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Is spacer needed for 55 hydramatic tailshaft seal?
My 55 Super 88 hydramatic tailshaft has been leaking so bad like there was no seal in there at all. After the end cap was removed, there was no spacer to the back of the seal. The seal had walked out or wasnt driven in all the way to begin with.
is this spacer needed or what is its function? I feel like its there to apply pressure to the back of the seal so it doesnt walk out, but shouldnt the fit be tight enough on the outer race not to need a spacer? Below is the drawing of the tailshaft and pics of the seal that came out, which looks like it was driven in only half way. Any thoughts are appreciated!!
My 54 has a 55 transmission and engine in it. I had the hydra-matic rebuilt last year by and old experienced transmission guy who did a great job. Then it started leaking from the tailshaft. He explained to me that the 55 and 56 used a bushing and there are none available anywhere. We replaced the rear seal once but I think it is only the dust seal. I am going to attempt another seal replacement. If I have to use some JB Weld to hold it in I will. It is a pain.
Thanks redoldsman. Is that "bushing" you refer to the "spacer" that is listed on my drawing above? You probably cant buy that, but I would imagine making that part wouldnt be too impossible. Its essentially just a thin walled tube. Be careful about using JB weld on that seal since its hard enough to get out as it is. Thanks!
If I have to use JB Weld it will be a last resort and then I will only use enough to keep it from coming out. I would not glob it all around the seal. Take a look at the seal on Rock Auto. It comes with a sleeve. I don't know if this is what is supposed to be in there or not.
The 55-56 only seal presses in to the recess large end first, as seen in the manual image. It is very difficult to do it right without removing the tail shaft housing, and you might not have the Kent-Moore seal drivers for the job, but it can get done with patience and care. The sheet steel spacer and outer dust shield have no part in containing internal fluid and/or preventing leaks - The dust seal assy could be absent or you could use the old one with no detriment for a hobby car. The seal you have looks like the same seal marked as "Seal" in the manual image, again installed large end first until seated against the bearing. There really isn't any expedient way to remove a properly installed original seal for replacement without some sort of split tube two fingers slide hammer puller, so doing it on the bench without the shaft in the hole is the idea. Plus, even if you extract the original seal cleanly, driving in the new seal in a oily mess over the output shaft is the last thing you want. Clean, new seal in a clean dry recess is the idea. Old timers might want to shellac the seal in to the housing but if it is a driving fit, that is best way.
My recollection of this is a bit fuzzy, I checked my facts with Fatsco on the phone. Here is their kit showing the correct seal we speak of in the upper left corner on the auction image. Great kit for a great price. They presently have no stock on the dust seal, and do not plan a reproduction of it.
Thanks redoldsman and coldwar - I think I may have an even bigger problem....the mechanic said when he looked in there after he got the seal out, he did not see a sleeve on the shaft or a snap ring (see highlighted below). He saw the oring though, which by the drawing gets captured in the back of this sleeve. I think I may need this sleeve. Looks like the seal rides on this sleeve and may be the reason why there was such a severe leakpath. Im not sure where I would even find this sleeve
Here is a link to what Rock Auto has for a 55 Olds. Notice the last one has a bushing but is not the two tiered seal the 55 apparently uses. They also have the bearing. I have one of those two tiered seals and I have the last one listed with the bushing. I have not put my car up on stands and pulled the driveshaft yet.
Way to go coldwar, they have it! Just gotta get on the same page with the mechanic and if this is all we are missing we can probably assemble this puzzle soon enough!
I love this site for what you guys can dig up for a fix for someone... Thanks all for the research it will help others down the road i'm sure..... Tedd
Ordering the parts now. Talked to the mechanic and we both agree on what is missing. Shame, I wanted to drive this weekend but it looks like that will have to wait.
Thanks coldwar and setzman. I will call Fatsco tomorrow. Then I will have to try and get my transmission guy to install these parts since my transmission is 6 months out of warranty.
Tedd, you certainly do you share of contributing to fixes for our old cars. That is what makes this a great site.
So this was quite the adventure. I was able to get all my parts and tools between Fatsco (800) 524-0485 in Pine Brook, NJ (they had the sleeve), and a private guy named Dave Edwards up in Massachusetts (www.autotran.us) at 1-781-449-2065.
Dave rented me the kent moore seal removal tool J-5946 ($25 + $175 deposit which he refunded immediately at return) and an installation tool that he made which worked perfectly. He also sold me the spacer, as well as a sidepan gasket kit that I needed as I wanted to do that seal and also the speedometer cable seal. The dust shield/cap at the very end should be reused as you wont find that anywhere, I dont think.
If you do not have a sleeve on the output shaft of the hydramatic, it will always leak. The seal rides on the sleeve (see drawing in earlier post). Also, the sleeve has to be free of scratches or even a new seal will leak when it rides on it. Attached is a stack up of all the parts needed in the tail housing with the part numbers. Fatsco had the sleeve and was surprised they did - I was told by many people this is not a normally replaced item. I was happy to see that the old sleeve in my tail housing was full of small pits and scratches, which explained why it leaked so bad with a new seal. Im saving all my old parts in case I need to replace anything again or refer to it. So far, the tail is not dripping at all. Im sure the sleeve will clean up also.
Thanks for the help, contact me with any questions!
55 Oldsmobile Hydramatic bearing retainer (tailshaft) seal parts
Did you get the spacer from Fatsco? I doubt I have one of those. As rare as those sleeves are I can't believe they had at least two of them because I bought one too/ Those things are very rare. I talked to my transmission guy today and we are going to try and get it in next week.
Yes, Fatsco had it. It was a used one that the guy admitted was on his desk. It was smooth and clean tho, and so far its been working. Im glad you got it because i was saving mine in case you or someone else needed it.
One tip for your mechanic - that seal needs to be driven all the way back. Its hard to do as its a tight fit. The seal should not be driven in by pounding the front face of it as you will deform that face and make removal, if needed, very difficult. The seal needs to be driven by only impacting the annular face so that the front face isnt ruined. A pvc pipe of the right OD and ID will do it. Drive that seal in all the way!
i got the spacer that is the last part in the tail from Dave Edwards.
Make sue u also have an extra snap ring as the one in there may deform. Good luck!
Fatsco part# 8617120. Should be about $15. My mechanic didnt think it was needed but in my opinion it serves at least one important purpose. If it wont fit all the way into the bore of the tail and hangs out, then you havent driven the seal in far enough. Also, i think it tends to serve as some support behind the seal and helps it from keeping from backing out...rare case i know.
I just talked with Fatsco. They have the spacer ($20) and they just got the dust seals in about 2 days ago so I ordered both of them. I spoke with Mike. Good Guys. Parts will be in next Tuesday so I will get the car back to my transmission guy on Wednesday hopefully. My transmission guy is about 78 and knows these things pretty well. He has the tools for the rear seal. My transmission works well after he rebuilt it but this seal has been a torn in my side.
August 28th, 2018, 06:22 PM
