This weekend I started to tow my new trailer. A 24 foot enclosed unit that probably weighs about 1500 pounds more than my previous open trailer.
My GMC 1500 could tow my open trailer with a 3900lb Olds on it like nothing.
But with an enclosed trailer it tows like ****. Even unloaded on flat Florida ground.
(I have a load leveler and sway control, but it was still like driving a billboard down the road)

So…what are the benefits of moving up to a 2500? And what are the cons?
This will also be my daily driver, and I drive ALOT. (About 22k a year)

ANY comments are appreciated.

 

I tow an 8,500 lb. 27' bumper pull travel trailer with an F250, 6.2L gas, 3.73 axle, with 205k miles. It pulls the trailer effortlessly on flat ground at any speed, does very well in the hills and works but can get the job done on really steep grades.

IMHO, there is a big difference between 1/2 ton and 3/4 ton trucks especially in stopping and windy situations. Have made a few evasive maneuvers (had to) and the truck maintained control incredibly well.

When deciding on what to get a 1/2 ton was too close to max right out of the gate. A 3/4 left at least a 20% margin in payload, towing capability and combined gross vehicle weight rating. As much as I'd prefer a 1/2 ton for comfort and size the F250 is perfect for my needs.

 

Did I just a​​dmit to owning a Ford?...will be banned by midnight!

 

Peter,

I've never owned a truck, but where I live it's the national vehicle. So, I hear a lot of truck talk.

A daily-driver 3/4 ton will burn a lot of fuel at 22k yearly. And the stiffer ride can get a bit uncomfortable when you are in it a lot.

A diesel will give you better economy and towing performance. And it's ideal at your high mileage use--you'll recoup the extra cost quickly from fuel saving.

The Ram trucks have a very smooth ride and comfortable interior. When you test drive, be sure to check one out.

Gary

 

Of all the full size PU I owned, they were 3/4 ton. Not that much more than a half, and now you don't have to worry about what you tow or hall. I never had a problem with the ride. The last one was a Dura Max,it did get good mileage compared to gas, but hate think what a diesel cost today.

 

blasphemy!! Off with your head!!

 

Pretty much every truck I've ever owned has been a one ton dually with a 454. Even with a 33 ft fifth wheel camper there was no issue.

 

Pulling is the easy part. All newer 1/2 ton trucks have enough HP and gears in the transmission to get just about anything moving. I remember putting a car trailer on my old chevy with the 305. The limitations were clear with that one!

Stopping and the evasive maneuvering is where the big difference comes in between a 1/2 and 3/4 ton. Once you tow a sizable load with a 3/4 ton, you'll never want to pull with a small truck again.

 

F250 6.2L gas fuel economy 16 HWY not towing, 9.8 HWY towing.

 

66 Jetstar hit the nail on the head! You need to step up to the 3/4T. I’m a GM guy but would give the Dodge with a diesel a strong good look.

 

Another vote for an older F250-350 up to 2016. After that...meh.Sorry all you 17 + ers.

I love my 2011, F250 6.2 gasser. I've towed my 442 on an open trailer with ease through the Adirondacks. But I don't know if I'd put a car hauler behind it and hope it pulls the same as it would with an open trailer. I have a 16' enclosed loaded with equipment and it knows its back there. Still pulls it but it likes 5th gear way more than 6th (6 Speed 6R140 trans).

The enclosed trailers are like towing a house. A diesel would be far better. If I was gona tow big I'd step up to a diesel...but an older 7.3. Or an older GM with a Duramax & an Allison trans. Or better yet find an old analog Detroit with an Allison, bullet proof. Enough torque to pull a brick shizt house up Donner Summit and laugh at it.
You can have all the new diesels with 27 speeds that run off cow ****.

Diesel will actually be better on fuel towing than gas. The gas will never get into overdrive where the diesel will.

