OCA Members...
September 3rd, 2012, 08:12 AM
#1
Oldsdruid
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Southside Vajenya
Posts: 10,299
OCA Members...
Right now there is a crisis of sorts in OCA concerning the Journey With Olds editor's contract.
For whatever reasons, the OCA president and editor cannot come to terms on the contract and unless this gets resolved quickly there will likely be no JWO published after September issue.
You have paid your membership dues expecting to get the magazine in return. You need to contact your Zone directors and the Executive board and push them to get this mess resolved. Their names and contact info are on the inside front cover of JWO.
For whatever reasons, the OCA president and editor cannot come to terms on the contract and unless this gets resolved quickly there will likely be no JWO published after September issue.
You have paid your membership dues expecting to get the magazine in return. You need to contact your Zone directors and the Executive board and push them to get this mess resolved. Their names and contact info are on the inside front cover of JWO.
September 3rd, 2012, 09:30 AM
#2
Old(s) Fart
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 47,357
Right now there is a crisis of sorts in OCA concerning the Journey With Olds editor's contract.
For whatever reasons, the OCA president and editor cannot come to terms on the contract and unless this gets resolved quickly there will likely be no JWO published after September issue.
You have paid your membership dues expecting to get the magazine in return. You need to contact your Zone directors and the Executive board and push them to get this mess resolved. Their names and contact info are on the inside front cover of JWO.
For whatever reasons, the OCA president and editor cannot come to terms on the contract and unless this gets resolved quickly there will likely be no JWO published after September issue.
You have paid your membership dues expecting to get the magazine in return. You need to contact your Zone directors and the Executive board and push them to get this mess resolved. Their names and contact info are on the inside front cover of JWO.
Just sayin...
September 3rd, 2012, 09:40 AM
#3
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,845
The magazine _looks_ nicer than in previous decades, but seems to have less technical content than it could. I'd like to see more incentive for knowledgeable members to take the trouble to write and get photos of technical stuff.
September 3rd, 2012, 10:11 AM
#4
Oldsdruid
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Southside Vajenya
Posts: 10,299
I'd like to see more tech articles too, but I'll give it to Brad. He can only work with what he has. I don't know what it will take to get members to write something up for him. It's obviously out there- look at the worlds of information that get tossed around just on this forum. I'm as guilty as anyone.
The info I get is that some folks want JWO to be more like POCI's Smoke Signals. First, is OCA willing to pay to publish a magazine like that, and second, that rag has drifted into drag racing coverage and advertising at the expense of covering original/restored and older Pontiacs.
I know a lot of POCI members who are on the warpath (pun intended) over that magazine but its editor is hardheaded and will reject an article on a restoration in favor of an article on drag racing. Plus the Oldsmobile community is a way more limited audience than Pontiac so where would you find advertisers to fill an Oldsmobile magazine the size of SS? They put their ad budget where they get the best return.
I haven't gotten SS in a couple years- I left POCI when they started allowing altered body data plates. But POCI friends tell me the magazine hasn't changed.
Bottom line I don't care who edits JWO, as long as shenanigans at the top don't cause missed issues. I pay for a year's membership, I expect to get 12 magazines.
The info I get is that some folks want JWO to be more like POCI's Smoke Signals. First, is OCA willing to pay to publish a magazine like that, and second, that rag has drifted into drag racing coverage and advertising at the expense of covering original/restored and older Pontiacs.
I know a lot of POCI members who are on the warpath (pun intended) over that magazine but its editor is hardheaded and will reject an article on a restoration in favor of an article on drag racing. Plus the Oldsmobile community is a way more limited audience than Pontiac so where would you find advertisers to fill an Oldsmobile magazine the size of SS? They put their ad budget where they get the best return.
I haven't gotten SS in a couple years- I left POCI when they started allowing altered body data plates. But POCI friends tell me the magazine hasn't changed.
Bottom line I don't care who edits JWO, as long as shenanigans at the top don't cause missed issues. I pay for a year's membership, I expect to get 12 magazines.
September 3rd, 2012, 10:57 AM
#5
Lansing built
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Grand Ledge, MI
Posts: 3,228
X2, I was not aware of any tiff! I'll see if I can get a hold of Ken Nicholas and ask him whats up? I also noticed when Pat Yancey was at the helm the Texas part was little heavy handed with Arron Nance,Brad and Pat all hale from Texas if memory serves me right.
Pat
Pat
September 3rd, 2012, 12:12 PM
#6
Randy C.
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Albany, OR
Posts: 3,248
As I recall, a huge part of our dues (80%+) goes towards publishing the monthly JWO. I do enjoy that magazine although it is a quick read. More on the technical side would keep my nose in it longer. Sad to hear about the disagreements that are going on.
Randy C.
Randy C.
September 3rd, 2012, 12:43 PM
#7
My 2 cents. I dont know Brad or the trouble. I have seen his plea for members to get involved/be on his side. I dont know the other side of the story or dispute so I cannot pass judgement. I can say, if true the newsletter will not be published in September then I blame the president and expect an extra copy/month of membership.
