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my Name is Markus old from Germany. I drive an Oldsmobile Cutlass Supreme from 1970. The car is shipped 1970 from the U.S. to Bremen -Germany and was driven the same time in Bavaria (Nuernberg). Thats a great Story for a Car History. Original was as an 350 engine in my car but anybody build a 403 in my car. I don`t can ask the former Driver he is dead :-(.
My project is now to bring that to gether how the olds roll out 1970 to Germany. So i buy in Frankfurt last week an Olds 350 from 1972 with the 7 Heads and 24 cc dish pistons.
This 350.Engine i want to rebuild. My Target is an Olds with an CR Rate abbout low 10,xx. The Original was 10.25 or?
I have also another Olds 350 Block and 7 heads here in my Flat. I buy this Block and the heads very cheap from an Ebay User. He want to make a desk outside .-)
I had a lot of question and hope your Communtiy help me. I was 5 x Times in the Staates ( NY, 3x Florida ) and last October/November for 33 Days in Miami and Texas. I´m a big Basketballfan and BB-junior Coach here in Germany and want so see Dirk´s last (21th) Season in Dallas.
Also i visit the Summitracing store in Arrlington. Wow so Big and and a lot of good Stuff :-)
Here my facts for the projekt:
2x 350 Olds Small Block Number 395558-2
4x Heads Number 7 at Home
The Olds 403 have a Melling HV Oilpump. I want to intall that on the 350.
also the 7 qt Oilpan and the Pertronix Ingnition System.
A verry new 1406 Edelbrock carb
7111 Intake was intalled on the Olds 350
4-1 Headers (Nice Sound )
Is a CR Rate in the Low 10,xx makebale with
-Speedpro Pistons LF 2320
-New Intakes
-A middle Comp cam with a rough Idle :-) or you have a better idea? witch one is the best for a middle rough cam?
-Good bearing for the Piston Rods and Crankshaft Clevite ore others..
- TH 350 Trans - I want to overhaul hat wenn the engine is out.
I also have the yellow Book How to build an performace Oldsmobile Engine. Good Stuff.
How many HP can i have with this adjustments? My Target is 300-350 Horespower.
I now that the standard olds 403 is a slow Dog. CR Rate 8;1... :-( I buy the Desk-Olds 350 only for the 7 heads to intall they on the 403 but hats a little bit to hot.... I read from many people that they have problems. Heat, Termic, Engine is damanged after low 0000 miles...
Now i want to rebuild the 350.
I Hope you have a lot of good ideas! I have also a problem with Rust/Water leak Problem on my viinyl top/trunk - but hats a new post later..
Sorry for my bad English. I give my best that you unterstand me what i want to do :-)
Welcome! Your English is very good and I understood all that you said.
First, the 403 is not a bad engine at all, it just has very low compression ratio (8:1) and poor flowing heads.
Unfortunately, the Supreme body style with vinyl top is prone to trapping water in those areas and rusting out the metal below the vinyl. I also had a 1970 Supreme when I was younger and it had similar rust. To fix mine I removed the vinyl top, cut out the rusted metal, and welded new metal in.
Markus, welcome. You're going to get multiple suggestions in different directions. Rest assured, we can spend ALL your Duetche marks or Euro's.
You can build a 350 to 1968 to 1970 W-31 specs for 350 Horsepower. I would build the 350. I see you have an Edelbrock manifold, that will be nice to use. Start by making a list (spreadsheet) with engine components, chassis and bodywork sections.
we have here on the gas Stations super fuel with 95; 98 ore Racing fuel with 102 octane.
The Speed is normaly bethwenn 40-60mls per Hour. We can also Drive legal 300 km/h on the Germán Autobahn (in US interstate) but that s Not my Plan with my old olds. Lazy and Chill driving with my olds with a good Sound and litte Tire Fire...
Markus
Last edited by DallasMavs#41; February 22nd, 2019 at 11:05 PM.
I would consider the DSS or Mahle pistons over the Speedpro pistons. The Mahle pistons have a much more modern 1mm ring pack and are much lighter. Their 10cc dish gives around 9.5 to 1 compression. Unless go a lot bigger on torque converter stall and much deeper gearing, don't go with 10+ to 1 compression and a big cam. Factory it will probably have 2.56 or 2.78 gears, good for cruising, not for high performance. I would go with a torque converter like this. https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.jegs.com/i/JEGS/555/60402/10002/-1&ved=2ahUKEwi-pI33jtLgAhUJ7awKHWYOC1UQFjABegQIBhAB&usg=AOvVaw1YC 9vgDg4KVBd1QM2yqcPN
The stock converter stalls at 1600 rpm, it sucks for launch. Talk to Cutlassefi about those Mahle pistons and cam for your idea how you want the car to drive.
