A72CUTLAS

Now for my first question...

So far I've found three brands of exhaust headers that fit my Cutty; Hooker, Hedmans, and Patriot. I can tell by the price that Hookers are probably the best, but what about the other 2? I've recently read that there are no fitment problems with the S model, just with the notch-back Supremes. Is this the case?

I've also just learned that Flowmaster mufflers don't flow, they s**k. So what muffler do you suggest? I like the Flowmaster sound but I want it to not suffocate my engine.
TIA for all your replies and suggestions.

2blu442

I don't know enough to have an opinion on the brand of headers, but there have been a couple posts that explain the Cutlass S and Supreme both use the same headers. Somewhere along the way there was some bad data so you might get told they won't fit the Supreme. The 4 speed application can be a problem though, so as long as you've got an automatic you should be fine. John

A72CUTLAS

Thanks 2blu442 for the info. Mine is an automatic on the column, seems like thats a consideration too.
BTW, that is a very impressive list of Olds iron you've got there! And 5 442's!! When I'm done with mine I'm getting a tag that says "442 wannabe"!

wmachine

Dynomax. Ultra Flow in particular. Good flow, good performance, good sound.

2blu442

Be sure you read to the bottom of my list, only the tow vehicle is done! I played with Oldsmobiles for a lot of years before I could afford a 442, then that one sat in my buddy's garage for 3 years before I got it drivable. My hobby really took off 8 years ago when a job transfer brought a better paycheck with it, and I've been collecting cars and parts whenever I come across something interesting. It is a fun hobby but at some point I'll either need to downsize the collection and focus on restoring one or two or get a place in the country where I can tinker throughout my retirement years!!!

citcapp

Johns list could be longer if he counted all of the parts cars he buys and sells to get parts and he has an engine collection to die for.

A72CUTLAS

Dynomax Ultraflows... I need to check those out. Thanks

joe_padavano

No, it is not the case, but unfortunately this urban myth won't die. The Supreme is identical to any other Cutlass of the same year from the firewall forward. All headers that fit Cutlii also fit the same year Supremes.

Sorry for the rant.

To get back to your original question, any brand of header for an Olds will likely require you to relocate the brake distribution block or proportioning valve that's bolted to the frame rail. The starter will be a tight fit with the header in place. Some brands of headers do not clear the shift linkage for the column shifter, though you can usually modify the rod (read: bend it) to clear. You will need to temporarily remove the oil filter adapter during installation. You will need to alternately remove the motor mount bolt and lift each side of the motor. If you feel up to it, removal of the steering shaft will significantly simplify installation of the LH header.

A72CUTLAS

This isn't fair! Ford and Chebby guys can just bolt up a pair of headers in a few hours while we with the best cars have to tear the motor down for the same result. How did this happen? You can just about trade part for part between Olds and Chebby, they're both A-bodies, so why the diff RE: headers?

joe_padavano

I doubt that header installation in an A-body Chevy is any less of a chore than it is on an Olds.

Oldsguy

Ah come on now, you didn't mean that did you? Engine shape and size is completely different between them and us, even if the frame rail to frame rail and firewall to radiator support dimensions are similar (which I don't know that for sure). I do agree with you that our brand is much, much better.

A72CUTLAS

OK. I admit that was an over-/mis-statement, but it was out of frustration that everywhere I look(Summit, Jegs, etc...) 75% of the products are Ford/Chevy and I have to look very close to find Olds stuff. I know that there are more of them than us, but show us some love, would ya'?

I mean, up until just recently I was unaware of any Olds-related sites other than 442.com, which is good for looking at pics of finished restos, but I never got any helpful info there. But then came CO and the "veil was lifted".

wmachine

Of course! That's why we're into Oldsmobiles Anybody can have one of *them*!!! Get out your reading glasses and join us!

Texascarnut

Yeah, we kinda tend to be friendly that way

A72CUTLAS

Yeah, you guys have been nice and patient with me, so I'll get back to where I started. I am somewhat familiar with the Hookers and Hedmans, but I have no info RE: the Patriots. Does anyone have any experience with this brand?

Also I just found out my neighbor has a Olds 403 in his Firebird running Flo-Tech(?) headers. He is very happy with them but doesn't know if they have a 350 set. How about these? Are they any good?

Wasted

As long as the headers are made for a Olds small block they will fit(If they were made for your year). So if you had a 307 or 403 in your 72 you would buy the same headers you would buy for your 350. If you not worried about price to much you can look into Dick Miller headers. I heard his fit the best but I never tried them so I don't know for sure.

A72CUTLAS

See??? That's what I mean about this site... until finding you guys I was sure that Hooker and Hedman were the only mfg. of headers for Cutty's! I'm gonna google this guy and see what he's working with,

BTW... didn't know the 403 was a SBO. And neither does my neighbor. He tells me all the time he runs a BB engine.

A72CUTLAS

OK Those headers are for someone who is racing for a living or has deep pockets. I don't fit in either catagory.

Wasted

Alot of people get confused with the 403 thinking its a big block. I even had a few people think my 350 was a BB, just because the intakes are so much wider on Olds then Chevys. Then I show them how big the 455 is and they are just .

ent72olds

I used these on my '72 350 th350 Cutlass....excellent fit and function, just don't expect the ceramic"chrome" to hold up too long!

