TenMidgets

Caught some of the Las Vegas auction that just took place and understand some of the prices paid are completely inflated. But even knowing that, I was surprised that the 1970 Cutlass / W30 recreation sold for a staggering $68K! Perhaps it was a high end restoration, but the car was still born a Cutlass so really changed my perception of the market.

http://www.barrett-jackson.com/Event...ERTIBLE-186924

Is this just fluky? Would like to hear others thoughts...

pogo69

What a joke new owner must have more money than brains...70k for a cutlass?? Wonder how the body tag/vin reads maybe this car will show up as a ''real w30'' one day

oldcutlass

I also watched some go through for a lot less than I thought they should bring.

TenMidgets

To clarify, do you mean 442's specifically or in general?

If you're speaking about other models I would agree, but the 442's all seemed to generate top dollar bidding.

dc2x4drvr

Was this W30 the yellow vert?

TenMidgets

No it was black, see link above.

The yellow one sold for over $100K.

oldcutlass

Other models, I didn't get to see the Olds's go through and have been too busy to look them up.

joe_padavano

^^^ DING DING DING

The one thing I've learned is that auctions aren't about the cars. They are about winning. I've been to farm auctions where a used piece of equipment sold for more than you could buy the same thing new. People get caught up in needing to win and common sense goes out the window. Unfortunately, these reports are what make every seller think his P.O.S. is worth a million bucks.

droldsmorland

$$$≠brains! Not by a long shot. Yes egos do tend to rule at these Barnum n Bailey 3 ring Spectacle of events. In my mind I dont here the B&J theme song but rather the Barnum n Bailey one...

442rocketdave

I keep a close eye on those auctions and the Vegas auction in my opinion was a flop many people had cars sell for way less than they were worth and some like the Cutlass were out of the park but overall it was a terrible show for the people selling and many people got great cars for super cheap! many cars were selling for less than 20 thousand dollars and you cannot restore a car for much less unless the labor is free and you dont count your time but if you pay for a restoration you absolutely cannot restore a vintage muscle car for less so somebody lost alot of money at that show! They were probably dupped into believing no reserve did not make a difference! I call BS on that.

wr1970

x2

oldcutlass

Ebay ended listings is more of an indication of value than BJ. All BJ auctions tell you is how stupid people with money can be.

jensenracing77

Mine is not a convertible but he could have had my real one for not much more.

Railguy

I have a theory that alot of those cars that sell so high are bought by people that are making lot of money in the restoration business. And by doing so are creating higher prices and more interest in the business. I know there are beff bulls that sell for crazy high prices and I heard recently that some of them sell really or don't sell because there's a really high reserve on them people know this and bid right up to the reserve. It "doesn't sell" but it creates at false seance of the worth of the bull.
Railguy

68442

BJ is not reality in the car hobby or market. It is "PURE ENTERTAINMENT" For wealthy people with expendable income. They go there to socialize and spend money. We tune in to be entertained . It's like going to the zoo to watch the animals in the cage. They are far from stupid. I have a close friend i have known all my life who is one who attends and buys and sells, he has money, has his friends in that circle and goes to socialize. The sad part is it has inflated the market and that will never change. As a hobbiest it has cut out alot of people from enjoying the hobby due to it's cost. The 70 W-30 has to be the most over inflated overrated car to come of age in the auction market.

Charlie Jones

Why do you think the alcohol flows so freely at many of these events?
BECAUSE IT MAKES PEOPLE STUPID!!

stevengerard

Although I agree with you, its not limited to the W30. Most muscle cars are overpriced.

jensenracing77

Weather it is overpriced or not, It is why I can not keep mine. If it is true what they bring, mine will have a new owner. I can't justify keeping it if I can almost pay off my house.

My442

A large number of the more expensive cars are used for tax purposes.


The car is bought as a business asset, and then the owner takes depreciation from the purchase.


The depreciation offsets some of the other income.


And, a lot of the people who buy these cars are checkbook restorers, and never do any work on them.

joe_padavano

Same as the alcohol in casinos...

joe_padavano

DING DING DING...

Why do you think companies like Inline Tube have expensive restored musclecars? They are used in marketing for the company, making them a business asset that can be depreciated. The rest of us are subsidizing those restorations with our income taxes.

BlackGold

....Which is especially ironic, since cars (and other collectables) are the only assets for which you MUST pay capital gains if you make money but CANNOT deduct against your other capital gains if you sell at a loss.

stevengerard

I'm too stupid to sell mine.

You don't want to know what I paid for mine. Decades ago there wasn't much difference in pricing for a 442 vs a W30. I could now put a couple of my kids through college. Hmmm....

joe_padavano

I'm not a big fan of watching car auctions, but thanks to the rain I spent a lot of time at the auction run in conjunction with Fall Carlisle.

Bottom line is that the vast majority of the cars that crossed the block did NOT meet reserve. Interestingly, after the auction, many of these cars had SOLD signs on them, so apparently there's dealing that goes on after the fact. There were a couple of interesting sales that I did see, however. A nice-looking 1968 Cutlass sold for $7500 when the seller lifted the reserve. I would have predicted closer to $8K-10K. A 1966 442 with tripower, 4speed, and a bunch of other desirable options (which may or may not have been installed at the factory) went for $50K. That was higher than I expected. The yellow 1968 faux-four-two with the bronze 350 motor that I mentioned in the Fall Carlisle thread was unsold when I walked into the auction hall but later had a sold sign on it.

joe_padavano

Update: I just checked the Carlisle auction results. The 1968 faux-four-two convertible sold for $37,500. For a CLONE!

By the way, nowhere does the consignment description call this car anything other than a "442". I checked the VIN when I looked at the car - it's a clone.

chip-powell

This is one reason why I have always enjoyed the Mecum auctions much more than Barrett Jackson's. There are many more "drivers" for sale there and the prices usually reflect that. Watching Mecum always makes me feel like "I could afford that."