Just out of curiosity, how much does a numbers matching drivetrain add to the value? I know desirability and how rare the car is comes into play, but as an average across the board, what would you say? 25 percent, 50 percent, or something else?

 

Depends on what car. A V6 Cutlass probably lowers the value. A normal 330 or 350 V8 Cutlass, I'd say 10%. A 442, I'd say 25%. A W car, I'd say 40%.

 

I would not say it ads to the value, its how much value does it subtract when its missing. In my opinion the only cars it makes a difference with are the 442, W-cars, or any of the low production collectables. Any others probably not much. Value also is determined per individual and overall condition of the car itself.

 

Agreed, #'s matching really only matters if its the right #'s IMO. A W30 it adds a lot. An original 307 in an 85 Cutlass? Ehh, not that much.

 

I think a 455 in a Cutlass can actually add value and not be numbers matching. As Eric mentioned, the value is set and then deducts are made for non numbers matching. This applies more to 442's and W cars.

 

If you are asking about your 1972 U-code Supreme, the original drivetrain adds quite a bit to the value of a pretty rare car. Unfortunately, the 1972 U- and V-code cars have not yet received the recognition they deserve in the marketplace. Even 1972 W-30s lag the value of prior year cars, despite being nearly identical to the 71s.

 

On a auto 68 442 HT it currently moves the value from around $25k to $35k however it seems that non numbers matching examples are usually never restored to the level that a numbers matching car is so its hard to make an apples to apples comparison

 

I'll try a slightly different take on this. Given two cars in the same condition, the numbers-matching car SHOULD bring more money. Unfortunately, today's alcohol-fueled auction insanity seems to favor resto-mods over correct cars. Those auctions are frequently more a case of someone with more money than brains having to "win" than worrying about actual value, however.

 

On Fridays, in our Long Island newspaper, Newsday, there's a column written by a professional car appraiser named Steve Linden. He's written a lot about how numbers matching can be faked. Documentation of authenticity is helpful in knowing if the numbers that match are fake or not. I think this important variable needs to be mentioned here. As for verifying the authenticity of the documentation, I guess you just know using your gut, if it looks old and real or not. Buyer beware....

 

Of course VIN derivative stamps can be ground off and restamped. You can buy new blank OW transmission tags on ebay. You can get reproduction window stickers and even build sheets, and procedures to "antique" documents are well known. If there is money to be made, there will be unscrupulous sellers. We've brought this on ourselves by putting such a high value on certain cars that were only intended to be cars when they were built.

 

& having rock solid proof that its actually a W30 through the VIN. Doesn't really make any sense.

It was always curious to me that U was 455 Auto, V was 455 manual, but X was W30 w/out designating auto or manual

 

Do they still run his column? I used to by Newday on Fridays for his column but it became so hit or miss if they ran it & the price went up too much. Nice guy & knowledgeable. I had a few interesting conversations with him through E-Mail based on his columns

https://www.stevelinden.com/

 

Maybe some sort of Federal tracking regulation of fun cars.

 

It's interesting that I often see non-numbers matching older cars. I don't think I've ever seen a thread on stamps and numbers for 50s or older Oldsmobiles. These cars seem to be candidates for an immediate LS1 swap.

 

Oldsmobile didn't start stamping VIN derivatives until the 1968 model year. More to the point, you won't see a thread on number matching stamps on a four door Cutlass, either. There's no demand and thus no value. This phenomena is pretty much restricted to high value musclecars and Corvettes.

 

Now for the flip side of the coin, take a restored numbers matching plain jane SB Cutlass with hubcaps vs a used to be plain jane with an added non original 455/overdrive trans and a posi. A tasteful set of wheels, tires, dual exhaust, and color scheme. The modded one will net more money. It does work in reverse.

 

Again, because there in no market for a bottom feeder Cutlass. The OP's car is a desirable and relatively rare factory big block Supreme. Big difference.

 

I thought the question was generic.

 

The OP has posted about two dozen threads in the last week about his recently acquired U-code Supreme, including photos of the VIN derivative stamps. I'm pretty sure his question is about his particular car.

 

You would be correct😀... and going forward I will try to be more specific😀

 

I did as well, that's why I mentioned older Oldsmobiles. A pre-war or 50s Oldsmobile will fetch more money with the OE drivetrain vs. an LS1 and 700R4.

 

Yes, they still run his column. Seldom is there a Friday paper without one. When there isn't one, I assume he's traveling, just too busy, or had nothing to write about in time for publication. I had a brief, polite email exchange with him also. He has a lot to say about how different insurance companies cover things, since as a professional appraiser he is often called as an expert witness to testify. His knowledge is quite valuable, so it's worth it to me to get the Friday paper. The auto section also lists car shows coming up that weekend. To car fans, it's useful.

 

On pre 68 Olds, two restored cars, such as my 62' Starfire, both with ohauled engines and trans. One 394 and slimjim original to the car it came out of and the other a Ross 394 and 700r4 trans. Which has the value?
Thanks Dennis