle connection. Loosen the castle nut to where it's only on by about 3 full turns. Then whack the front of the spindle lobe where the ball joint seats itself. About 5 GOOD whacks - don't be gentle and it will POP loose. The spindle will drop to where the castle nut is.
So i dont need a spring compressor to remove the shock either? I will soak the LCA nuts tonight to help removal. Once the castle nuts are removed. I'll stand out of the way and make sure to lower it like i'm lowering the car off the jack stand. Should i be worried about the spring popping out? or will it stay in the control arms?
The shock has to be removed to take out the spring. Right now my car is sitting with just the upper / lower control arms attached to the spindle holding it all together. Just remember when you're removing castle nuts and separating the ball joints, put a jack under the shock bowl to support the arm. I would loosen the LCA bolt and nut before doing this, you want maximum lowering on the control arm to take out the spring. Once you break the ball joint connection and take off the castle nut, lower the control arm slowly. The spring will be easy to get out then.
One question on the PVC mechanism to keep the control arm ears from buckling. Is a PVC pipe strong enough to withstand that crushing force? Or should i look for something a bit more sturdy??
I noticed in rob's post this picture, is that what you're talking about?
The most fun you will have putting in front springs is on a frame off restoration, with no motor, or body, or ANYTHING to weigh the car down. It's not as simple as jacking the lower control arm up into place, because the whole frame will go up with it.
That's why I had to use the chains.
That's why I had to use the chains.
November 10th, 2011, 09:34 AM
#48
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Plano, TX
Posts: 11,798
Do them with the ball joint nuts on, but loosened about 2-3 turns. Have the lower control arm jacked up all the way to do the lower, as the spring tension will help pop itapart.
Next, remove the upper arm rubber bumper and insert a block of wood in its place. Lower the lower arm and spring tension will be tranferred to the upper arm - whack the upper lobe to pop it loose.
So i dont need a spring compressor to remove the shock either? I will soak the LCA nuts tonight to help removal. Once the castle nuts are removed. I'll stand out of the way and make sure to lower it like i'm lowering the car off the jack stand. Should i be worried about the spring popping out? or will it stay in the control arms?
Spring compressor not required.
One question on the PVC mechanism to keep the control arm ears from buckling. Is a PVC pipe strong enough to withstand that crushing force? Or should i look for something a bit more sturdy??
I noticed in rob's post this picture, is that what you're talking about?
I noticed in rob's post this picture, is that what you're talking about?
November 10th, 2011, 09:57 AM
#49
Just an Olds Guy
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Edmonton, AB. And "I am Can 'eh' jun - eh"
Posts: 24,525
Sounds good allan, thanks for the description. I will try exactly that. Just to confirm. When i weild my BFH and get ready to give those 5 good whacks, i'm whacking the spindle lobe right? Not the balljoint? Is this to separate the balljoint from the UCA or the spindle from the balljoint?
Okay cool, and the shock will come out the top control arm? The bottom hole is kind of slotted and looks to small for my shock..
So i dont need a spring compressor to remove the shock either? I will soak the LCA nuts tonight to help removal. Once the castle nuts are removed. I'll stand out of the way and make sure to lower it like i'm lowering the car off the jack stand. Should i be worried about the spring popping out? or will it stay in the control arms?
So i dont need a spring compressor to remove the shock either? I will soak the LCA nuts tonight to help removal. Once the castle nuts are removed. I'll stand out of the way and make sure to lower it like i'm lowering the car off the jack stand. Should i be worried about the spring popping out? or will it stay in the control arms?
Noooo, no spring compressor to take out shocks. Just unbolt the top nut, remove the lower 2 nuts/bolts. Then collapse the shock piston. It should fit out the BOTTOM of the LCA. If you have HD shocks they will have 2 flat sides. Find them and rotate the shock so the 'thin' part will now fit through the LCA hole. Easy. That's what happened to me. You MUST take the shock out before attempting to take out the springs. It's ok. The spring tension will be held by the UCA and LCA ball joint connections to the spindle.
Spring removal is easy (now). I assume you've already removed the front stabilizer and it's links? If not, do it now. You need new link kits and front bushings anyway. It also attaches to the LCA so you need it out of the way. (you can clean it and paint it while it's out - same with the bushing holders.)
1. Support the LCA with a jack.
2. Loosen castle nuts about 3 turns.
3. Whack the spindle lobes (upper/lower) to break the BJ connections.
4. Remove the castle nuts and lower the CA until you have enough room to remove the spindle. BTW, you should check the condition of your steering linkages and idler beforehand. If they need to be replaced, break the BJ connection on the outer tie rod end before removing the spindle. It makes things easier. That's where the pickle fork comes in - even if it damages the boot you'll be replacing it anyway. I did all new steering linkages. (IF you elect to rebuild, the ONLY components you need are: both inner/out tie rods, idler arm and sleeves. The pitman arm off the steering box doesn't get removed. And the center link can just be cleaned up, painted and reused. That will cut down on costs) I just checked my NAPA bills for the parts (wholesale) and it came to 284 + tax. That includes upper/lower ball joints, inner/outer tie rods, sleeves, idler arm.
5. Lower the LCA to the floor.
6. Sit in front of the LCA and gently push it back with your feet. It will give a couple inches more room. Gently tug the spring forward. It will have almost no tension left in it but will be at an angle 'backwards'. I wrapped the first one I did with a chain to the CA ear for safety. But the second one I didn't. Just pushed the CA, tugged the spring - Pop! It comes out very easy. Just be prepared to catch it, that's all. About the same as catching a well thrown baseball??