September 3rd, 2012, 05:52 PM
#8
2 '66 98's
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: central New Jersey
Posts: 489
Don't just let your comments die on this site - convey them to your zone directors and board members. This nonsense has to be halted with no loss to the members. This is a way to lose a lot of members in a big hurry! I know quite a few members who are owners of older Oldsmobiles who are seriously looking at AOCA.
September 3rd, 2012, 06:11 PM
#9
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: potosi, mo.
Posts: 197
i like to see more behind the scene of oldsmobile history. like story form the plants and alike. more tech would be great. less pages about what going on in the writers life this mouth. i think it is a shame the pictures don't have captions
Last edited by cfhcar; September 3rd, 2012 at 06:11 PM. Reason: spelling
September 3rd, 2012, 06:59 PM
#10
Oldsdruid
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Southside Vajenya
Posts: 10,299
Emails I received tonight indicate an editor's contract has been signed.
But- as Joe P and Rund pointed out- the magazine needs member input for stories and tech articles. There are still a bunch of Olds retirees who remember stuff at the plants and main office- it would be a shame to lose what they know.
I admit I'm as guilty as anyone about not supplying JWO material. But, I suspect I'm like most of you in that time is at a premium in my life. I know I couldn't commit to a monthly or even quarterly submission, but I'll try to send in at least one stub in the next year.
Anyone else think they could do that? Some of the restoration stories we've had on here would make great JWO material.
But- as Joe P and Rund pointed out- the magazine needs member input for stories and tech articles. There are still a bunch of Olds retirees who remember stuff at the plants and main office- it would be a shame to lose what they know.
I admit I'm as guilty as anyone about not supplying JWO material. But, I suspect I'm like most of you in that time is at a premium in my life. I know I couldn't commit to a monthly or even quarterly submission, but I'll try to send in at least one stub in the next year.
Anyone else think they could do that? Some of the restoration stories we've had on here would make great JWO material.
September 4th, 2012, 05:36 AM
#11
As a 40 - year member of the OCA (my membership number is 1581 – and it was 212 before they renumbered when they went to the computer) I want to go on record here. I don’t want to get wound up or wind others up, but the problem is not with Brad – he breaks his you know what trying to put together a newsletter each month. The problem is the approach. First, this is the 21st Century – not the 19th. The whole concept of publishing has changed from “I am going to provide you with something to read on a piece of paper” to “I am going to DIRECT you to where the information is – on the NET”.
As such, a newsletter like JWO is just a drag on the Club itself and adds little to the value prop of the OCA. (and yes, it does consume 80% of the Club’s working capital that could be used in so many other ways to help and generate additional membership). Without blowing our horn too much, Wild About Cars publishes TWO newsletters per month with a whole lot more info or access to a whole lot more info, because we direct our members to where the information is while still working at making the newsletter interesting. And we do it for FREE. This approach is what OCA needs to do.
BUT:
This will not happen, because they are locked into two things: 1) catering to the older crowd (most of them are younger than me – I turned 69 last week) who need a piece of paper to feel their dues are justified and; 2) to promoting their cars shows. The people they are catering to have cars that are already done, which means that they could care less about technical info – except which car polish to buy. The Board is made up of those people – and they are not going to change. With that atmosphere, how do you expect “technical” info from the OCA? Most of them wouldn’t even know where to go to get it.
There is a huge contingent of knowledgeable people here and at WAC that are dedicated to exactly what you are talking about, but we will never break through to the management of OCA on what they need to do to make the Club viable again. I can tell you this, we at Wild About Cars had correspondence w/OCA on what they could do to encourage more and better participation (they came to us) and our ideas were given the “talk to the hand” the minute we proposed a more modern approach. (If you want to know more - you need to contact me off line). So . . . what’s the definition of insanity?
Classic Olds and Wild About Cars were a reaction to the changing times. We both will be successful because we are tuned in to what most car guys are looking for. Unfortunately, the management of OCA can’t even fathom why we might be disgruntled. Expecting them to change is like turning the Titanic 10 feet before the iceberg – it ain’t happening.
So, what to do? If you want to support the OCA – as I do, even knowing I’m throwing my $40 away – continue to do so, but do not expect change. If you want information - stay here and/or visit Wild About Cars – where you will get the info you need to maintain, restore and modify your ride. (PS, WAC already has 1,870 active Olds members and a growth rate of 112% since January – and what is the membership here? Huge, I’m guessing).
This is the future . . . this is where we are all going to go whether the OCA likes it or not. Face it, all clubs are grappling with the same problem, but few have recognized what to do. Likely, they will all end up being car show promotion and management organizations – leaving the information highway to be something each of us will have to ride on without their help.
As such, a newsletter like JWO is just a drag on the Club itself and adds little to the value prop of the OCA. (and yes, it does consume 80% of the Club’s working capital that could be used in so many other ways to help and generate additional membership). Without blowing our horn too much, Wild About Cars publishes TWO newsletters per month with a whole lot more info or access to a whole lot more info, because we direct our members to where the information is while still working at making the newsletter interesting. And we do it for FREE. This approach is what OCA needs to do.
