OKIEOLDS

I am going to have to buy new 1/4 panels for my 70 cutlass supreme vert. Has anyone had good results from any aftermarket panels if so please let me know, and which ones to stay away from....thanks in advance

oldsconv

First, I would recommend the full panels that are sold now for around $450 each versus a $250 skin. I think the only conpany who makes full ones is Goodmark and they are sold thru a bunch of different parts suppliers. For a convertible, these are much easier to install than skins because they attach at all factory points. i.e. include full door jamb, into trunk, etc so your welding is hidden. Only part exposed is like factory where top of quarter (horizontal surface) connects to panel between trunk lid and conv top well and this short 6-8 inch length was leaded at factory after spot welding, so you would do the same (or use bondo). The cheaper partial 1/4 skins require a long weld horizontally along the side which can warp or the paint can crack later if not done well. Also, the partial skins do not include door jamb, so you have another long vertical seam there. I installed a pair of full repro quarters on my 70 SX conv and they fit pretty well. NOS is usually the best route, but these repro full 1/4's fit pretty well with minimal tweaking for me and much cheaper than NOS.

Second, you probably need new outer wheelhouses as well (and trunk drop-off panels). I originally bought my outer WH's from a supplier who said hardtop, coupe and convertible outer wheelhouses are all the same. They are far from the same. I returned those and got convertible specific outer wheelhouses from the Parts Place in Chicago and they fit very well. My inner wheelhouses were mostly good with just a small patch needed.

gearheads78

They all come from the same dies in China. If you can't patch what you have or find NOS I would still buy them. Just don't expect them to fit as nice as OEM. Its no problem making them fit right just more time involved.

csstrux

check Tamraz auto parts in chicago area www.tamraz.com they seem to have the best prices and excellent customer service, I usually talk to Dave, I think his ext is 111 phone number should be on the website. they have the goodmark sheetmetal, as well as the imported stuff. As I understand, sometimes the imported stuff is actually higher quality than the domestic, so you will want to ask assuming you call.

gearheads78

Unforfunatly Goodmark is just as imported as the rest of it About the only things I have seen USA made is floors

OKIEOLDS

I found a guy who has some NOS panels but he want 2700.00 for the pair I thought that was a little high what do yall think

ent72olds

Don't be afraid to try a good used clean dry set from out west. Maybe Desert Valley. I've dealt with them in the past and am waiting on left and right dogleg, wheelhouse and wheel opening sections and they are cutting them exactly where I want them. I can install at the factory points inside the door jamb and inside the wheel house. Nothing like original sheetmetal. Only problem is shipping can get pricey if you don't live out that way.

OKIEOLDS

Desert valley is the name of the place you get them from?

gearheads78

The price above sounds a little high of NOS 800-900 each would be more realistic I would think. (unless I owned them it would sound like a good price )

Its worth a shot just make sure shipping does not make you wish you got NOS. Also keep in mind the is about 3X the work to put on a used 1/4 since you have to trim the used panel clean the part, cut out out the spot welds ect.

http://www.dvap.com/

csstrux

WELL THAT SUCKS That's news to me, is that something new, or has it been that way all along?

oldsconv

It hasn't been that way all the time, but at least in the last 10-15 years. Some of the stuff is not bad as they find original dies and just stamp them in China/Taiwan. When they have to create a new die from an NOS or used part, then I don;t think it is perfect. I am as buy American as you can get, but I could only find left side in NOS, so ended up buying a pair of repros. My floors and trunk floors are US made - I looked hard for those.


It is the old game - someone could make these parts in the US but labor/env laws increases the cost so they would have to charge more. I would be happy to pay more to keep it in the US and have better quality. The average consumer is a cheapskate, so when they see two similar products anywhere (grocery store, K-mart, car parts, etc.), they typically buy the cheaper one, so the more expensive US items either get farmed out to overseas or that company goes out of business - so that process continues to drive manufacturing overseas. Look at a cheap starter motor or master cyclinder rebuild from PepBoys, done in Mexico - they used to cost more 20-30 years ago than today, but were rebuilt in the US, properly. I went thru 3 master cylinders ($18) from Advance Auto before I had one that did not leak - guaranteed for life, yes, but a PIA to take on/off 3 times and potential for car accident. How could I expect to get something decent for $18. I finally found a correct core in the junkyard and sent it out to VA for sleeving, etc. Much more costly, but it will last forever and I feel safe. Cheap kids crayons made in CHina and then people are so "surprised" or "outraged" that they get recalled for lead or mercury. Buy the Crayola brand made in PA for a few cents more. I look at almost everything I buy to make sure. Anyway, I will step down from my soapbox now and get back to the welding on my made in China repro rocker panel (only one I could find!!).

OKIEOLDS

That is true, I do need some new outer wheel wells also, I parted out a cutlass last year and kept the 1/4 panels on it they have the typical rust at bottom back but above the wheels seem good and wheel wells are good maybe i will just trim these up and patch them to work since i have them here already.

OKIEOLDS

GOOD SOAP BOX BROTHER !!! I agree with you totally.

csstrux

X2

OKIEOLDS

Has anyone had any problems with when you cut the 1/4 panels off a vert that the body shifts and the panel won line up right...I read it in a thread somewhere it happened, just curious.

gearheads78

I would make sure it sitting on the suspension and weld cross braces inside before you start cutting. It cheap and easy insurance so it does not happen.

joe_padavano

Yes, professional shops weld in lots of cross bracing before doing any cutting, particularly on convertibles. This isn't a place to cut corners. Take lots of "before" measurements, write everything down, document with photos, and brace thoroughly.

OKIEOLDS

thanks for verifying that guys it will save me even more gray hair.

bccan

A few comments-

1) NOS qtrs best hands down, Goodmarks generally good. The cheaters I've used & seen were fine but haven't used one in 8-10 years now so the tooling & suppliers likely have changed. I seem to see NOS for $1000-1200 ea on average and will take the least labor to use. Cheaters reqire a lot of body work(even inside trunk etc to cover splice) if you want them to come out nice. I think in the end the Goodmarks are probably best comprimise of result vs labor vs cost. Shipping can wreak havoc on what any of these cost you, be sure to take that into account.

2) W/ full qtrs, if possible use lead on qtr to deck panel as it seems less susceptible to cracking. Body filler or seam sealer(catalyzed or not) tends to crack. I am now seeing this seam welded solid which seems to yield best results & reliabilty(ie cracking), then it is safe to use body filler to either cover seam smooth(vert)or grind weld to "rough out" an imitation visible seam(hardtop) & finish w/ a little filler.

3) Shouldn't need a lot of bracing as long as 1 panel done@ a time. You want to make sure deck panel doesn't droop and inner qtr @ door jamb doesn't move. The more inner panels that are rotted or cut apart, the more you have to be careful about movement. As long as car hasn't been bent and frame/body mounts have decent integrity, not much should move on you. Car should be on level w/ suspension supporting car as mentioned. Verts need to be on "all 4's" as they do bend a lot. I get queazy every time I see one lifted on a typical 4 point frame lift, you can just see the nose hang & the door jambs open up @ the top. Some measurements wouldn't hurt as Joe P. noted.

4) IMO spot welding much faster, less labor, OE looking results. goes from "final fit" to "welding finished" in 1/4 to 1/3 of the time that mig welding/grinding/weld finishing takes + much less heat & less contamination in seams.

OKIEOLDS

I havent used a spot welder in years, wonder where you can get them now and wonder if they have the hobbist in mind on pricing them.