I know that the Pertronix versus points has been a long running debate and there are several threads on it. In the past I have usually come down on the side of Petronix. Probably one of my reasons for this is the fact the factory distributor on the 54 (through 55) is such a pain in the ***. First off it has clips on the distributor cap. And then you have to set the points with a feeler gauge. The distributor is on the back of the engine and the points are on the back side of the distributor. The only way I have been able to set them accurately is to take the distributor out of the car. So my thought was to put in the Pertronix and forget about it. The first one died and left me on the side of the road and I came home on a flatbed. I went back to points. Then two years ago I am at a show 235 miles from home and the Chinese condenser craps out. I changed it and when I got home I went back to Pertronix. Last year we were on a little trip and about 80-90 miles from home. The car developed a miss and we limped home. It was the magnetic ring. Ordered one from Pertronix. Three weeks ago we went to an AACA meeting about 45 miles from out home. Car did okay and I parked in the drive when we got home. When I went out to pull the car in the garage it had a miss. Next day I change the magnetic ring (I had a spare now) and it ran fine. I called Pertronix and talked to a tech and he said he had never known of magnetic ring going bad. I said I have had two of them. He said he would send me another one but never did. Since I no longer trusted Pertronix I put the distributor back in the car with some NOS Delco make in the USA points and condenser. In the mean time I had bought a 56 distributor on ebay. It was listed as a core but the price was right. This was the first year of external adjustment points. I also bought an NOS vacuum advance at the same time. This distributor got here after I had the original 54 distributor back in the car. I put this distributor in the vise and soaked it with PB Blaster since the shaft would not turn. I then took a pipe wrench and began turning the shaft. I kept on until I could spine it by hand. I put new Delco points, condenser, rotor and cap in it. I put it in the car and was able to accurately set the dwell at 30°. I then set the timing and the old gal starts and idles perfectly. I took it for a test drive and the car has never run that good. When it downshifts into passing gear it really takes off. I bought a NOS made in the USA set of multiset points and condenser to carry in the toolbox. If need be I could change the points and condenser on the side of the road or in a parking lot in about 10 minutes. I also carry my old Sears (made in the USA0 tack/dwell meter in the trunk. It is probably 45 years old and still in the original box. So maybe I got a little carried away with this post. It is probably the longest post I have ever made on here. Tedd and Eric, I am in the court with you guys now. If I ever in my life think about putting a Pertronix ignition in a car, I want you to ban me from this site Eric and you all can tell everybody what and idiot I am.
That is all for the moment.

Glenn

 

Now why would anyone want to ban you? I've always said there is nothing more reliable than a points ignition system. I've never used a Pertronix setup personally but have helped many install and set theirs up. Frankly, on my current engine I went with an HEI (unavailable for your car) only because I had one laying around. Its the first vintage car I've ever used an electronic distributor on and it works fine.

 

I have always ran contact points/condenser in every vehicle I have ever owned which was designed to run on contact points/condenser - the simplest most reliable ignition system ever made, IMO. I will never run any electronic distributor and/or points/condenser on any vehicle or piece of equipment not designed to run an electronic ignition system. I have never had a more trustworthy ignition system than contact points/condenser. I perform my timing w/ a 50 year old Sears timing light in its original carton. Simplest is the best for me.

 

When I had my 72 Cutlass one of the first things I did was put an original GM HEI in it. In my opinion it was a great improvement. But there is a big difference in it and Pertronix. One of the things to avoid on a points ignition is to avoid the chineseum points and condenser. After my first Pertronix went out I went back to points and condenser. I don't remember the brand but they were from china. Two years ago we were down at the Veterans Car Show in Bastrop which is about 235 miles from here. The morning of the show the car would barely start and I didn't think I would make the 2 miles to Main Street. Turns out it was the chineseum condenser that hardly had any miles on it. I had a spare set that got us home. Although I did put the made in Mexico Delco parts in my rebuilt 56 distributor I had Delco uniset that is made in the USA that I bought off ebay. I am not sure what my coil is but I should probably find a made in the USA Delco coil. I do have a lot more piece of mind now.