BUT:
This will not happen, because they are locked into two things: 1) catering to the older crowd (most of them are younger than me – I turned 69 last week) who need a piece of paper to feel their dues are justified and; 2) to promoting their cars shows. The people they are catering to have cars that are already done, which means that they could care less about technical info – except which car polish to buy. The Board is made up of those people – and they are not going to change. With that atmosphere, how do you expect “technical” info from the OCA? Most of them wouldn’t even know where to go to get it.
There is a huge contingent of knowledgeable people here and at WAC that are dedicated to exactly what you are talking about, but we will never break through to the management of OCA on what they need to do to make the Club viable again. I can tell you this, we at Wild About Cars had correspondence w/OCA on what they could do to encourage more and better participation (they came to us) and our ideas were given the “talk to the hand” the minute we proposed a more modern approach. (If you want to know more - you need to contact me off line). So . . . what’s the definition of insanity?
Classic Olds and Wild About Cars were a reaction to the changing times. We both will be successful because we are tuned in to what most car guys are looking for. Unfortunately, the management of OCA can’t even fathom why we might be disgruntled. Expecting them to change is like turning the Titanic 10 feet before the iceberg – it ain’t happening.
So, what to do? If you want to support the OCA – as I do, even knowing I’m throwing my $40 away – continue to do so, but do not expect change. If you want information - stay here and/or visit Wild About Cars – where you will get the info you need to maintain, restore and modify your ride. (PS, WAC already has 1,870 active Olds members and a growth rate of 112% since January – and what is the membership here? Huge, I’m guessing).
This is the future . . . this is where we are all going to go whether the OCA likes it or not. Face it, all clubs are grappling with the same problem, but few have recognized what to do. Likely, they will all end up being car show promotion and management organizations – leaving the information highway to be something each of us will have to ride on without their help.
September 4th, 2012, 09:39 AM
#12
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: SE Wisconsin
Posts: 1,915
Gee, why don't you tell us how you really feel? All kidding aside, you make a more than valid point on the changing face of the hobby and the need to change with the times.
Having said that, I still like the piece of paper in hand. Yes, I am younger than you, albeit only by a few years, and I am no stranger to car sites on the net.
Where I disagree with you is the lack of interest in the "old school crowd" in tech info because their cars are already done. All car fanatics know that a car is never done! I desire and welcome "how to" and tech articles, and wish there were more.
WAC is doing a great job, but it is not the only way to reach out to car fans. There certainly is room in the car world for fan support both online and in printed format.
Having said that, I still like the piece of paper in hand. Yes, I am younger than you, albeit only by a few years, and I am no stranger to car sites on the net.
Where I disagree with you is the lack of interest in the "old school crowd" in tech info because their cars are already done. All car fanatics know that a car is never done! I desire and welcome "how to" and tech articles, and wish there were more.
WAC is doing a great job, but it is not the only way to reach out to car fans. There certainly is room in the car world for fan support both online and in printed format.
September 4th, 2012, 09:41 AM
#13
Insanity - Doing the same thing over and over, expecting different results.
I'm 31 yrs old and WAC is a good site I use often. For technical info and history. I never rebuilt an engine before, and at the dissagreement of my older hot rodding buddies mostly chevy guys. (Im the only 100% Olds guy of the group) I rebuilt my 1968 455 all by myself. And Ive been driving for months now. With the help of the info i got off WAC's site. This Classic olds site is good too. I use them both.
From the outside looking in Jrzybob442 has a good point. Forgive my ignorance but what is OCA? Oldsmobile Classic Association??????????
I'm 31 yrs old and WAC is a good site I use often. For technical info and history. I never rebuilt an engine before, and at the dissagreement of my older hot rodding buddies mostly chevy guys. (Im the only 100% Olds guy of the group) I rebuilt my 1968 455 all by myself. And Ive been driving for months now. With the help of the info i got off WAC's site. This Classic olds site is good too. I use them both.
From the outside looking in Jrzybob442 has a good point. Forgive my ignorance but what is OCA? Oldsmobile Classic Association??????????
September 4th, 2012, 10:06 AM
#14
Dave:
For one, I am not saying that there are not those of us who both like paper and who still like to work on our cars, I am merely saying that the decsion-makers in the OCA only see it the way I described.
Paper is good, but if you think paper is the most efficient way, you are going to get what you see. You, yourself, publish electronically and you recognize that you must have that media to reach out to people.
The trouble is that the OCA management sees the paper as the only way. Once you do that, you are putting all the pressure on Brad and his few helpers to create a newsletter with a huge cache of content, technical or otherwise, and this is just never going to happen.
Besides, the info has no value unless it is stored somewhere. If I merely publish it in a paper newsletter it is a "snapshot in time", and thus lost to others who did not receive it or who come onto the scene later on.
75 Cutty455 - Thanks for the kind words - BTW "OCA" stands for Oldsmobile Club of America http://www.oldsclub.org/ Don't cry when you see their awesome website.
For one, I am not saying that there are not those of us who both like paper and who still like to work on our cars, I am merely saying that the decsion-makers in the OCA only see it the way I described.
Paper is good, but if you think paper is the most efficient way, you are going to get what you see. You, yourself, publish electronically and you recognize that you must have that media to reach out to people.