Last edited by olds 307 and 403; February 23rd, 2019 at 07:00 AM.
I would consider the DSS or Mahle pistons over the Speedpro pistons. The Mahle pistons have a much more modern 1mm ring pack and are much lighter. Their 10cc dish gives around 9.5 to 1 compression. Unless go a lot bigger on torque converter stall and much deeper gearing, don't go with 10+ to 1 compression and a big cam.
X2. A 9.5:1 or so compression ratio should be your target. Pump gas (98) will work fine with it. The Mahle piston is the most modern design available for an Olds.
From there a cam in the low to mid 220@.050 range will drive well but give you the performance and sound you’re looking for.
Hope this helps.
thanks for your info. I read here often from the mahle pistons, a German Company :-)
can you give me please more Infos over that Pistons. I only find Chevy mahle Pistons. Are the speedpro Pistons Not so good? Why?
How many horsepower can we got out of a 350 9;5:1 Engine? Have you Details?
When i Now invest more than 5.000 Euros in that Engine it Must be a Great Engine for the next years.... Now i have with the 403 Arround 180 hp...��
greats to my favorite state florida :-) A lot of nice places Cocoa Beach Orlando Tampa and ft Ld and the Keys ����
sorry for my absence. Today was my Dad by the Engine Mechanic. The good news are the Crank looks very good. The must be only polish. The Block is middle and we wand to bore that 0.030 over. The 7 Head Valve seats must also drilled a litle bit but looks also ok.
Have you any idea why the 7 Heads have no 64 cc more 69-70cc. Is measure up that with a medical syringe. Thats a very important detail for my cr calculation. when i used the speed pro flat top pistons l230f30 with a deck clearence with 0.025 and a head gasket from 0.040-0.050 i had a cr rate from 9.77 to 9.55-1. I find thats ok and we are under the 10.1 mark. I want to use moly rings from speed pro. I can also tank here at the gas station the standard fuel with 95 and 98 oct. On a nother bp Gas station we have Fuel Ultimate with 102 oct.
The Bearings will be form Clevite for the Main and the Rods. Ms805p and cb684p. also new camshaft bearing and an mild x268 cam from comp. Was a x274 cam also ok or not more so good for that modification?
The bolts are all form ARP. The Head bolst was the Pro Version. eb 7111 intake and a eb 1406 carb.
I think thats are all good parts for a good Engine Overhaul in the lower 10.1 CR Rate. Have You any other ideas?
One of my big question is why have the 7 heads 69cc and not the 64cc.all over in the internet i found that infomation with the 64cc. I Hope you can give me more infos...
One of my big question is why have the 7 heads 69cc and not the 64cc.all over in the internet i found that infomation with the 64cc.
Don't believe everything you read on the internet.
Seriously, it was explained to me that during manufacturing it would take more passes to plane the heads and achieve 64cc whereas the 68-69cc value was "within production tolerances" and since the workers got paid (or a bonus) for the number of parts they produced per day, hitting 68-69cc allowed them to process more parts and get more pay.
Last edited by Fun71; March 12th, 2019 at 05:30 PM.
That is quite high compression with a fairly large quench distance. I had 9.6 to 1 with the same quench with a 204/214 cam. It pinged on 91 octane, so go with more cam duration. Also the late 70's Qjet needed completeIy retuned, ran horrible. I currently have 9 to 1 compression with better quench, a 214/214 cam Olds 350, 2300 stall converter and stock 2.78 gears it was fun drive, I can run regular 87 fuel no problem.
thank you for your Post. I unterstand thats better to give with These speedpro Pistons with the bore from 4.087 a Little Bit more free Play with 0.004 clearence in total 4.091. is that correct ?
With the cam i Hear from you its better to use a soft cam also the Comp cam 268h?other Ideas?
thanks for your info. I read here often from the mahle pistons, a German Company :-)
can you give me please more Infos over that Pistons. I only find Chevy mahle Pistons. Are the speedpro Pistons Not so good? Why?
How many horsepower can we got out of a 350 9;5:1 Engine? Have you Details?
