Just pulled the trigger on a '68 442, which is reported to have the original 455 Rocket motor. I was under the impression the 455 wasn't available until the 1970 model year, other than Hurst models. The seller claims it is the original numbers matching motor, and it has a red block. Looking at the wikipedia page for Oldsmobile 442 it makes it sound like the base 442s all came with 400 c.i. motors. It's not a deal breaker for me as I do want a 455, but can anyone confirm is any 442s in 1968 did come with the red block 455 motor?

 

You are correct, no 455 in the 442 until 1970. The exception as you noted is the '68-69 H/O. The vin derivative on the pad below the #1 spark plug will tell you if it matches (it won't). Post pics of your new wheels when you get the chance.

 

And double check the casting number behind the water pump.

 

The seller is either uninformed or lying. Be afraid, be very afraid. You may find that it really is "numbers matching" - and a G-block 400, not a 455. It also begs the question of what else has the seller incorrectly claimed about the car.

 

Hmmmm. Thanks for the replies. I will try to confirm those details and get back. I haven't picked the car up yet as it is out of state.

 

 

Maybe you will be really lucky and its actually a Hurst

 

 

Yeh, it has probably been repainted and the guy doesn't know what he has. Sure

 

Just wishful thinking . I'm still hoping to find the build sheet in my 72 Cutlass to prove that someone changed the VIN from an "X" W30 convertible to a "K"Cutlass just to save on insurance costs 45 years ago

 

OK Fellas, got the car home and have some info. block stamp is a 30M, so looks like a 1970 motor. Has a QJet carb and, Edelbrock Performer Intake, and E stamped heads. While I am glad it is a 455 the car is an absolute dog here at my elevation (6500-7000 ft) in Colorado Springs. It is a TH400 tranny and is just incredibly sluggish. The shop I bought it from said they put a nice cam in it (either Iskey or Edelbrock) and I wonder if that has anything to do with it. I am not joking when I say a Prius would smoke me. Is it possible the carb needs to be completed re-jetted or at least tuned, along with some timing touch up to have some respectable power? I'm trying not to panic yet but this motor is gutless the way it sits. Somebody please talk me off a cliff...

 

Is this the same shop that claimed it was the original motor???

You begin to understand my skepticism.

Yes, it's a 1970 motor, and the "E" heads are consistent with that. Unfortunately, you have no idea what, if anything, was done to it. It's entirely possible this came from a 2bbl Delta 88, with small valves and low compression. You also have no idea of the condition of the motor - mileage, wear, etc. Certainly a compression test is in order. What is the carb number? What is the distributor advance curve? What are the exact cam specs? Unfortunately you don't know what you have, and apparently this shop doesn't either.

By the way, yes, you will likely need to rejet the carb for the altitude at a minimum. Are the plugs looking sooty?

 

 

I would start by checking the distributor: both timing and points condition (if it has them).
If the timing is severely-retarded or the points are shot, then the engine will be way down on power.

 

Also need to check cam timing, which unfortunately is a lot more work.

Unfortunately you have no idea what's inside that motor. Unless the shop can provide hard documentation as to what exactly was done to it, you're just guessing. A properly built and running 455 should impress you. Do you know what gears are in the rear end?

 

 

At least in Michigan there were a ton of factory direct dealer options. My parents bought there 442 new, on the lot. Not a Hurst model. With the 455, Hurst manual shifter, and glass packs. It was on the lot for two days before they bought it. Black with black interior. It was a 69 purchased in 68. There are a ton of internet know it alls that are full of crap.

 

I see you chose violence today...

This is not Reddit, Quora, Facebook, etc. Classicoldsmobile.com has the most knowledgeable Oldsmobile enthusiasts on earth. But you don't need that level of expertise to verify anything like this.

GM corporate edict says what you are saying was impossible from the factory.

 

Starting with you. If you knew jack about Oldsmobiles, you would know what you posted is bullsh!t. Just walk away.

 

Fixed that for you. Unless it was a Hurst Olds, you did NOT get a "numbers matching" 455 engine in a 68 or 69 442. Wasn't even an option. End of story. A non-matching 455, sure. They'd do about anything if you paid extra.

 

I like the part that it came from the factory with glass packs. He never said if it was a 3-speed or a 4-speed. What a joke.

 

More original, numbers matching, beats a ginned up fake for sure. But engine swaps aren’t the end of the world. Sometimes they happened early in a car’s life - or the original block cracked, or whatever.

Just to put it out there, my ‘66 Starfire (a much less popular, less valuable model than a 68 442) has a ‘70 455 and I’ve been happy with it for 26 or 27 years. The big block runs like a top and the driving experience is as good or better than it would have been with the original 425 my S/F came with in ‘66.

To Joe’s point, at whatever altitude, a 455 should put your back in your seat at least a bit depending on final rear end gearing. In those years Olds released freeway gear ratios like 2.93:1 and 2.73:1 which aimed at better fuel economy. Off the line, they didn’t snap your neck much, but they got good mileage. If someone swapped the engine, who knows what the rear end gear ratio might be. Good thing to pin down. If you pull the cover (say to replace the gear oil as a preventative thing…) you’ll find the teeth count (there fore the ratio) stamped on the ring gear.

As an enthusiast, but not a real purist, I appreciate the original cars, but also accept that 60 years later these cars can be reasonably expected to mutate from factory over the years. My cars certainly have, but then most of those mutations were my choice. Except, for the perfectly fine 455 my ‘66 Starfire came with on purchase in the late 90’s.

No shade on numbers matching people, you have my admiration. Just saying that the driving experience in these cars isn’t changed all that much by numbers stamped on the block, if that’s what you’re going for. If you’re in points/show mode, then originality/correctness is a much bigger deal.

Cheers
Chris

 

The Graber boys are out there in Colorado and they are big time Olds guys. Jason & Brian Graber are on Facebook and you can search them there. If you can't find them let me know and I'll try to get you hooked up with them.

 

The same claim from 2 years ago, and still none of this "documentation" has been presented.

https://classicoldsmobile.com/forums...-121289/page2/

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Why do you guys even waste the time to engage?

 

I was bored.

 

Heck, in that case I have some car projects you can come and work on.