rounding the back side of the guide like yours, creates yet another flow path in my opinion.

Think of it as an extra lane of traffic you created that is headed straight for the guide.
Yes, you made more room, but it's lane just gets cut off and has to try and re-merge with the faster moving traffic anyway.

I like to steer the air as straight as possible, (much like my car) because air (and my car) is heavy and not good at switching directions.

 

I am no expert, Lars. Just giving a thought.

If you want in on our G head research, find a pair and do what you do.

Dave & I are both doing our own set of G heads right now. I would like to flow all 4 to see what worked best.

But even then.......flow numbers are just that ......roughed numbers. Same with a dyno. The best measurement is with time slips.


It's sad that we have to re-invent the wheel. Someone has already done all of this work and research back in the 60's 70's 80's and 90's
but there weren't awesome digital cameras and video recorders in everyone's pocket phone to document it all either.

Hell, even R.o.p's info got deleted, and many newcomers to the hobby that want to learn this stuff like Ulysses does, have to start from scratch, and/or find someone willing and patient enough to share their knowledge. That doesn't happen as often as one would hope, so Oldsmobile history and ignorance thereof, is constantly repeating itself.

 

It's those little details that aren't in the books sometimes. Like where to port it showed me how in the mondello book but jermey showed me what was what when I got those #8 heads from him a while back. Also I planned on running the #8 valves but they showed me I couldn't ,and best of all where I can find the info for all that. I didn't know that stuff. You gotta give me enough rope to hang my self but enough slack to be on my tip toes to pull my self up. It seems stupid but that's the best way I learn. Even in the btr book travato states "I can write complete books on these individual sections in the book". So stuff gets left out and that's where info like this comes in handy.

 

its all good, lets agree to disagree

 

We should disagree, that's how bigger and better things get created. If we all agreed that a stock 455 engine was already the best engine in the world and there would never be any need for improvement, this thread wouldn't even exist.

If you noticed in the pics, I do round over the guides on the exhausts like you do. Exhaust gas comes out much more forcefully than an intake charge gets pulled in, so I figured I should clear the way as much as possible for the explosion. That charge is ever expanding, unlike the intake/fuel droplets.

I'm also not into the squeaky clean shiny look on intake ports. To me, I don't see how that will benefit anything other than perceived value. My goal is to leave it a little rough so it busts up as much liquid as possible without being a restriction.

 

my opinion is;

the 90 degree shelfs on each side of your guide is causing more turbulence near the valve stem. there is enough turbalance when the air flow parts around the stem/guide and reconnects. And all the teardrop work I've seen "on the internet" looks like mine, I've also seen first hand work from some top racers. BUT I have no real proof, I just copy what they have done and its my opinon.

 

I attempted to make a video (my first time) of the dead spots in the exhaust ports. where ever you see caked up crap is more than likely a low velocity area, and might as well be filled with weld in my opinion. Hopefully this will help you with your "exhaust clip" modification. This head's center divider was built up 1/4" on each side, and it's still slow going over there (in spots) as far as flow velocity goes in my opinion.

I realize, if you don't know what to look for, my vid just looks like some doofus banging a trouble light around. I apologize for my horrible camera work.



We have full out race guys on this site, but they seem to keep pretty quiet.

 

Notice the roof is raised, and the flow keeps a straight shot along the port roof. The corners and sides seem pretty useless towards the exit of the port. All the action is on the roof. It is tempting to port those spots on the sides because they are "right there" and easy to get to, but I think it's a waste. The pushrod pinch point and on into the bowl is more important.

 

You need dave's pointer for the next vid. Lol.

 

Hey Copper, I'm a fan of the youth on budget. My 2 boys are not interested in cars other than a means of transportation. Not that I am ready to adopt you but certainly willing to help the cause. I am just finishing up my new top end and have lots of engine parts I would be happy to "part with" at silly prices.
C heads, intake, stage 3 Qjet, New Lunati cam, lifters etc. let me know ....

 

Pm me price on cam and lifters and specs , looking for an rpm intake for an sbo

 

Fridge is restocked, tunes are cranked, garage is almost up to temp, full belly - time to give the compressor a work out. I was thinkin' about starting a new thread about home porting techniques, but now I'm thinkin' that would be a **** storm. I'll post up my progress in a couple hours.