When i Now invest more than 5.000 Euros in that Engine it Must be a Great Engine for the next years.... Now i have with the 403 Arround 180 hp...��
greats to my favorite state florida :-) A lot of nice places Cocoa Beach Orlando Tampa and ft Ld and the Keys ����
They're 10cc valve relief but they’re taller than the Speed Pros. With the right parts you can approach 400hp on your pump 98 gas.
It depends for the cam on the torque converter, rear gears used and what octane you want to run on a regular basis. I say 215 to 220 duration with that compression but you need a higher stall, especially if you are not changing the gears, which might be as low as 2.56.
If you want to find your waterleaks. Jump in the trunk of the car with a flash light and have someone you trust close it and use a garden hose ., hose down the back of the car and see where the water is coming in from. You may be able to stop it from the inside with some seam sealer or put a very thin film of clear 3M seam sealer squeezed into the corners of the bottom of the vinyl top to divert the water. It could be coming from the trunk seal. I had that issue on my 72 cutlass S. Good luck with the 350 seems like you have some good suggestions from members already.
thank you for the info. We Know the Procedere. We Try that last year but we Not Open the complete back Windows Vinyl top.my Tip: Its Rust under the Vinyl corner. Now actualy we are Planing the Engine overhaul. Next Step is the waterleak but i came back to the Forum with my Problem. Have a Great week and Greats from Germany :-)
Markus
You can squeeze clear seam sealer into the crack between the vinyl top and metal to divert the water away from the opening. We had a 66 chevelle in our shop that jad the same issue and the customer did not want to remove the vinyl top so we had to try to get the water to run away from the opening. If the seam between the vinyl top and quarter panel is seal water cannot go underneath .
last friday was christmax for me. The Summitracing parcel is come to me:-) Wait Time abbout 6 weeks is over.
Now my dad and iam have a fee questions:
I had order the Speed-Pro Forged Pistons L-2320F-30 with a Compcam xe268h-KIT and Celvite Rod Main and Cam Bearings.
A member here give me a Info thats better to bore the core a little bit bigger than 4.087 - Its better for the over/heating problem. What is the best clearance ? 4.088 oder 4.089? Any ideas?
What is a good head gasket for this engine. In an complete Engine Gasket set for $40 was the Fel-Pro Head Gaskets SFL8171PT1. Its ok but i think a complett metal gasket also a Cometic ore else was better. What do you think? The old one form 1971 was a metal gasket
Thank you and have all a great Sunday and a good start in the new week.
Freut mich, dass es hier ein paar EU Olds Fans gibt. Hilfe bin ich leider noch keine, warte noch auf meinen ersten Olds, dass er in Bremerhaven ankommt.
last friday was christmax for me. The Summitracing parcel is come to me:-) Wait Time abbout 6 weeks is over.
Now my dad and iam have a fee questions:
I had order the Speed-Pro Forged Pistons L-2320F-30 with a Compcam xe268h-KIT and Celvite Rod Main and Cam Bearings.
A member here give me a Info thats better to bore the core a little bit bigger than 4.087 - Its better for the over/heating problem. What is the best clearance ? 4.088 oder 4.089? Any ideas?
What is a good head gasket for this engine. In an complete Engine Gasket set for $40 was the Fel-Pro Head Gaskets SFL8171PT1. Its ok but i think a complett metal gasket also a Cometic ore else was better. What do you think? The old one form 1971 was a metal gasket
Thank you and have all a great Sunday and a good start in the new week.
Regards
Markus
You need to mic the piston and add .004-.0045 from there.
With that piston I’d leave the deck height as it is so just use the 8171.
Make sure you use ARP's lube or at least oil on the threads. 80 ft/lbs for the head bolts, 42 ft/lbs for the rod bolts and 80 ft/lbs for mains 1 through 4 and 120 ft/lbs for #5.
After a lot of weeks with other Projects now my Motor is back from the Engine Garage.
I have now 2 Questions:
I have a Comp cam paket Xe268h. The included valve springs are Bigger than the Original from a 350 from 1971. have you any idea witch are the right one. Typ manufacture ...?
The other question is about the timing settings for the cam. I have 3 Option with the cam. First the oem than 4 degres bevor and After. I want a normal hp Motor, not to aggressive. I mean the oem is the best or you think others?
The other question is about the timing settings for the cam. I have 3 Option with the cam.
Markus
With all due respect, this has been discussed about 4000 times on here. At this point to just arbitrarily pick a setting and go from there makes no sense. I just don’t get it, sorry.
