gpitt1960

Forum Members,

I am searching for members who may have experience recommending the correct Header for my 1977 Cutlass with the original 350 Olds engine. The engine is bone stock and original. I just want the engine to breath better and get rid or more exhaust heat. I will be adding duals with NO converters!!!

Are Shorties or Mids better than long. Space requirements !!
This car is all original down to the Dealer badge on the rear Trunk deck. I don't need chrome, but I do want a high quality Header, Ceramic ??

Forum members with experience on the 73/77 model upgrade to Headers needed.

Thank you in Advance!!

Greg in Tuscumbia, Alabama
tvss1960@gmail.com

olds 307 and 403

Ceramic are a very good idea. Realize that occasional bolt tightening is necessary with headers. Sanderson and Hedman both make nice shorty headers but will need custom down pipes. Some of the full length might hang low. I am sure 76Olds will chime in, he has Hedman shorties on his 76.

brownbomber77

I HIGHLY suggest...if you're gonna run a ceramic header, just get the cheap Speedmaster ones off eBay, THEN fit them to your car, dent them where necessary (Probably have to clear the starter), THEN ship them to Performance Coatings in Jonesboro, GA or whichever ceramic place of your choice. I got their name off a Grand National forum and figured if they're good enough for the turbo guys, long tubes should be no problem. With that said, I have yet to have a header fit my '77 "perfectly". Something always has to be cleared.

brownbomber77

Oh, long tubes are $265 to have coated. They sandblast, coat, and cure so all you have to do is bolt them up. I've had their coating on my Avalanche long tubes and y-pipe for 15,000 miles. No chips and the coating holds up to wrenches and most other light scraping

olds 307 and 403

The Sanderson and Hedman shorties need no clearancing. I know you can run the stock starter as well.

brownbomber77

Not trying to pick a fight....but if you're gonna spend money on shorties...you may as well just run manifolds....

olds 307 and 403

I disagree. Tests on other makes show 20 hp and 20 ft/lbs of torque gains with shorties. Full length were not quite a 10 hp gain. The dyno test was a 300 hp Dodge Magnum crate motor, starting with truck/van manifolds. Very restrictive to fit in the van's engine bay, I had to swap out the car manifold on one side, too wide.

oldcutlass

This has always been my view.

joe_padavano

So on the basis of one test on one specific motor with one specific set of manifolds...

Not exactly a statistically valid sample size.

I'm in the camp of why bother with shorty headers. Use real headers or don't waste your time.

olds 307 and 403

I disagree. Shorty headers fit so easy, even with the motor in car and ARE worth power over manifolds.

76olds

SV100134.JPG

Here is a pic of my 76 with headman Short Ceramic headers. Install was very smooth, no dings or dents needed.
You can run them with an OEM starter with no issues.
I choose to install a powermaster 9610 mini starter just for something to do.
I don't know how much HP gain they produce so I can't comment on the above.
I did rear gears, headers,and 2 1/4 duals all at once, so I noticed a huge seat of the pants difference.
Most of which came from the 2:41 rear gear down to 3:42 gear in sure.
I just put the headers in for the LOOK not so much for the HP gain.
I used Remflex graphite gaskets, gave them a good tighten after the first heat cycle and haven't touched them since.

I hope this helps,
Eric

442fanatic

Had Hedmen ceramic coated full lengths on my car before the engine swap. The cermaic flaked off passenger side after a couple years, could be due to the oil filter is right above on passenger side... They hang low, flat spotted them going over a parking lot hump once... They do not funnel the heat away that well... The passenger side had to be laid in before we dropped the motor in due to the heater core/ac thing in the firewall. I used a copper full length exhaust gasket, still required some odd tightening..

After I went to the 455 I went with a set of Thorton MFG cast reproduced exhaust manifolds. No complaints. They do make them for the olds 350s now. Both are advertised to be based of a higher flowing factory option.
Dualed with 2.5" pipes.

olds 307 and 403

My Flowtech full length headers needed double gaskets to seal against the block, never buy headers with too thin of flanges. Mine also peeled where the oil filter drained on them. Only a small diameter, short oil filter would fit. Then a year later pin holes everywhere through the Ceramic. Buy a good set with thick flanges. Copper, aluminium or something like the Remflex gaskets is a good idea. I found the copper and aluminum collector gaskets worked very well, Ultraseals blew out eventually. The Felpro green engine to header gaskets hold up very well, even after a few pull aparts. I tried Copper there and they leaked. You just heard how the Hedman's hanged low, have read the same thing about Hooker headers.

GoolzCutlass

I just put a set of these hedmans on and driving a week now no problems. Went on fairly easy.

Hedman 58160 Painted Hedder

76olds

Sounds good to me, how about posting a few pictures on how low they hang since another member here didn't have much luck with his long tube header.
Pictures would be appreciated for all other 76-77 owners here considering installing them.
Thanks
Eric

redoldsman

I have set of Sanderson shorties. If anybody is interested send me a PM.

SilverLady80

Did you have to install a new dipstick or remove it and reinstall after headers were on?

joe_padavano

Yes. Pick one. I've found that the best way to remove the tube with minimum damage is to use a bolt that just fits into the end of the tube, clamp it with a vice grip, and use a slide hammer to get it out. I've made a little tool that has the correct diameter bolt on one end (I want to say it's 5/16, but don't quote me) and a 1/4-20 bolt on the other end to fit my slide hammer, welded head-to-head.

gpitt1960

Well, Thanks for all the feedback. I purchased the Thornton Cast manifolds patterned after the High Performance BBO from 69-70 but for the SBO. The footprint is almost identical to the original manifolds but the flow volume is much larger. Another forum I subscribe to had a member contact me about a dyno test with Headman long tube, Shorties vs the Thornton cast HP manifolds. The Headman's beat all others but the difference was +2 HP vs the Thornton Cast manifolds and much less heat in the Engine compartment also.

Thanks again for the feedback to this post!!

gpitt1960

joe_padavano

It would be interesting to see that test. I find it hard to believe that the manifolds are that close to real headers. Given that those manifolds aren't appreciably larger than the stock ones, I remain skeptical of the "much larger" flow volume without numbers.