 

Dave don't rush it . Id like to be involved in the assembly process. Then maybe I'll port my own set of heads and do em start to finish. I got those #8's still .Not this next weekend but weekend after next I should be able to swing by.

 

copper, sorry the P/M got lost the cam # Lunati 10420702 brand new + Hyd lifters & timing chain set

 

The problem with this, IMO, is that you are stating what you "think" will/should work, while disagreeing with a guy that actuually races and KNOWS what works. Again IMO, without data and back-to-back comparisons, it is just a guess without any real evidence to back it up. Welcome to the internet............

 

It was a friendly ribbing we were giving each other, if even that. Lars and I have no beef whatsoever. In fact I was encouraging him to jump on board with our porting session and have some fun and a coffee or beer with us I was excited that he chimed in in fact.. His opinion is respected. As will anyone else's who gets their hands dirty turning chicken $h1+ into chicken salad.

I have no shame about my educated "guess" and neither should anyone else actually trying to use their brain with this stuff. I am not too stubborn to admit I'm wrong when facts are presented.

 

"J" man your wrong. Think about it. The valves are closed when the fuel air charge ignites. If your rings are sealing good the spent exhaust gasses are being dispelled at about the same rate the fuel air charge is being sucked in. It's just happening on a different stroke.
Don't worry about it, I'm not rushing anything. Just bring your body tools for my roof, I've got these heads covered. Pictures to come. Back to porting. Resume your conversation.

 

Yeah probably. Until you have 10 flow comparisons, 10 dyno sheets, and 10 track proven race builds You will just get your ***** busted.

Throw an ice pack in the freezer for your sack & do it anyway.

 

I understand what you mean. If it fired when the exhaust valve was open that would be a total waste of good energy.

 

You got it dave. I'll bring my tools and I'll get that roof squared away for ya. Btw dave I didn't mean rush as in mess em up I meant it as don't use up all your free time on it. Don't want ya to think im thinking you are half assing it.

 

So with all this about porting the heads I know the basics about grinding the ports down some more to give it a bowl shape but how are you sure you arnt screwing up besides trial and error

 

There are certain spots that are noted in cerntain olds literature that mention the spots to look for where there are water jackets.

 

Porting is a science. I think you could screw it up pretty easily. I just spent about five hours grinding. My snots are black. I can gaurantee I've had my FDA daily requirement of iron intake, but I love it. No one to bother me, makin' noise, problem is I was so busy porting, I only drank a six pack. I wish the photos were better.
117-1781_IMG.jpg
117-1782_IMG.jpg
117-1783_IMG.jpg
117-1784_IMG.jpg
117-1785_IMG.jpg
117-1786_IMG.jpg
117-1787_IMG.jpg
117-1788_IMG.jpg
117-1789_IMG.jpg
117-1795_IMG.jpg

 

118-1801_IMG.jpg
118-1802_IMG.jpg
I ordered a set of performance intake gaskets last night, wait 'til you see the roof go up. Look forward to match porting the intake. Aluminum comes off a lot faster. I will do the intake bowls and chambers on the other head, then raise the roof after I get the gaskets, then I will start on the exhaust. I need to find the guy that custom made the clips to braze in the center ports so we don't have to weld these up. Copper I will let you do the valve job. You will like that. It's time consuming but you will learn a lot.

 

i'm that guy, and i wish i could come over and play i'll get some clips ready, j pm me your address.

 

Dave they look freaking amazing !

 

The fun has just begun. I started a porting thread in the racing section. Feel free to chime in all you knuckle heads.

 

Great thread guys and it's good to see different ways of thinking/looking at air flow.
Copper good luck with your build looks like a fun build.

 

Copper I worked on your heads most of the day today. I am done with all of the chambers and 5/8 of the intake bowls. I'm waiting for the other intae gasket to show up before I raise the roof. I remove the roof bump on all 4 intake ports of the first head. I set the intae gaset on your manifold and was very dissapointed-
118-1837_IMG.jpg
These ports are wacked, and I can't fix them. In order to do it right I would have to port way up into the runners to open them up the same as the heads. There is too sharp of angles to get any type of bit up into there. I hate to say this, but I think you should look for a different intake. Fortunately these performers resell for a good buck. I think you should look for a Holley street dominator or better yet, a Victor. You have the cowl hood so clearance will not be an issue.