The trouble is that the OCA management sees the paper as the only way. Once you do that, you are putting all the pressure on Brad and his few helpers to create a newsletter with a huge cache of content, technical or otherwise, and this is just never going to happen.
Besides, the info has no value unless it is stored somewhere. If I merely publish it in a paper newsletter it is a "snapshot in time", and thus lost to others who did not receive it or who come onto the scene later on.
75 Cutty455 - Thanks for the kind words - BTW "OCA" stands for Oldsmobile Club of America http://www.oldsclub.org/ Don't cry when you see their awesome website.
Last edited by jrzybob442; September 4th, 2012 at 01:53 PM.
September 4th, 2012, 01:47 PM
#15
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 2,026
Their website sucks. This page hasnt been updated in 12 years. Take it down if you cant update it.
http://www.oldsclub.org/MembersCars/...edMembCars.htm
I dont think the entire website has ever been updated. Complete overhaul is needed, in every facet of the club.
http://www.oldsclub.org/MembersCars/...edMembCars.htm
I dont think the entire website has ever been updated. Complete overhaul is needed, in every facet of the club.
September 4th, 2012, 01:51 PM
#16
Supposedly they are contemplating that. I have no idea what they intend to do, but perhaps Brad knows.
I don't think they really understand the scope of the work they will have to do to make the site meaningful - AND the work they will have to do to keep it current. Then there is cost - to do it right is going to cost some meaningful coin, and if you are spending 80% of your revenue on the newsletter . . . .
When you are so far behind, catching up is awful hard.
I don't think they really understand the scope of the work they will have to do to make the site meaningful - AND the work they will have to do to keep it current. Then there is cost - to do it right is going to cost some meaningful coin, and if you are spending 80% of your revenue on the newsletter . . . .
When you are so far behind, catching up is awful hard.
September 4th, 2012, 03:12 PM
#17
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 2,703
I am not an OCA member, please don't flame me for saying what I'm about to say. I just want to offer a perspective from a younger generation.
I am not an OCA member because I don't see the need. To me, it seems like the club is irrelevant and useless. If it were to be updated, like the website for example, and became more of a global experience I might see things differently. However, paying dues to be a part of a club that I have no say in and receiving a few pieces of paper every month to "justify" my membership is just a waste.
What is this club about anyway? It's about the cars, and our mutual enjoyment of them. It is like minded people coming together to share their ideas and experiences with one common denominator, Oldsmobiles. Why not reflect that sentiment in the OCA?
From the outside looking in, there is no incentive for a guy like me to join...all I see is a bunch of old guys harumphing about their show cars and the politics of the club. The OCA needs a direction, it needs an identity, and it needs it fast...this club is going to die off as the members do if it doesn't look into attracting the younger generations.
JMO.
I am not an OCA member because I don't see the need. To me, it seems like the club is irrelevant and useless. If it were to be updated, like the website for example, and became more of a global experience I might see things differently. However, paying dues to be a part of a club that I have no say in and receiving a few pieces of paper every month to "justify" my membership is just a waste.
What is this club about anyway? It's about the cars, and our mutual enjoyment of them. It is like minded people coming together to share their ideas and experiences with one common denominator, Oldsmobiles. Why not reflect that sentiment in the OCA?
From the outside looking in, there is no incentive for a guy like me to join...all I see is a bunch of old guys harumphing about their show cars and the politics of the club. The OCA needs a direction, it needs an identity, and it needs it fast...this club is going to die off as the members do if it doesn't look into attracting the younger generations.
JMO.
September 4th, 2012, 03:42 PM
#18
You have quite succinctly said what Kurt Shubert and I have been telling them for a number of years.
Frankly WAC was our response to a huge hole we felt the OCA was not filling. I think your prediction of demise is accurate.
However, I will say this. What holds the OCA together is the Chapters. They are required to have all their members belong to the OCA (some don't check so close - but now they are required to send a roster to the OCA so some "policeman" can check to see if they are in compliance). Kinda backwards - they should be encouraging the Chapters to sign up new members and then convincing them to join OCA - but that ain't happening.
If the Chapters revolt and say no mas the OCA is bye bye. That's the truth. So when the Chapter membership starts to turn over to the younger members - and they say "not me", then the OCA will be in deep trouble.
The other thing that the Club has a large hold on is the National and chapter (local) meets because they offer insurance and a half-aced structure - when that collapses or is superseded by someone else, there will literally be no need for the OCA.
Frankly WAC was our response to a huge hole we felt the OCA was not filling. I think your prediction of demise is accurate.
However, I will say this. What holds the OCA together is the Chapters. They are required to have all their members belong to the OCA (some don't check so close - but now they are required to send a roster to the OCA so some "policeman" can check to see if they are in compliance). Kinda backwards - they should be encouraging the Chapters to sign up new members and then convincing them to join OCA - but that ain't happening.
If the Chapters revolt and say no mas the OCA is bye bye. That's the truth. So when the Chapter membership starts to turn over to the younger members - and they say "not me", then the OCA will be in deep trouble.
The other thing that the Club has a large hold on is the National and chapter (local) meets because they offer insurance and a half-aced structure - when that collapses or is superseded by someone else, there will literally be no need for the OCA.