November 11th, 2011, 10:07 AM
#50
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Montreal, QC
Posts: 2,175
Kinda thought that's what you meant, but wasn't 100%. Yeah, soak them good. I find that most of the time if the lower bolts/nuts are badly rusted it's easier and faster to just overtighten them till they break. Install new ones anyway - it's faster and cheap. Use gr 8 bolts / nuts.
I went down to my local Rona and they have plenty gr.8 bolts with the 6 hatch marks right on the shelf. So hopefully when i remove the 7/16'' ones off the car, i can go down to the store and get a nice fitting match.
Definitely got my link kits and bushing from rockauto. For some reason they came out blue?? Not black like the originals. I'm not too concerned about the colour. These seem to be pretty standard so i hope they will fit in well. Here is a picture.
What was the original colour of these suspension parts? Was it glossy black? Or more of a 60% finish? I'll probably buy a tub of corrostop paint. It's what i've used on most of my chassis parts so far and it dries to a pretty hard fininsh.
Last edited by Tony72Cutlass'S'; November 11th, 2011 at 10:10 AM.
November 11th, 2011, 10:21 AM
#51
Just an Olds Guy
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Edmonton, AB. And "I am Can 'eh' jun - eh"
Posts: 24,525
Link kit looks good. Notice it has oversize shaft and bushing cups compared to the old ones? I like that. The ones I got from Partsource are TRW and look just like that and only cost 10.00 /set - no shipping, unlike RockAuto
Suspension part color is in the Assembly manual as a code. I think Rob has the decoder on this. Most of the stuff was satin black. I used gloss black, and NAPA cast for the steering linkages, gearbox, rotor hub, steering knuckle, and spindle. I painted the backing plate and stabilizer bushing mounts silver because that's the closest I could find to original.
Ah, I see you added another pic while I was posting. Good looking parts selection. Don't lose track of them!
Is that Tremclad I see in the background? If you use that stuff instead of caliper or engine enamel you'll be waiting for days for it to cure
November 11th, 2011, 10:27 AM
#52
Just an Olds Guy
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Edmonton, AB. And "I am Can 'eh' jun - eh"
Posts: 24,525
http://www.dominionsureseal.com/prod...d=372&catid=35 I got mine from NAPAs CMAX paint and body shop supplies
November 11th, 2011, 10:33 AM
#53
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Montreal, QC
Posts: 2,175
Cool! Sounds great, i'll take a look at my local Napa and see what they have in terms of chassis paint.
Reason why i was asking about the chassis colour. I was perusing through my 1972 prestige catalogue. And i came across this picture.
All the colours on the engine and suspension are weird. Blue control arms??
Reason why i was asking about the chassis colour. I was perusing through my 1972 prestige catalogue. And i came across this picture.
All the colours on the engine and suspension are weird. Blue control arms??
I wouldn't use WD40 to try and free up a stuck bolt. I've found it doesn't compare to PB Blaster or other good quality penetrating oil. I always used WD more for lubing hinges etc when they get squeaky.
Link kit looks good. Notice it has oversize shaft and bushing cups compared to the old ones? I like that. The ones I got from Partsource are TRW and look just like that and only cost 10.00 /set - no shipping, unlike RockAuto
Suspension part color is in the Assembly manual as a code. I think Rob has the decoder on this. Most of the stuff was satin black. I used gloss black, and NAPA cast for the steering linkages, gearbox, rotor hub, steering knuckle, and spindle. I painted the backing plate and stabilizer bushing mounts silver because that's the closest I could find to original.
Ah, I see you added another pic while I was posting. Good looking parts selection. Don't lose track of them!
Is that Tremclad I see in the background? If you use that stuff instead of caliper or engine enamel you'll be waiting for days for it to cure
Link kit looks good. Notice it has oversize shaft and bushing cups compared to the old ones? I like that. The ones I got from Partsource are TRW and look just like that and only cost 10.00 /set - no shipping, unlike RockAuto
Suspension part color is in the Assembly manual as a code. I think Rob has the decoder on this. Most of the stuff was satin black. I used gloss black, and NAPA cast for the steering linkages, gearbox, rotor hub, steering knuckle, and spindle. I painted the backing plate and stabilizer bushing mounts silver because that's the closest I could find to original.
Ah, I see you added another pic while I was posting. Good looking parts selection. Don't lose track of them!
Is that Tremclad I see in the background? If you use that stuff instead of caliper or engine enamel you'll be waiting for days for it to cure
November 11th, 2011, 10:36 AM
#54
Just an Olds Guy
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Edmonton, AB. And "I am Can 'eh' jun - eh"
Posts: 24,525
Tony I think I can explain that to you. That's not what color the factory made them. Its there to highlight and draw attention. If you read the ad, it will talk about the new AC, Suspension, energy bumper, steering improvements etc. The highlight colors just make it easier for non gearheads to see the different areas of the car that are affected. That help?
November 11th, 2011, 10:57 AM
#55
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Montreal, QC
Posts: 2,175
Tony I think I can explain that to you. That's not what color the factory made them. Its there to highlight and draw attention. If you read the ad, it will talk about the new AC, Suspension, energy bumper, steering improvements etc. The highlight colors just make it easier for non gearheads to see the different areas of the car that are affected. That help?
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Texas442
General Discussion
26
March 5th, 2011 10:20 AM
victorferrari
Chassis/Body/Frame
1
August 5th, 2004 05:16 PM
