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everything is doable if ya throw enough money at it.in this case you would have way more in the trans swap then the rest of the car is worth.cheapest way would probably be to convert to rear wheel drive.jay leno did it on a 66 toro but he used an automatic.
Do you mean manual transmission, or manual brakes and steering? It would probably be easier to convert to manual brakes than manual steering or manual transmission. Especially in a Toronado. Oldsguy and I converted his 69 Delta 88 to manual steering and manual brakes years ago. It can probably all be done, it just depends on how much motivation you have.
If one day I ever get a toronado I'll be more than happy to keep her FWD and auto.
Cheers,
Troy
How did you intend to convert a Toro to a manual trans? The FWD transaxle is derived from a TH400 with the gears and clutches positioned on the LH side of the engine. A chain drive connects the torque converter at the back of the engine to the rest of the trans. There is no equivalent manual trans that has the same layout or torque handling capacity. The drive axles are just about centered under the engine.
Any FWD (or mid engine RWD) transaxle has the transmission behind the engine, with the differential usually just aft of the clutch. This puts the axles about a foot to 18" further rearward from the stock Toro location, or alternatively pushes the engine that much forward. Of course, the only transaxles that can handle 500 ft-lbs are expensive racing units that you aren't going to find in a wrecking yard.
People have been looking at this for decades, since the Toro drive package is attractive for mid-engine kit cars. There was at least one attempt to stuff a Muncie in place of the TH400 gear sets. Suffice to say that it never happened.
People have been looking at this for decades, since the Toro drive package is attractive for mid-engine kit cars. There was at least one attempt to stuff a Muncie in place of the TH400 gear sets. Suffice to say that it never happened.
A Muncie transmission in a Toronado? Was it attempted with an older RWD Munice, or was it a later Munice 282 used in Pontiac Fieros?
Speaking of, a Toronado drivetrain would be awesome in a Pontiac Fiero!
The GM f40 and Getrag f23 are often "beefed up" to live behind a 4.9L Cadillac v8 or 4.6L Northstar swapped into Fieros. I guess with enough money anything is possible.
A Muncie transmission in a Toronado? Was it attempted with an older RWD Munice, or was it a later Munice 282 used in Pontiac Fieros?
Speaking of, a Toronado drivetrain would be awesome in a Pontiac Fiero!
The GM f40 and Getrag f23 are often "beefed up" to live behind a 4.9L Cadillac v8 or 4.6L Northstar swapped into Fieros. I guess with enough money anything is possible.
The Fiero didn't exist when this was contemplated in the 1970s. That was a conventional RWD Muncie. The whole idea was to use a clutch where the torque converter was located, adapt the Toro chain drive, and use a Muncie case next to the engine where the TH425 case normally resides. A custom machined adapter would mate the Toro differential to the aft (now forward) end of the Muncie.
A transverse transaxle is not going to work in a Toro longitudinal configuration. Longitudinal transaxles other than the Toro don't work from a layout standpoint, as I mentioned previously.
Compare the axle location here:
With that in a more conventional longitudinal transaxle:
In fact, the only thing that's even close is this Acura Legend transaxle, except the trans part still extends far back and the diff is on the wrong side. Of course, this is an AT...
If I had to do such a thing, I'd get a convertible bellhousing and a GMC manual trans and 4x4 transfer case and front diff and shafts and try to drive the Toro hubs with them. "We so fly, in 4 high."
If I had to do such a thing, I'd get a convertible bellhousing and a GMC manual trans and 4x4 transfer case and front diff and shafts and try to drive the Toro hubs with them. "We so fly, in 4 high."
How would you package that under the floor? The whole point of the Toro drive package is that everything is forward of the firewall.
How would you package that under the floor? The whole point of the Toro drive package is that everything is forward of the firewall.
Eventhough the Toronado has no transmission hump on the floorboard they have less leg and foot room than Delta 88s and 98s of the same era. I've sat in first and second generation Toronados and they're pretty small.
Originally Posted by Koda
If I had to do such a thing, I'd get a convertible bellhousing and a GMC manual trans and 4x4 transfer case and front diff and shafts and try to drive the Toro hubs with them. "We so fly, in 4 high."
Well, Joe, if I had to make that work, I'd have to clearance the floor pans, I suppose.
From what I can see, I think the Toro used leaf springs for a non powered rear axle. Perhaps it could be replaced by a driven one and room made for the prop shaft to get back there.
Another solution would be to buy a 66 Buick Riviera instead which used the Toro style body but had rear wheel drive.
Since I don't have Jay Leno's money, one of my fantasy builds has always been using the frame and floorpan from a Riv under a Toro to make it RWD. Both are E-body cars.
That one is unfortunately quite a ways down on the list of cars I have to build before I die, however.
Eventhough the Toronado has no transmission hump on the floorboard they have less leg and foot room than Delta 88s and 98s of the same era. I've sat in first and second generation Toronados and they're pretty small.
I drove a tiny '95 Honda Civic hatchback for years and it never felt any smaller inside than my 18 foot long '66 Toronado
In fact, in that car I was able to carry a complete Toronado exhaust system and close the rear hatch. Another time, I carried a complete 455 in the back and got 470 miles out of a 10 gallon fuel tank
February 4th, 2018, 03:33 PM