Last edited by jrzybob442; September 4th, 2012 at 03:45 PM.
September 4th, 2012, 03:57 PM
#19
Always room for one more
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Georgia
Posts: 7,704
I was a member of OCA back in the 80s, when DeNovi was the president. I don't remember much of what went on politically back then, but there didn't seem to be the contempt that I see now.
The Corvair club is having the same issues these days. A Board of "old" members doesn't want things to change, and they try to "punish" the members who cry out for change. The more people want change, the more the board digs in. I have a feeling pretty much all car clubs more than 30 (or 20?) years old are having similar troubles.
No one needs a club with a lot of drama to enjoy their cars. However sometimes it's the club that gets the people together that become such good friends. I'd love to join OCA again but not while there's such unrest. I'd love to join the Dixie chapter but they require you join the big club. Too bad.
The Corvair club is having the same issues these days. A Board of "old" members doesn't want things to change, and they try to "punish" the members who cry out for change. The more people want change, the more the board digs in. I have a feeling pretty much all car clubs more than 30 (or 20?) years old are having similar troubles.
No one needs a club with a lot of drama to enjoy their cars. However sometimes it's the club that gets the people together that become such good friends. I'd love to join OCA again but not while there's such unrest. I'd love to join the Dixie chapter but they require you join the big club. Too bad.
September 4th, 2012, 04:17 PM
#20
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Newmarket, Ontario
Posts: 232
I am not an OCA member, please don't flame me for saying what I'm about to say. I just want to offer a perspective from a younger generation.
I am not an OCA member because I don't see the need. To me, it seems like the club is irrelevant and useless. If it were to be updated, like the website for example, and became more of a global experience I might see things differently. However, paying dues to be a part of a club that I have no say in and receiving a few pieces of paper every month to "justify" my membership is just a waste.
What is this club about anyway? It's about the cars, and our mutual enjoyment of them. It is like minded people coming together to share their ideas and experiences with one common denominator, Oldsmobiles. Why not reflect that sentiment in the OCA?
From the outside looking in, there is no incentive for a guy like me to join...all I see is a bunch of old guys harumphing about their show cars and the politics of the club. The OCA needs a direction, it needs an identity, and it needs it fast...this club is going to die off as the members do if it doesn't look into attracting the younger generations.
JMO.
I am not an OCA member because I don't see the need. To me, it seems like the club is irrelevant and useless. If it were to be updated, like the website for example, and became more of a global experience I might see things differently. However, paying dues to be a part of a club that I have no say in and receiving a few pieces of paper every month to "justify" my membership is just a waste.
What is this club about anyway? It's about the cars, and our mutual enjoyment of them. It is like minded people coming together to share their ideas and experiences with one common denominator, Oldsmobiles. Why not reflect that sentiment in the OCA?
From the outside looking in, there is no incentive for a guy like me to join...all I see is a bunch of old guys harumphing about their show cars and the politics of the club. The OCA needs a direction, it needs an identity, and it needs it fast...this club is going to die off as the members do if it doesn't look into attracting the younger generations.
JMO.
are looking for. Too bad because it could be great.
September 4th, 2012, 04:27 PM
#21
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 2,703
I think when the OCA became a business it lost it's passion. Look at what we are doing here in Texas just through CO...and in such a short time. And it's not driven by dues or a magazine, it's driven by the passion we have for our cars. And a desire to meet guys that share our interests. This is where the heart of the OCA should be, not in some crummy magazine or an expensive event for the exclusive.
September 4th, 2012, 06:13 PM
#22
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: southeastern Michigan
Posts: 14,203
The OCA ought to do what many organizations are turning to. Offer the newsletter as a color pdf emailed to you each month. If you want the paper version, you pay an extra $20 or something like that per year.
As far as content, I was told once many years ago by I can't remember who that the most popular part of JWO is the classifieds.
As far as content, I was told once many years ago by I can't remember who that the most popular part of JWO is the classifieds.
September 4th, 2012, 07:07 PM
#23
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Jacksonville, FL
Posts: 2,661
I think when the OCA became a business it lost it's passion. Look at what we are doing here in Texas just through CO...and in such a short time. And it's not driven by dues or a magazine, it's driven by the passion we have for our cars. And a desire to meet guys that share our interests. This is where the heart of the OCA should be, not in some crummy magazine or an expensive event for the exclusive.
just my .02
September 4th, 2012, 07:23 PM
#24
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Glendale, Az
Posts: 242
As a ex OCA member as well as an ex local chapter member, I can say that the only thing the club has or had to offer recently was the JWO mag. I first joined in 1988 and was a fairly steady member until my last issue September 2009. Back in 1988 the OCA was the way to get Olds info. The silly requirement that I pay my dues to the National so I can pay dues to the local chapter is insane. Oh, by the way I have about 10 or so years of JWO mags listed for sale in the parts section.
September 5th, 2012, 05:52 AM
#25
Lansing built
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Grand Ledge, MI
Posts: 3,228
IMO OCA does nothing at all for the regular member, I do enjoy JWO and look forward to it coming each month. I agree with others if they don't change their ways, they might as well fold up the tent! I also enjoy judging at the national events and you get the chance to closely inspect cars that are not in your class, and meet new people. With that being said I think not being a member would be a negative!