 

I had a 95 suburban, 350 4 wheel drive with factory towing package. I could tow a tilt and load open car trailer without any effort. I would go anywhere with it picking up 60's full size Olds and drag them back keeping up with traffic. Bought a 28' enclosed car trailer and this truck wouldn't pull it around the block empty. I found a 2500 suburban with a 6L 4 wheel drive with towing package. The 350 ( 5.7L) to the 6L (364) made a huge towing difference, the 2500 towed like the trailer wasn't behind me. I drove to Tucson Az. and dragged a 62 starfire back to Toronto with ease. I used this package to take my 63 98 custom sport coupe to the nationals in Milwaukee crossing at the Sue without any problems. The 1500 is a passenger truck, the 2500 will work harder and is a much better built truck.
Steve

 

Back in the 90's we had a Dually, 454 with TBI. It was great handling, braking and towing but if we didn't hit an incline at WOT we'd be lucky to be going 40 at the top. We were hauling a 25 foot enclosed trailer, 3000 lbs race car with likely another 5000lbs in tools and parts.

 

I have a 2023 Chevy Silverado 1500 LT with a 2.7-liter, turbocharged FOUR CYLINDER engine, and I use it to tow my 1600 lb, 24-foot open trailer with my 4800 lb Toronado on it with no problems. When I went to buy the truck, I told the salesman what I wanted to tow with it, and I assumed I would at least need something with an 8-cylinder engine in it. He assured me on a stack of bibles that this truck could do the job, and I would benefit from better fuel mileage when in everyday use. So I went with it. I have not been disappointed.





I think you’re problem is simply that you now have an enclosed trailer, which puts up a lot more wind resistance than a car sitting on a flat, open trailer, and you’re feeling the effects of that. Of course a more powerful truck will help you, but I don’t think there is anything particularly wrong with what you have now. You just have a different situation that you need to get used to.

You say the truck "tows like ****." Can you be a little more scientific? How does it tow like ****? Wanders all over the road. Poorer acceleration? Longer stopping distances? Poorer gas mileage? What?

You say the vehicle will also be your daily driver. I don't think you want a vehicle that is overkill for the 90 or 95% of the time that you AREN'T towing your Oldsmobile. You're going to pay for it with higher fuel costs.

If what you have now gets you there in spite of the poorer overall performance, I would try to stick with that. As long as you aren't exceeding the towing capacity of the truck/hitch/etc.

That actually brings up another quick question. What kind of hitch do you have? My sister once towed a two-horse horse-trailer (with two horses in it plus all their stuff), which is obviously an enclosed thing, all over the country in her Ford F-150. The truck did get put to the test, but she never had any problems. It was the kind of trailer with a gooseneck hitch.

 

I just went through this decision making hell last year... an open trailer is a breeze, as you noted, the enclosed is a brick in the wind, a lot more weight, etc... I had a 2010 Express 3500 (long wheelbase) I towed with, and it was stable as a rock with the enclosed behind it. It was coming up on 15 years old and we were due for something else, so I was really trying to justify the 1500 since it's smaller, typically cheaper, easier to deal with in a lot of ways.

Wife and I were following a guy towing a camper (probably 20-24 ft, not very big) in a mild crosswind with a 1500, and you could see it moving all over, even though he had the equalizer hitch. That sealed the deal... I ended up going to a 2500, got a GMC 6.6 gasser with the 10 speed. Newer 1500's are really suburban people haulers, not work trucks. The tires aren't as load rated and stable, suspension is softer, aren't built to get the crap kicked out of them working (thermal management, coolers, etc) like the HD trucks are. I've had trailer brakes disconnect before and had to stop the enclosed (9k lb) from 60+ mph in a hurry - the 2500/3500 brakes are up to the job, had to stand on the pedal a bit but it wasn't much of a panic.

Some people are okay with the risk, I like driving without working my *** off and feeling relaxed with that big of a load. I wouldn't get the gasser with the mileage you drive. People seem to love it or hate it, but the 1500 3.0L diesel from GM has potential - by the time I priced it the way I wanted it, I was getting pretty close to the 2500.

Pros of 2500: better brakes, long wheelbase for stability, stronger frame, driveline, mirrors, power, built to be used, also seem to depreciate less than the 1500's
Cons of a 2500: Big size, price (especially with diesel), ride quality (subjective), fuel economy is bad with gas (10-12?), diesel maybe 16-18.

