1968ragtop

So now that Keisler is gone, what options are left for a manual trans with overdrive? There is the Richmond 5 speed (no overdrive but you can run a tall gear which would work just as well) Also the Tremec tko 500/600 What other options are available?

garys 68&72

The Richmond comes in a 5 and 6 speed OD as well as the 1:1 5th 5 speed. Availability seems to be a problem lately though.
There are several vendors that sell trans or packages with the TKO. Problem is the TKO requires the tunnel be cut. Not so for the Richmond.


Just google TRO transmissions, there are about a half dozen companies they supply the TKO/packages. A few:
http://www.5speedtransmissions.com/index.html
http://www.hurst-drivelines.com/
http://americanpowertrain.com/

1968ragtop

I like the richmond 5 speed, but if they went **** up would you still be able to get parts for them?

Stevec

Nice red ragtop!

1968ragtop

Thanks, it would be nicer if it was a 442 though!

garys 68&72

I've got a Richmond 6 speed. They've been around for decades, but honestly, hard to say.
No easy answers here.

Mr Nick

I heard Bowler Trans is going to sell the SS700. Keep in mind the LGT-700 is a Legend Gear transmission, not a Keisler trans. Keisler just called it the SS700.

This was posted on the Pro-Touring site:

Mr Nick

Just be cautious of the 8-10 week delivery line...

If I were to do it all over again, I'd get aT-56 and just raise the trans tunnel. On the highways around here, you gotta go 75mph or you'll get run over anyway. The double overdrive would be nice.

1969w3155

http://www.libertysgears.com/ They have aquired some of the assets of Keisler, and after getting some that sorted out, they will be available, offering trans that require no cutting of the floorpan. They have been in business for quite a while.

garys 68&72

I thought Keisler was complaining about gear set quality for the 700.
Also, seems the 700 is a one off trans. Parts availability would be nil if discontinued.
And yeah 8-10 weeks somehow turns into 20 weeks too often.

joe_padavano

Apparently developing brand new transmissions from scratch isn't that profitable.

Weir sells a BOP bellhousing for the T56 transmission.

garys 68&72

Just an FYI, I contacted Richmond. They responded quickly, maybe they're not gone after all. At least they're not requiring a deposit for delivery next month:


We have not stopped producing the 6 speed we are just unable to produce these at this time. Richmond is under new ownership and we are still in a transition phase using new vendors and suppliers for all the transmission components. Production will resume on the 6 speed once we have all components back in stock. We are scheduled to be back in production on the 6 speed March/April of this year depending on parts supply from the suppliers.

Johnny Brown
Technical Support
1001 W. Exchange Ave.
Chicago, IL. 60609

dc2x4drvr

Legend Gear, and partner Abundant Mfg. aren't going anywhere. The first 200 SS700's sent to Keisler had to be reworked, later units were good to go. The trans is not entirely new, more like a new case using T56 guts.

1968ragtop

Auto Gear has a nice trans. Its basically an M-22 with your choice of Wide ratio or close ratio. Not as good as overdrive, but the W.R. with a 3.08 gear would probably work quite well. Strong trans. No tunnel cutting and the gear spacing looks like it might be better than the M-20. Anyone have experience with these auto gear units

garys 68&72

Not exactly autogear. But when I put together my LS swap 72 swap, the car came with a 2.73 rear. I found a super T10 with 3.42 1st gear. The gear spacing is a little wide, but the LS motors are designed for a wide torque band. So that's my DD.
Autogear now offers a 3.00 1st gear Muncie along the same thought lines.
The only caveat is trans ratings generally follow the 1st gear ratio. So I would not consider a 3.00 or 3.42 1st gear trans for big torque or the track.

z11375ss

Get the Tremec. With 3.73s and the 5 speed highway speeds are very reasonable rpm wise. 2000 at 70 ish. Nice ride btw.

1968ragtop

z11375, I like your youtube video, that car looks like a lot of fun!! Is the tremec in the car in that video?

68conv455

Ragtops post prompted me to watch the video too. Awesome!!!!!
Good rubber in second and chirp in third.
Not to hijack the thread, but did you use a go-pro for that? How did you mount it to the rear quarter (suction cup)?
Excellent exhaust note on the mount location.

1964f-85

I built a Mustang GT T-5 with aftermarket gears and bearings, its been great for years. I wouldent make it a drag car with a t-5 but for the $700.00 i have in it, i could build two for the Summit T-5 with the same gears.

z11375ss

The trans in the vid is a Muncie M-20. The GoPro was suction cup mounted to the inside of the passenger window and then on the side of the car. Thanks for the props!

allyolds68

I was looking for options for a 5 or 6 speed project in the far distant future today. Quicktime makes a BOP dual starter position bell housing as well for about $600. I searched this site and was surprised no one has done a T56 conversion. It seems like with all the problems that Keisler had "out of the box" someone would be putting a kit together to do this conversion. Apparently you can get a used T56 for around $1k. I've found snippets of info on a few pro touring websites about BOP conversions but not what I would call "the" definitive thread explaining the process. Other than starter position everything else should basically be the same whether B, O, or P.