Now for the local chapter, being a former R.E. Olds chapter president and running homecoming at the same time I fell that local chapters are good and get the grunt work done, but buy the same token many of my board members are not part of the local chapter anymore due to the old guard complaining about any changes that you are trying to make. When I ruled at any level, I tried not to step on anyones toes that were doing his/her jobs, whenever I tried anything, the old guard seem to want to slap my hand for busting my a$$!
This attitude may have been atributed to me being around 30 at the time.
IMO new people may bring fresh ideas.
Now for the local chapter, being a former R.E. Olds chapter president and running homecoming at the same time I fell that local chapters are good and get the grunt work done, but buy the same token many of my board members are not part of the local chapter anymore due to the old guard complaining about any changes that you are trying to make. When I ruled at any level, I tried not to step on anyones toes that were doing his/her jobs, whenever I tried anything, the old guard seem to want to slap my hand for busting my a$$!
This attitude may have been atributed to me being around 30 at the time.
IMO new people may bring fresh ideas.
September 5th, 2012, 07:14 AM
#26
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 2,026
In the year 2012, what exactly is the OCAs contribution to the Olds hobby? Not putting them down, just asking what you think they contribute to the Olds hobby. Im talking on the national level.
September 5th, 2012, 08:06 AM
#27
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: southeastern Michigan
Posts: 14,203
Any OCA leader should be able to answer this question, and I'd love to know what their answers are.
I think most would respond that the club puts on a national show each year which brings together Olds enthusiasts from around the country, and that's a good thing. They would also mention JWO.
But, in my opinion, these aren't enough. First of all, other shows, like the annual Homecoming show, are equally successful and important, if not moreso.
Second, a magazine like JWO should be more. I agree with the view that there are too many articles about how people's lives went today and not enough about Oldsmobile itself, its history, its cars, its successes and failures over the years, and so forth.
Having been the editor of the Mid-Ohio Chapter's newsletter for about 10 years total, I'm fully aware that no matter how much you exhort members to send you articles, you rarely get any, and you really have to be prepared to provide all the content yourself. Given the size of the OCA, I don't think it's inappropriate to consider hiring someone full-time as a writer.
But what the OCA does NOT do is as glaring as what it does do. For one thing, it should be a repository for all information Oldsmobile. Factory literature, advertising, magazine articles, dealer brochures, and more. The OCA should be the go-to place any time anyone thinks about finding out information about their car.
But this job is being done by others. Wild About Cars has, for example, in a relatively short time, and through the work of just a few dedicated people, amassed an amazing amount of literature, with Oldsmobile being the brand with the largest amount. When I want to know about my car or any other Oldsmobile, I go there first. Why isn't the OCA doing this? More importantly, why didn't they start doing this 10 or 20 years ago?
I also agree that the OCA's website has a late 20th century look to it and is badly in need of updating, and an organization the size of the OCA should be able to accomplish this.
September 5th, 2012, 08:22 AM
#28
For me I have been a member since about 1975. The newsletter is a way of letting people know location of nation event and chapter shows. There are cars and parts for sale. As for tech info it has always been lacking and stories are sometimes good but it pretty much is a fluff/picture publication. The JWO is a publication like other magazines out there. It would be nice for the OCA to be a "one stop shopping" thing but that is hard to do. I still belong because it has a purpose for me. It is what it is, and the member base is quite large. The local chapters make it possible for me to at least attend 1 show a year that doesnt take much effort to get to. I am not a trophy guy but do like going to an Olds only event.
Last edited by Oldsmaniac; September 5th, 2012 at 08:23 AM. Reason: spelling
September 5th, 2012, 08:28 AM
#29
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 2,026
This made me laugh as I think you've hit the nail right on the head.
Any OCA leader should be able to answer this question, and I'd love to know what their answers are.
I think most would respond that the club puts on a national show each year which brings together Olds enthusiasts from around the country, and that's a good thing. They would also mention JWO.
But, in my opinion, these aren't enough. First of all, other shows, like the annual Homecoming show, are equally successful and important, if not moreso.
Second, a magazine like JWO should be more. I agree with the view that there are too many articles about how people's lives went today and not enough about Oldsmobile itself, its history, its cars, its successes and failures over the years, and so forth.
Having been the editor of the Mid-Ohio Chapter's newsletter for about 10 years total, I'm fully aware that no matter how much you exhort members to send you articles, you rarely get any, and you really have to be prepared to provide all the content yourself. Given the size of the OCA, I don't think it's inappropriate to consider hiring someone full-time as a writer.
But what the OCA does NOT do is as glaring as what it does do. For one thing, it should be a repository for all information Oldsmobile. Factory literature, advertising, magazine articles, dealer brochures, and more. The OCA should be the go-to place any time anyone thinks about finding out information about their car.
But this job is being done by others. Wild About Cars has, for example, in a relatively short time, and through the work of just a few dedicated people, amassed an amazing amount of literature, with Oldsmobile being the brand with the largest amount. When I want to know about my car or any other Oldsmobile, I go there first. Why isn't the OCA doing this? More importantly, why didn't they start doing this 10 or 20 years ago?