 

My Silverado LT with the four-cylinder gets about 22 mpg overall city/highway when in daily use. The window sticker said to expect overall 19 mpg, so I'm doing better than that. When towing, it drops to about 13 mpg.

 

For the past decade or so I have towed my 24' enclosed trailer with my Ram 3500 crew cab short bed, single rear wheel truck, Cummins diesel. It is pretty much ideal for me after towing open and enclosed trailers for 40+ years. Too much capability is far better than "just enough" in my experience. For me it is not about having the most comfortable, compliant suspension solo, but the value of my life (and the car's) when towing. My 3500 actually is nice riding solo as well, and gets 20+ mpg that way, generally anywhere from 10-14 loaded and towing, mountains and flat lands.

 

The new Chevy and Ford 1/2 tons use a 10R80. Buy a Toyota or Dodge instead.
​​​​​​

 

Steve, That's it exactly! That enclosed trailer is SO much different than the open. Night and day.

Jaunty, Thanks for the counterpoint, this was also what I was looking for. The idea of trading in my beloved truck for a bigger one for the 5% of the time I'll tow is daunting.
As for the "tow's like ****" comment: trying to go down the road at 70(state speed limit) keeps the truck out of overdrive most of the time, rpms are like 3k on a flat surface. (Getting it off the line doesn't seem bad at all). Braking seemed ok with the trailers brake gain turned up a little....not sure I want to test it coming down Monteagle at 70.
But overall I felt like my truck was all over the place.

I have a load leveler (equalizer hitch) which Im sure to set tightly(as few chain links as possible) and a sway control bar. It's a 22 GMC double cab with standard box and a 5.3. It gets about 19mpg on the highway at 78mph. 13mpg with my open trailer and 7.5 with the new enclosed! I feel like I'm going to brake it.

 

Luke, yep. Sounds like you do know my hell. I have all of that floating around my head.
I've never owned a diesel. Any huge issues to get used to?

Run to Rund, Olds 64...I've also never owned a Dodge. I feel like I always read about depreciation and shoddy quality with them. (not that all the other brands have glowing reviews)

 

Last year I had a guy from a local GM dealership reprogram my truck, change shift points, tighten up the shift engagement points and tune the engine and now my gas milage has doubled. I can drive from Detroit to home (7 hrs) at high way speeds and still have a third of a tank left. My wife's Equinox with a 4 banger is now worse then my 6L suburban. The suburban is 18 years old with under 200K and should last me unless something happens out of my control. The tuning set me back $400.00 cash and I've saved that in gas easily within the first year.
This is now a beast that rides like a Caddy. I had a friend borrow my truck to move his 36' boat and was concerned it might not be big enough, surprise surprise when he returned and wanted to buy it from me. I personally wouldn't buy anything smaller then the 2500 again.
Steve

 

I’m a bit biased, I’m a 27 year Stellantis employee. However, we were always a GM family before I started working here. I don’t bite the hand that feeds me.

I have never had a Mopar “lemon”. For the most part, the issues we have had have, been of all things, radio related. My wife had a Jeep that occasionally would randomly turn on the navigation system, or would show colored lines on the screen (remember the test tone tv stations would show when they went off the air? That’s kinda what it looked like) but never had major drivetrain or drivability issues.

As for diesel ownership, I bought my first diesel back in 2002. I have never had transmission issues, regardless of the reputation Chrysler transmissions have. They always started, even in minus 25 temps. My current Ram is rapidly closing in on 300k, other than some valve body work when the truck was fairly new I have not touched the transmission. Mainly routine maintenance, and some front end work.

Occasionally, I get new truck fever. But I’ll admit, the emissions crap they have handicapped new trucks with does concern me. It seems the people who have issues with new diesel are complaining of emissions concerns, and are the ones who rarely work the truck hard. In other words, if the truck is primarily used for towing, they emissions concerns are greatly reduced. I’m guessing the higher exhaust temps helps burn off the soot, meaning the truck doesn’t go into regeneration mode nearly as often. The real fix is to either delete the truck, or live with it. Neither is ideal.