 

No love for Pertronix here either

Had a conversion kit in a '72 Skylark 350 distributor that failed just a bit outside their warranty period while I was traveling locally one day, had to flatbed it home. Replaced the entire distributor with an Accel ready-to-run unit and good to go for the next few years until I eventually sold the car at such time I picked up my current '72 Cutlass ragtop.

Not one to learn my lesson, caught a sale on a new complete Pertronix electronic distributor (ready-to-run) for my SBO and true to form, it also crapped out in much the same fashion just outside its warranty period. Now running MSD electronic distributor and all has been well going on 3 years...

 

About the same here. A friend of mine had one and gave it to me. I had the original points distributor set up very well with NAPA Echlin (Accel) 23 ounce points, NAPA Echlin (Accel) condenser, Accel Super Coil, premium NAPA cap, rotor, and wires but I said what the heck and installed the HEI. Set it up with the original GM module, Accel HEI Super Coil, NAPA cap and rotor, Accel plug wires and it's been running with ZERO issues since 1985 (?). So about 35 years in my car without a hiccup.

 

If a GM HEI was available for my 54 that is what I would be running. I ran one in my 72 Cutlass for over 20 years with no problems. Way better than the Petronix junk.

 

Ignition points work great, they just take some regular maintenance. It was common to adjust points and set ignition timing every 6 months or so, and replaced the points yearly to keep things in tip-top shape.

Since these cars aren’t normally used now as daily drivers, 6 months then is the equivalent of several years today.

Unfortunately, like almost everything today, it’s hard to find quality parts for something that old and “obsolete”.

 

ebay is your friend. Just look for old Delco Remy NOS parts. I was a parts guy for a Buick dealer from 64 to 66. I can still remember the part numbers for the external adjustment points (1931988) and condenser (1932004). I don't remember the number for the uniset because I think it had just come out. You can find them on ebay and they are not crazy priced. I remember the part numbers but I don't remember the prices. Probably a good thing.

 

Glad you saw the light Glenn. Cheepo points can be spotted in a second by their fisikal light weight (thin)appearance and smaller narrower point caps which are flash coated and won't take a filing without removing the coating.

I'm with you on the 56 cap unfortunately I Am still running a 55 distributor and cap but maybe next time I need to change points I'll have the other guy put one in. Can't do the lean over and reach the distributor thing anymore but I know how to point at them...... Tedd

 

I've never been a fan of the uniset combo. I go for the heavy duty points for performance engines and the separate condenser.

 

Tedd I have a plastic stool on each side of my car. When I had to change them in the parking lot of the hotel a couple years ago I stood on my toolbox. Of course on the old distributor you had to remove the points to change the condenser. Hate that damn distributor. Eric I remember you not liking the uniset. Why? I did put the Delco High Performance points and separate condenser in the new distributor. I have a uniset in the trunk for emergencies. We will be going on the NTOC fall tour next weekend in East Texas. I won't have to worry about a damn pertronix flaking out on me.

 

Mixed bag for me. I ran a Pertronix I lobe sensing unit on my 350. Ran flawless for something like 15 years.

Tried a Pertronix III distributor a few years ago and just had endless erratic spark problems.

 

I run later stuff from the mid-60’s (ha!), but can report that 1) HEI is a great solution for the ‘65-76 455’s, but you have to keep a spare module in the glove box; 2) I ran MSD Hall Effect distributor in the 80’s and it failed after a year or so. Left me by the side of the road. Ugh. 3) If I had a 50’s era car, I think I’d go points & condenser too. Mechanical, simple, well understood _&_ reliable.

Sorry to hear you got stranded, but after 38 years or so, I’ve concluded that GM had a lot more testing opportunity & experience than the aftermarket has ever subjected themselves to. My favorite example is down the Holley carburetor road & back to a strong preference for quadrajets for the past 30 years.