I also agree that the OCA's website has a late 20th century look to it and is badly in need of updating, and an organization the size of the OCA should be able to accomplish this.
Any OCA leader should be able to answer this question, and I'd love to know what their answers are.
I think most would respond that the club puts on a national show each year which brings together Olds enthusiasts from around the country, and that's a good thing. They would also mention JWO.
But, in my opinion, these aren't enough. First of all, other shows, like the annual Homecoming show, are equally successful and important, if not moreso.
Second, a magazine like JWO should be more. I agree with the view that there are too many articles about how people's lives went today and not enough about Oldsmobile itself, its history, its cars, its successes and failures over the years, and so forth.
Having been the editor of the Mid-Ohio Chapter's newsletter for about 10 years total, I'm fully aware that no matter how much you exhort members to send you articles, you rarely get any, and you really have to be prepared to provide all the content yourself. Given the size of the OCA, I don't think it's inappropriate to consider hiring someone full-time as a writer.
But what the OCA does NOT do is as glaring as what it does do. For one thing, it should be a repository for all information Oldsmobile. Factory literature, advertising, magazine articles, dealer brochures, and more. The OCA should be the go-to place any time anyone thinks about finding out information about their car.
But this job is being done by others. Wild About Cars has, for example, in a relatively short time, and through the work of just a few dedicated people, amassed an amazing amount of literature, with Oldsmobile being the brand with the largest amount. When I want to know about my car or any other Oldsmobile, I go there first. Why isn't the OCA doing this? More importantly, why didn't they start doing this 10 or 20 years ago?
I also agree that the OCA's website has a late 20th century look to it and is badly in need of updating, and an organization the size of the OCA should be able to accomplish this.
I think the future is dim for this club. I believe the Homecoming show is "the" show for Oldsmobiles. I think it can stand on its own if the OCA goes away. But to think that a major marque like Oldsmobile wouldnt have a national club is a crime. Really, just kick dirt on the Olds coffin if that happens.
September 5th, 2012, 09:38 AM
#30
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: SE Wisconsin
Posts: 1,915
Dave:
For one, I am not saying that there are not those of us who both like paper and who still like to work on our cars, I am merely saying that the decsion-makers in the OCA only see it the way I described.
Paper is good, but if you think paper is the most efficient way, you are going to get what you see. You, yourself, publish electronically and you recognize that you must have that media to reach out to people.
The trouble is that the OCA management sees the paper as the only way.
For one, I am not saying that there are not those of us who both like paper and who still like to work on our cars, I am merely saying that the decsion-makers in the OCA only see it the way I described.
Paper is good, but if you think paper is the most efficient way, you are going to get what you see. You, yourself, publish electronically and you recognize that you must have that media to reach out to people.
The trouble is that the OCA management sees the paper as the only way.
I further agree that the history of both Oldsmobile and Ransom E. Olds is both pretty fascinating and important. All Olds organizations should do more to publicize and promote it.
What does the club provide? I found my car through the club (yes, via the classifieds). I have met some pretty Olds knowledgeable folk. In fact, one of my best friends I met through our Oldsmobile connection.
The truth be known, which applies to quite a few entities, is that the club provides what one puts into it.
Perhaps herein lies the source of the problem? Instead of writing the organization off and moving on to other climes, maybe time spent in shaping the organization into one meeting the needs of the day would be well spent?
September 5th, 2012, 10:13 AM
#31
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 2,026
I think that approach has been tried, if you read what Bob posted above.
I cant say whether publicizing Olds history and RE Olds will bring in new members or not. Its 2012, and RE Olds has been dead for 62 years. If all you have to go on is stuff that happened 100 years ago then you are not going to appeal to younger people.
What are you doing now? What are your plans for the future? Where is the club headed? Whats your website address so I can read up on the club. Id be asking these questions if I was new to the car world, bought an Oldsmobile, and was looking for a club to join.
September 5th, 2012, 05:22 PM
#34
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 2,703
September 5th, 2012, 08:04 PM
#35
One part at a time
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Missouri
Posts: 167
Former OCA member, I dropped out 4 or 5 years ago. I had got to where I just skimmed the magazine and found most of what I needed at different sites on the web with the infamous ROP being the biggest asset.
I had been thinking about rejoining since I got finally got my car on the road but I think this thread has killed those intentions. It's a tough sell IMHO, there is a huge disconnect between the kids and those of us who cringe when they see a donk.
I had been thinking about rejoining since I got finally got my car on the road but I think this thread has killed those intentions. It's a tough sell IMHO, there is a huge disconnect between the kids and those of us who cringe when they see a donk.
September 5th, 2012, 11:16 PM
#36
Registered User
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,142
I'm only into pre '64 Oldsmobiles, but some of the technical articles about Cutlass/442 stuff was actually interesting to me. They definately need more types of these articles. And I can do without that guy writing a column about trying to find some stupid jack in his station wagon or his travels in it. The show coverage and classifieds are great cause I don't have to weed through a billion chevy/ ford ads like in other publications
September 6th, 2012, 06:59 AM
#37
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: southeastern Michigan
Posts: 14,203
September 6th, 2012, 07:16 AM
#38
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Rathdrum, Idano
Posts: 9,127
I've been a member of OCA for about 10 years and was active in the local chapter including being president for two years. Stopped going to meetings just this year. Our local club meets once a month and mostly eats donuts drinks coffee and talks very little about anything to do with their cars. They go to a few shows but don't cruise at all. I see the same attitude in other OCA clubs. Lots of members support the marque but very few actually do anything. Most of the Olds people I meet that are what I consider car guys are members at large like I am now and do not go to club meetings anymore.