What has anyone found?

dc2x4drvr

I sure didn't have ant problems with my SS700 5 speed 'out of the box' just the opposite. The T56 in stock form can be used but it's only rated at 450# torque! and the stock rail shifter probably won't work in our cars. I run the Quick Time BH, very nice piece.

Mr Nick

BOP engine to LS T-56 trans http://americanpowertrain.com/i-8426...gm-magnum.html

In this article they install a TKO600 but talk about the T-56 http://www.popularhotrodding.com/tec...n/viewall.html

Read the last post here http://www.pro-touring.com/threads/1...ight=t-56+olds

allyolds68

I'm glad that yours went well. I read through a thread this afternoon about a guy with a 68 GTO that spent a great deal of time working through issues with them (Keisler). I'm running a mild 70 455 so I'm sure I'm under 450 ft-lbs





Nick,


I couldn't get these two to links work for me. I might have to log in there to view the threads.


I guess what I was looking for to get started is exactly what configurations of T56 would work for the swap so I knew what to look for should it come along. For example, from what I've seen (in pictures anyway) the corvette T56 is a completely different animal

1969w3155

Even the two barrel 455 was rated at 500 lb ft in 1970.

nj_cutlass72

So ss 700 and lgt-700 is the exact trans? Do you have the gear ratio's? With no tunnel work it's a better choice to Tremecs as long as it's available to the market, no? Thx

Mr Nick

http://legendgt.com/

http://www.sprakerracing.com/

WIDE RATIO 2.97-2.07-1.43-1.0- .84 OD.
CLOSE RATIO 2.66-1.78-1.30-1.0-.69 OR .80 OD.

dc2x4drvr

Yes, 2.66 low and .68 OD, wide ratio. Fits with no tunnel mods..

dc2x4drvr

At the time I ordered mine only one gearset was available, and they advertised it as wide ratio with a ..68 OD nothing else was offered, or available.

nj_cutlass72

If I ever get there,

Rpm 2000, rear gear ratio 3.42, trans gear ratio 0.68, tire diameter 27 = 69 mph

archeryshooter

I have been looking at the M23 for sometime and sounds like a good bolt up replacement that is strong and diff ratios to choose from. I am starting a post on here to see if anyone has run one for awhile and how its been. I also am on performance years pontiac forms under street cars were I asked the same question. Sounds like a good trans for the money as well $2300
You can find threads on them on teem chevelle forms too.

1964f-85

Remember thet the horsepower and torque ratings up till 71 were rated without all of the engine accessories like fans, water pump, alternator, power steering etc, all zapped alot of power form the motors. The gross ratings were much higher than the later net ratings. Unless you are seriously beating the crap out of your car, all of these transmissions will live a long and happy life behind your 455. My upgraded T-5 has been in my car for about 4 o 5 years with out a glitch. I admit i dont power shift it like i did my muncie, thats more about the fact that i can afford to break the motor than the transmission. I figure i can build 3 of these for what i would have in an aftermarket transmission. I do alot of burn outs, all the torque in the would wont break anything if the car wont hook up!

Mr Nick

This is very true, and why I won't put a drag radial on for a while. I can't afford to break anything... yet.

archeryshooter

Yes sir I broke my muncie 3x last summer on the street with micky L-60 bias plys after that I may as well have went with a stronger tranny to begin with I did have a wheel hop issue on the first failure. Im not fixing the muncie again cluster gear and 1st are out of it now.

z11375ss

When I put together the combo I have now, I knew the Muncie was the weak link. Tremec now. The 12 bolt is damn near indestructible. The guy who built it for me told me to keep it if I sell the car. It will last forever. No issues so far.

archeryshooter

Love your video with your dog sticking his nose out the window while your running it through the gears my dog loves to ride with me too, but cant take him in my car with the white seats. I had A 68 Lemans with very similar color inside and out of your car

1964f-85

What is a muncie 3x?
Wheel hop wil kill any moving part, i used to have air shocks and station wagon springs in the back, very violent wheel hop, blew a sagnaw into bits, the cluster gear was laying on the ground! Stock springs, good shocks and the lower control arms, parallel to the ground, now it rises up in the back when i stand on it. Generally i do burn outs from a rolling start and dont power break, it just spins both wheels for yards. Loads of fun!

z11375ss

A great color combo I must say on both cars. Tobin was my runnin buddy. Had to put him down recently. Going to miss him a lot this summer. Every Friday and Saturday we would hit the car shows and walk through. He never wore a leash. Too cool. What a mellow gentleman he was. People knew him and didn't know me! What a hoot.

WTony

I have a brand new richmond gear 5 speed I took out of a doomed project car I purchased years ago and have been itching to put it into something. Im putting it in my 70 442 convertible with a stock 455 and 2.56 12 bolt posi rear. It will be similar to an overdrive and since the trans has a 3.28 first gear, first gear will feel the same as having a M20 with a 3.32 rear gear. I can live with that for a driver. Not looking to race it with slicks or drag radials so the torque issue shouldnt be a problem if the car doesnt hook up. Plus, that 500ft# tq is at 3200(?) rpm? Unless your power shifting and not taking your foot off the gas, it shouldnt be in that high of torque range right?

z11375ss

No slicks, no break. Pretty simple. This usually applies to most applications.