I’ve done a bunch of work in China and have no great animosity there. Still, manufacturers there first consider cost, then everything else, including quality. So over here we wind up with inexpensive less reliable parts from there. The sad part is that we don’t have many alternatives except NOS parts which are getting rarer by the day. I have a running joke with a friend that Germany is the anti-China — first they consider quality, then everything else, including cost.

Net of all this is I do NOS where I can, repair where I need, and fall back to replacement parts where necessary. And I date the replacement parts so I know when they were put in...

What little I know
Chris

 

I'm still running points in my '68. The car runs great! Got them from my local Napa. They've been in there since '12. It even still has the original coil. I have no plans on ever putting in electronic ignition! I check the dwell every spring. My dwell meter is almost as old as I am!!!. GMs HEI was a great setup but it just doesn't look right in an older car, plus with the the Edelbrock O4B intake I have on the car the HEI wouldn't fit, it's tight against the stock cap!

 

This thread and other things I have heard about Pertronics scare me. When I bought my 71 Cutlass I installed a HEI unit out of a later Olds. I had to beat the back of the air cleaner to make it fit. I had multiple failures with that-( Module and pick up coil) Later I dug out the original distributor and Installed the cheapest Pertronics kit I got off ebay in it using the original coil. Since then no troubles at all. Been probably 10 years. Works great and I do take the car for long distance trips. But like I said I have heard many stories of the Pertonics failing. Well maybe I should carry a extra kit or some points??

 

I changed the distributor in my '55 to a '56. It's always done well with quality parts in it.
I changed the distributor in my '65 442 to an HEI. For a while it had an MSD "box" on it, but the box failed. I abandoned the box. Now it's just the HEI, but I always carry spare parts, especially the module. Anyone with a semi-conductor controlled ignition should always carry backup.

 

Greg, I had one in a boat and it worked for years. I guess there are some good ones and some bad ones. Maybe quality has diminished over the years.

 

Completely agree! Just put a Pertronix on my 76 Cutlass Supreme, seemed to run pretty good.... for a little less than a month! She's in the shop right now getting a new Distributor (NON-Pertronix) (had to get her towed, died on my way to work...) Will NEVER buy pertronix again. Sadly I did that before I saw this thread... Hoping I might be able to get my money back (bought through Summit). Buyer beware!

 

I'm wondering why you replaced the factory HEI with a Pertronix setup?

 

Well, the HEI that was on the car was already installed when I bought the car and had no label or anything that stated what model it was or even what company made it. That and the fact that I had two ignition modules die in it since I've had the car, I decided to swap out for a performance brand name that reportedly was good quality. I learned...

 

After reading some of the hassles people have had with the eBay HEI, I think it would prefer to find a used factory HEI and replace all the wear items with quality parts.

The first couple years of HEI did have module reliability issues, but Delco quickly got it figured out.

If you had asked me 10 years ago my opinion on the most reliable factory ignition system, without a doubt a HEI with a old Delco ignition module. Unfortunately, like so many other things in life, manufacturers found ways to cut corners and save a couple pennies, and reliability suffered. I think I would still rather have a 20 year old Delco module in the distributor, with a spare good used 20 year old Delco module in the glove box over today’s cheap parts store junk.

 

The other option is HEI distributor triggering a MSD ignition box. About as reliable as you can get.

It’s pretty easy to make a jumper harness to plug in a ignition module to bypass the MSD box on the rare occasion it would fail.

I have a run stand to make sure engines are good and leak free before installation. Since my distributor is set up for the MSD, I used the leftover parts included in the MSD box to make my ignition system. Screw the module to a large chunk of aluminum to dissipate heat, works great.

 

One of the things I have found on ignition parts is to go to ebay and find the older NOS Delco stuff that is made in the USA. Delco stuff today is made in Mexico and may be better than the junk made in china. In my opinion the stuff made in china is pure junk.

 

That is exactly what my car has.

 

Same here...my Pertronix III finally died in the middle of the street two driveways from home a few months ago. Replaced it with Holley’s new Dual Sync EFI distributor. Wow...night and day difference. It finally runs right.