I don't know where OCA will end up but the future does not look bright
I don't know where OCA will end up but the future does not look bright
September 6th, 2012, 07:40 AM
#39
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: southeastern Michigan
Posts: 14,203
I think it's also a function of how widespread, geographically-speaking, the chapter is. Ohio, for example, has three chapters spread across a relatively small state. It's easy for members of those chapters to attend meetings, go on cruises, attend their annual car show, and just generally stay in touch. No one is likely more than an hour away from where the chapter's meeting and car show usually are. Many are just minutes away.
On the other side of this coin, you've got, for example, one chapter, the Puget Sound Olds Club (your chapter, right?), as the ONLY chapter in the entire Northwest Zone that covers six northwestern U.S. states and three Canadian provinces. How likely is someone from, say, Cheyenne, Wyoming, to feel connected to, let alone attend the monthly meetings of, a chapter headquartered 1200 miles away? Even for people who live in the general area of the chapter's headquarters, I would guess that the average drive might be a bit more than it is in a more densely populated area.
September 6th, 2012, 10:14 AM
#40
Captain Starfire
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Ponchatoula, LA
Posts: 1,669
Good stuff
Really enjoying reading everybody's comments; it sounds like the majority have "been there, done that." I agree w/ a lot of what I've seen. And the tone is civil.... awesome. 
I see these big pow-wow threads about the OCA fairly regularly, however, and nothing ever comes of it. This seems like such a great (albeit usually missed) opportunity for the OCA 'Powers That Be' to have so many coherent voices in one place.
I don't think many (any?) of us want a magazine for donk-ers; but maybe the sun needs to shine in just a tad. Even though mine is a '64 land yacht, I've owned others. I grew up lusting after the 60s and 70s 442s, and these led me to appreciate the rest.
Sure, everybody's going to have favorites and preferences; but if it's Oldsmobile, and if this is the OCA, I'd certainly expect a story on a later Toro or Aurora from time to time; or even a Quad 4. And that wouldn't eliminate a possible feature about Ransom's preference in deodorants, or any other relevant historical article. It's all Olds.
As a rookie OCA member, I can say I like JWO, but it's starving for more meat. OCA does make a contribution and is well known in the hobby; so I want to support that. But a story - whether resto, how-to, or historical - with 95% text and 5% pictures (if they contain any at all besides the author's mug) are not inviting; especially when half the content is personality fluff.
When I joined, I figured I'd give it a year and see whether I got my money's worth. We'll see soon.
Oldsclub.org, however, should be a high priority to the club. Any time a web master doesn't update the home page the DAY after a national meet, or the MOMENT the next meet venue is determined, they're dropping the ball. (The July meet is still featured as if it's not occurred yet.) The first three rules of hosting and managing a Web site are Update, Update, and Update. Give people a reason to come back often.
To surmise, I, too like to have a magazine in my hands. (How about that "Antique Automobile"?) So if OCA would add more car features in JWO each month, and keep the web site current, that would probably be enough to get my $30 for next year.
I see these big pow-wow threads about the OCA fairly regularly, however, and nothing ever comes of it. This seems like such a great (albeit usually missed) opportunity for the OCA 'Powers That Be' to have so many coherent voices in one place.
I don't think many (any?) of us want a magazine for donk-ers; but maybe the sun needs to shine in just a tad. Even though mine is a '64 land yacht, I've owned others. I grew up lusting after the 60s and 70s 442s, and these led me to appreciate the rest.
Sure, everybody's going to have favorites and preferences; but if it's Oldsmobile, and if this is the OCA, I'd certainly expect a story on a later Toro or Aurora from time to time; or even a Quad 4. And that wouldn't eliminate a possible feature about Ransom's preference in deodorants, or any other relevant historical article. It's all Olds.
As a rookie OCA member, I can say I like JWO, but it's starving for more meat. OCA does make a contribution and is well known in the hobby; so I want to support that. But a story - whether resto, how-to, or historical - with 95% text and 5% pictures (if they contain any at all besides the author's mug) are not inviting; especially when half the content is personality fluff.
When I joined, I figured I'd give it a year and see whether I got my money's worth. We'll see soon.
Oldsclub.org, however, should be a high priority to the club. Any time a web master doesn't update the home page the DAY after a national meet, or the MOMENT the next meet venue is determined, they're dropping the ball. (The July meet is still featured as if it's not occurred yet.) The first three rules of hosting and managing a Web site are Update, Update, and Update. Give people a reason to come back often.
To surmise, I, too like to have a magazine in my hands. (How about that "Antique Automobile"?) So if OCA would add more car features in JWO each month, and keep the web site current, that would probably be enough to get my $30 for next year.