 

Yeah I'll keep an eye out for an rpm or a holley intake. U can keep the performer. Sell it keep the cash. I think the victor might be overkill for my build lol. Although I'm gonna go ahead and say I'll run 10 to 1 and get a custom cam.

 

Man that is a nice offer about your manifold, but you need the money for the new manifold. I really prefer the Holley, so don't look too hard for the Edelbrock. The Street Dominator is a single plain vs a dual plain & much easier to port. I think the performer would be a better choice for low end torque mostly street use, but the Holley was made for higher RPM strip type use. I had a nice one that I sold for $100. The plenum was already opened up. The Victor is not over kill for your build. Best SB manifold for drag racing available. Trust me you would be very happy but they are not cheap. Hard to find a used one. I call dibbs on the one I sold Jeromy, but we could do some testing on your engine with it before I hog it out for the big block heads I'm gonna use. Man I feel guilty about not being out in the garage porting, but it's too damn cold. Hope you guys can come back up soon. Sorry we didn't get more done.

 

It's all good. Currently up in the dells. I had a holley last year but sold it. There is a swap meet in feb. By me. Seriously no love loss on that manifold I traded an exhaust I wasn't gonna use from a car I parted out for it. It's yours I'll try to find one. Usually in the 150 to 12 range. Once I get home I'll hit ebay.

 

Here you go.

http://evansville.craigslist.org/pts/4175137569.html

 

I'll have to see about it Monday. I'm weird about craigslist . Although I do have mon. And tue. Off so I got something to do now.

Edit: that's way south lol but I will call and see about shipping lol.

 

Alright so I haven't done much with the holidays coming up I gotta save as much as I can and not spend money I don't know if I'll need yet. I cleaned the pistons and gathered all my parts. I don't need much in the parts dept. maybe 500 with cam which im going custom from howards cams. It might be a month or so before I can gain momentum on this project . My ultimate goal is to have it done by late feb. as march approaches I need to do the finishing touches to get my car to the track in april. and my focus will go towards that along with play money lol. here are some pics nothing exciting but I had to do something to keep me from bouncing off the walls. I do have the performer intake on ebay with a bid on it and I did source a holley street dominator intake on the site im gonna buy once the performer is sold.

 

Those pistons look real nice. Before you buy any intake manifold talk to me. I have some information that will be important to consider, and we need to make a decision about how high to raise the roof on the intake port. I made a lot of progress on your heads tonight. I know you will be impressed when you see them on Sunday. Have you talked to the "J" man? Is he coming up with you?

 

I'll ask him tomorrow morning (sat) . I haven't bought nothing lol.

 

Well its been a week almost since I last updated. last week I went by daves and did a little work on the Roof of his 67. Got some metal work done before filler. I helped him do the pour on the cyl. heads. I definitely got involved this time around and had a blast. Im getting ready to order parts . Looks like im in for 416 on parts. I decided to no run the strapped block . Our reason is that the sbo is sufficiently strong for the power levels it will achieve with out hurting anything. Which will save money. Im looking at 175 for balancing the whole deal and 55 to r&r the cam bearings. Since the block was already bored to match the pistons I have., all I need is a nice hone to achieve a cross hatch for the new rings. Im still looking for an intake but that can wait. Still gotta get rid of the performer to cover that cost. This will be a "max effort" N/A pump gas street small block on what the dime will allow .


Here is what im thinking for cam and the price You just cant beat it. Im currently running a howards Im very happy with their product so Im no longer loyal to comp lol.






http://www.summitracing.com/parts/hr...1-10/overview/




Guys keep an eye out for some Harland sharps or any other brand roller rockers that will work for olds. I figured since I haven't spent much I can spend a little lol. Cant do roller tips on this build.

 

hey eddie grippo here about that rear end your looking for . ihave a 1976 chevelle with 8.5 posi.not sure
what gears prob 308

 

I think that was on the first page and a different member. You might wanna contact who ever was looking for that rear. I don't remember if I was looking for one but I got a gear set for my dads car. Current set up is all set up.