 

I'm on my 4th new GM Sierra 2500 HD Gas 04,11,15 ,& 22 and all have been nearly flawless mechanically. I usually put on 150,000 miles with just oil changes, air filters, and tires. I have never service the trans or dif or did a brake job. The exhausts all held up as well. I towed my 27' Boat & trailer 9000 lbs effortlessly and plow snow as well. The HD part includes HD Frame, HD power HP +-, HD Trans, HD Brakes, HD Cooling, HD Suspension & HD Skid Plates & more. The HD costs not much more than a 1500 with the Trailer Equipment / Tires / ... . Visit GM website and build some of their trucks to compare the LIST Prices.

These trucks come with 60 psi front & 70 psi rear and ride crappy BUT that is for towing or loads, just lower the tire pressure to 45-50 & 55-60 for everyday use and they ride REAL NICE. My 22 is the nicest vehicle I ever had and I have had over 40 cars & trucks. The 22 has a 400 GAS small block with 401 HP and 464 Torque and FLIES ! I have the last year of the 6 speeds - in 23 they went to the 10 speed, I really like my 6 speed.

 

It seems to be a love or hate thing. DEF systems are a risk... when you drive modern diesels a lot (and load them towing), they're meant for that and seem to work well. Idle and putz around town for short trips, you'll never regen the catalyst. My uncle and neighbor both have newer GMC duramax with no complaints or issues. You search the net and there are others screaming like hell about issues with the emissions systems that are back at the dealers for repairs. Underhood on the newer diesels is usually pretty complex, everything is heavy, they take a lot more oil on an oil change, getting nitpicky now... but they make huge torque at loafing RPM's which makes them great for towing.

As you noted in other post, gassers need RPM when towing. I used to lock my van out of sixth gear and just let it ride in 5th at 2400 at around 70-71 mph. That was the 6.0L gasser. It would kick down to 3200 rpm on hills in 4th, you just got used to hearing it. Diesels love high load at low RPM, gas is the opposite, it knocks at high load, low rpm, so you gotta rev them.

New truck is the 6.6L gas with 10 speed auto... it's really smooth and quick around town, I haven't had a chance to tow with it yet. There's been complaints about reliability issues (valve body) with the 10 speed on GM, and some people seem to hate the Ford 10 speed too.

 

I wouldn't like it, either, if my truck never was able to shift into the highest gear once cruising speed was reached. If it can't reach that gear, it is laboring.

But what does the truck do when you go, say, 60 instead of 70? One thing I've learned is that I can't be the same speed demon towing a trailer as I can when I'm not. When towing a car, I keep my truck in the 60 to 65 mph range, and it is happy. Yes, I get passed by everyone on the road, but that's ok. I'm towing now, not looking to get to my destination in record time. Enjoy the scenery, talk to your wife, listen to old time radio on SiriusXM, and watch the passing parade.

 

FYI - it's the same transmission. That 10 speed was jointly developed by Ford and GM in an effort to lower over-all development cost. I'm sure final calibration and maybe some small parts are different but it's the same trans.

 

GM 10-Speed Transmission Recall: Affects Silverado, Sierra, Yukon, Tahoe, & Escalade

You Tube

 

After poor results with a Chevy and a Ford pickup, I went to Dodge/Ram and have owned seven of them. I am happy with my 2013 which uses the DEF system for good performance with federally mandated low emissions. As a 3500 it is rated to carry about 2 tons if I could fit all that weight into the 6-1/2 foot bed! It is rated to tow 17,000 pounds, over double what I actually tow with it. My trailer is 28 feet long with a 24 foot box, 8.5 feet wide. I simply drop it onto the tow ball/ ball mount in the factory hitch, no sway controls or other monkey attachments. It tows beautifully. The factory size tires are rated 3640 lb. each and give great stability. Before, I had towed with 3/4 ton gassers and the difference is huge. From white knuckles when anything went a little out of the routine, to worry free all the time.