Well. The springs first; those need Comp Cam 740-16 retainers and 611-16 10 degree locks for installation. Hope you got them too and not just springs.. Plus original style umbrella-seal wont fit inside the inner spring, you need to machine the guides for positive valve seals ( 503-16 for example), with its own tool which costs around 100€..
And just install the cam as it was designed; what the cam-card calls. And theres the catch; measure it. When i installed everything to zero-mark, something was off as far as 6 degrees.
So to get it installed to actual zero per cam-card, i had to actually install it 6 deg advanced going by markings on the timing chain wheel. Or then just slap it off to zero-marks and call it a day.
After a valve job and new valves, i measured .543" between retainer plate bottom and valve seal assuming they all got seated all the way. Limits cams if you want to run with atleast .060" clearance. I did cut some more just in case i have to/ want to run different cam with higher lift, so i dont need to lift heads just to drill them.
thank you for all tips here to read and talk. Now i need your help and Tips another time!
on saturday i test and start my engine the first time. The sounds like good. We have also a overhaul th 350 trans with a hughes performance stall converter for oldsmobile with 2200 stall. Today i want to run the engine outside of the garage for 20-30 min with low difference rpm.
no drive only run the engine.
We check saturday the th 350 with oil and check all gears on my lift. one probleme we see that the rear gear doenst drive back the wells. Dam. :-((((
biggest problem today was now the, olds turn only up to 2500-3000 and than came the sound that nobody wants to hear. Kling and engine still stand on the other millisecond. :-(((((
Fuxx... but whats going wrong? The Stall Converter was over 100-130 degree celcuis hot after 5-7 min run, we also can turn manully the engine on the ballancer bolt later. it sounds more like a problem that the th 350 blocked the motor.do you have any idea why the motor couldn't turn higher? can the transmission block the engine in this way? The converter itself only turns and cannot block, can it?
Please help us with your Experience :-)
THANK YOU and Regards from Bavaria
thank you for all tips here to read and talk. Now i need your help and Tips another time!
on saturday i test and start my engine the first time. The sounds like good. We have also a overhaul th 350 trans with a hughes performance stall converter for oldsmobile with 2200 stall. Today i want to run the engine outside of the garage for 20-30 min with low difference rpm.
no drive only run the engine.
We check saturday the th 350 with oil and check all gears on my lift. one probleme we see that the rear gear doenst drive back the wells. Dam. :-((((
biggest problem today was now the, olds turn only up to 2500-3000 and than came the sound that nobody wants to hear. Kling and engine still stand on the other millisecond. :-(((((
Fuxx... but whats going wrong? The Stall Converter was over 100-130 degree celcuis hot after 5-7 min run, we also can turn manully the engine on the ballancer bolt later. it sounds more like a problem that the th 350 blocked the motor.do you have any idea why the motor couldn't turn higher? can the transmission block the engine in this way? The converter itself only turns and cannot block, can it?
Please help us with your Experience :-)
THANK YOU and Regards from Bavaria
Markus and his Dad
Oil Plan screw. Metal on the Magnet. I Hope the Problem is the Trans 350 Not the Engine
Yes we hope. I think there is more Metal on the Inside Magnet of the oil pan. But today we have no Time more is Holiday in Germany and now eve.
We will See more the next days...
Next Step is demove the Converter and Test the einginge without the Trans. Then they Must have more rpm than 2500 Max 28/9
its feel like the einginge works against the Trans that would be explain the very hot new Stall Converter from Hughes.
the Trans was overhaul from a Trans mechanic in Bavaria. They normaly know what they do.... but likley not here....
dsg Trans normaly zf Trans and th Trans no Problem for him.
the error was the s spring here. The was not correct installed. That explain everthing.
The good news: i have found an Trans here in the near for 350 Euro. Well pick it up tomorrow.
And we can rotate the engine by hand without sparkplugs. Its feel like the same than bevor with no palable Difficulties.
Greats from Bavaria
markus
Hello Forum Members
now we know what was the Problem...
Look Here. But the Good News is i have now 2 overhaul new 350 Trans and from a 3rd the Test of the Parts. 3 make 2 :-)
greats from Germany
markus
Last edited by DallasMavs#41; July 3rd, 2020 at 10:49 AM.
February 22nd, 2019, 12:19 PM
I agree, I hope your mishap was in the trans rather than your newly-built engine. 