 

Glad to hear your car is running well Les. Do you think that the multispark system built into the Pertronix III was causing your issues?

 

Eric - No, I don't believe that's what it was. I did extensive research on P III failures and I had all the symptoms of heat-related internal electronics failure that were gradually getting worse over time, including total engine shutdown at idle after the engine was up to normal operating temp and driven for just a little bit. P-III's can't seem to take the heat over time.

Holley's new (Gen 2) Olds Dual Sync distributor for their EFI system(s) is ****. I can't believe how much better my engine runs with it. It wasn't available when the engine was first built and equipped with the Terminator system. I held off on the Dual Sync Gen 1 version due to reliability issues - mostly mechanical - with their first attempt a couple of years ago. The Gen 2 is significantly redesigned because of that. Not difficult to install either if one follows ALL the install procedures. It's running 5-6F cooler @ the radiator and there are no drivability issues at all. It's the right solution if one is using Holley EFI, in my opinion.

I'm happy help others in our group with Holley EFI questions as I'm able, due to my work schedule. Holley's EFI forum on their website is a great knowledge base resource. It's sectioned into Terminator, Dominator, and Sniper info plus General threads.

Cheers, Les

 

I realize this thread is fairly out of date. But I just stumbled across it. Seems to me that the Petronix III system is not up to par! I usually research everything to death but for some reason I purchased this and starting the install with out even considering if there even was a downside. Im halfway thru the install and came inside to grab a drink and for some reason Ive pulled up Petronix Installs on here....now I dont know what to think and my car is 1/2 way torn apart. CRAP!!!


My car is a 71 442 with the 455 all stock setup.

 

finish the install keep a set of points nearby

if the car runs like crap after go back to points

sometimes pertronix work good sometimes they just run like crap and some of the time they dont work at all

 

Good advice from RetroRanger. Even though I started this thread I would do exactly as he recommended. One guy in our club has been running one for 15 years. I was not so luckly. You already have it installed so go with it.

 

i appreciate the responses. I just hate wasting my time and money. My fault for not doing my due diligence. Normally I would just add an MSD type of ignition and never look back but with this car looking so stock ..my thought were to just give this a shot. We will see how this goes…stay tuned

and again thanks ..did not mean to hijack your thread

 

Glad to help and you did not hijack the thread. Good luck with your car.

 

Glenn, you and others with the "early" style Olds distributors may want to check out Dave Ray's site, https://www.davessmallbodyheis.com. He does the conversion process to most distributors to remove the points and utilize the HEI module with a Ford style (also MSD style) pickup assembly. He has had a health problem due to a spider bite on his hand and also some hip problems but is getting back to good health according to info he posts on his site. Hopefully he shall be getting back to his conversion business in the near future. For any of you with the early style distributor who wish to keep using points, I have two sets of Mallory #100 points (NOS) still in the original packages which I would like to offer up for $12.00 each or $20.00 the pair shipped to the lower 48.

 

Thanks for the heads up Jim. I wound up putting a 56 distributor in my 54. It has external adjustment points and is lots better. I went to ebay and got old genuine NOS Delco Remy points and condenser. I will be selling the 54 soon so I will leave it alone. I have heard of the guy you mention and it sounds like a good solution.

 

BEWARE: Thread hi-jack! I saw you put new brakes on the 75 Hurst. You putting on some miles?

 

Nah Norm. The ones that were on it had lots of wear left but they squeaked pretty bad so I replaced them with some super duper ones that are not supposed to squeak. We are doing the first road trip in it next weekend to the Veterans Day show down in Bastrop, Texas which is about 235 miles each way. There will be 400 cars there. We have been four times in the 54. It is a big event for those of us in the NTOC. I am looking forward to the event and the trip.

 

I have used many Hall Effect breakerless modules and never had a failure. They are a one wire unit and once installed,you can forget them. They fit into the OEM distributor with no modifications needed. There several vendors for them like M&H Electric,American Auto Wire and some on eBay.