 

My 2014 Ford F-150 with the Ecoboost V6 goes from 20 mpg non-towing to 13.5 towing with loaded open trailer to 8.5 mpg with my loaded 20 ft enclosed trailer. One rec I'd also make is getting one of those Hellwig rear sway bars for additional stability/handling. I had one installed a few years ago and it was a nice improvement. This truck is rated 9375 lbs or so but I've never been anywhere close to that capacity. My open trailer is 2000 and the enclosed is 3000. Add on a car and that's about it.

 

and ironically, they seem to have different sets of issues with each after co-development, so you get to choose your own adventure.

 

That’s funny **** right there Luke!

Jaunty, I haven’t spoken to my last wife for 4 years and I’m planning on keeping it that way.
But I get your point.

 

x2 on what Jaunty wrote, when I trailer I go into what I call "Towing Mode" driving. I keep it between 65-70 so the truck stays in 6th gear but that's not always possible if the road isn't flat. And I avoid using the tow/haul feature unless I'm in a steeper incline and/or decline. At those speeds these days I get passed by everyone but so be it.

 

Aside from the added power of a 2500, stability is just as important. A couple guys have mentioned this.

Yes with the 2500 you get better brakes, bigger sway bars, sometimes a bigger axle, better tires. I would suggest you get an extended wheelbase. I hear all the time that longbeds are too long to drive/park, people don't have enough stuff to put back there so the space is wasted, etc. But a longer wheelbase will keep the truck and the whole rig for that matter firmer on the ground and going the direction you want it to. You don't want the tail wagging the dog, as it were.

You said it will also be your daily driver. You might have to suck it up and have a real truck as a daily driver. You wouldn't have a Camaro as a daily, but oh once or twice a year tow that 24ft trailer. That one time you tow you need to be as safe as you can be. Things can go from zero to disaster quickly. You already tow so you know this.

Good luck if you decide to trade up.

 

Cummins Diesel. Overkill for what I tow now but I have had 20,000 pounds behind it.

 

Cummins Diesel. I would take that over a Hemi any day of the week. I used to pick up parts and whole engines from their plant in NJ back in 1977 when I drove a truck for a Mack trucks dealer. The mechanics there said Cummins was far and away the best you could get.

 

I have the same trailer Craig has (Lightning 20ft enclosed), and my 2024 3.0L Duramax tows it very well if you stay under 70mph. The enclosed trailer makes all the difference. Its like pulling a sail.
My truck got 15mpg pulling a 442 convertible on a four hour trip. It bounces between 9th and 10th gear depending on grade and speed, but does alright. This is the best truck I have ever had. 1500 High Country 4x4, it averages 27-28 mpg almost all the time at 70-80mph. Recently we took it to Ft Wayne IN to pick up a new line truck. Most of the trip was 50-60 mph speed limits and the line truck was governed at 70 anyway. At a 55mph average I was getting 41 mpg, no $hit, took a picture of it on my phone. And, this truck rides like a Caddy.

 

And that's with the diesel?
Wow, that's impressive. I know it costs a lot more and then more to maintain.
But I know it has more grunt too.

 

I use my 2019 F150 to pull a 28 foot enclosed. 5.0 liter, 10R, 3.73s. It’s a 4 door 6 foot bed so it’s rated at 11,500 lbs. Pulls fine. Even thru the hills of Branson last year. I use it daily and pull an enclosed maybe twice a year. So no need for a big tow rig when I don’t pull the big house every much.

 

You are getting way better fuel milage than I am. Towing the enclosed trailer (load or empty) I get 12-13mpg. Running 70 on the highway I can sometimes see 20mpg. I love the trailer! High ticket item being all aluminum but worth the price, Mine is two years old now.
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Im curious, how accurate is the mpg on the newer trucks? The overhead console on my truck has never been particularly accurate. It got even worse once I installed a programmer.

It’s not uncommon for the overhead console to show my truck gets 38-39mpg. There is ZERO chance of that ever happening. Do the math the old fashioned way, it’s 17-20.

The only way I could ever see a 7200 pound 3/4 ton 4x4 getting almost 40 miles to the gallon is if it’s been towed!!