A72CUTLAS

Are these the headers you were referring too?

http://store.summitracing.com/partde...part=WLK-86030

The Dynomax site and Summit Racing says they won't fit the S model Cutlass. Could they be mistaken?

wmachine

Are we crossing wires here?
Dynomax. Ultra Flow in particular. Good flow, good performance, good sound.
Referred to mufflers that were originally asked about.

ent72olds

Yes, like Joe said in an earlier post, the S and Supreme are the same from the firewall forward...they obviously aren't olds experts over there....They fit just fine although with the motor in the car, you may have to persuade them a little. I even had to put a small dent in the area where the floor and cowl meet to get them to slip in, but it was well worth it...

ent72olds

I think his original question was a 2 parter....headers, and flowmasters....

wmachine

Right Eric. But at the risk of confusing this further, you quoted/answered my muffler comment saying you tried them and the "don't expect the ceramic"chrome" to hold up too long!"

ent72olds

Ceramic coated mufflers.... If I did, I thought you were talking about their headers. My bad!

A72CUTLAS

Hey fellas, it's cool. I was aware of both of your ref. to headers and muffs. I checked out the Ultraflo's and like both the Welded and SS models. I think I'm gonna go with the Welded and the Cyclone headers. They should flow perfectly together, being the same brand.

wmachine

Let us know how you make out with that setup!
Eric and I will go back to being confused!

A72CUTLAS

Well.... OK, after all the discussion and input from you guys, I ended up ordering this Flowtech set-up.

Flowtech Full length Headers #11150FLT
Flowtech Afterburner Muffler #50322FLT
Flowmaster Exhaust H-Pipe #15920

I switched for a couple reasons, the main being that this set is less expensive than the other. My neighbor with the Firebird has Flowtechs and says he's happy with them. Now he's only had them for about 6mos so time will tell for both of us, I guess. The other reason is I couldn't find the Dynomax set-up all in one place. All the regular sites had one without the other, so I remembered Northernautoparts.com from when I first bought the Cutty and did the Pertronix points conversion kit.

OK, I'm open for critique... did I just waste money trying to save it, or will this set work? Also, I know that each header comes with gaskets but are there better ones that seal? I appreciate all the info recieved here, you guys rock!!

ent72olds

I don't know much about the Flowtech product, but I don't see why it should be a problem. Might be better than Dynomax....the biggest thing with the gaskets is, not so much the gasket, but how true the flange on the headers are....make sure you ckeck with a metal straight edge. The head being true is pretty important also. I've heard of people sometimes doubling up the gaskets because one or the other isn't true....

A72CUTLAS

Would this be a problem with stock heads that've never been off the car? Just wondering. Also I was looking at the car today(yesterday now) and a couple questions popped up.

1) when installing, do you start at the top or from the bottom?
2) is the paint that the mfg. uses good enough or do I need engine paint?
3) RE: #1... should I just pay a shop to do it due to my newbness?(hey a new word)

mp71conv

I put a set of hookers on my 71 cutlass supreme conv.
it was tight but they fit fine.

Yellowstatue

Put the headers in from the bottom...the higher you can get the car the better...bumper jack height is not high enough... you need room to rotate the parts as you slip them into place.. I built two runways alongside a handy ditch that gave me enough room to do a lot of things under the car...except when it was wet frogman the picture in my avatar shows my 'pit'...

A72CUTLAS

All I have are a set of the old-style steel car ramps(not these new lo-risers) that I thought I could place a couple of 2x6 planks up under to get a bit more space. And being 6'2", 480lbs probably won't be an asset in this instance but hey, what can I do? I'm gonna give it a shot and if I get wedged underneath, I'll just have to pay a shop for the install.

And BTW, thanks Yellowstatue for the answer. You're the man, 'eh. Sorry, couldn't help it.

arodenhiser

What is opinion on the Flowtech headers after they have been on for while? I need something quickly and have very little money left .

Adam

arodenhiser

I am still curious. I chose to go with a set of Hooker Comps, 3901HKR. I got a really great price from Amazon of all places. $142.66 with free 2 day shipping. The price went up after I bought. I don't know if that was a glitch or what, but I am happy.


Adam

507OLDS

I'm glad some of you guys have put the "do not fit supremes" myth to sleep early.
Pretty much all of your headers will require you to move your brake proportioning valve,so it os not rubbing against the header pipe.You can just unbolt it from the frame,and swing it up on top.
If you are getting a set of headers with a black paint on them,you will be lucky if that lasts more than a few days.It's basicly there to prevent rust while they are sitting on the shelf.If you are going to get coated headers,get them coated in & out.Yes,more money,but they will hold up.They are all priced accordingly.I ended up ordering my Hooker headers directly from Jet-Hot.They ordered the headers from Hooker,coated them in & out,then shipped to me.Cost was about $650.00 back in the late 1990's. They still look as good as the day I put them in over 11 years ago.

Lalo442

I used the Flowtech ceramic coated headers from Summit on my 69 and they fit fine , didn't even have to move the brake distribution block the ceramic coating on the Flowtechs will last about 2 years and going some small signs of rust below ... although they do sit low especially since I have Hotchkis 1" lowered springs up front with the 14" wheels ... I have them with a set of Flowmaster 50 series headers sounds great , If my budget would have allowed I would have done what Brian did and go for the more better quality but I think the Flowtech ( owned by Holley ) is a good alternative ... also don't bolt on the drivers side before putting the starter back in place or you won't be able to fit it in between the tubes ....

PS> Brian you haven't answered my email yet.....

arodenhiser

I like seeing the steam rise from Joe P's ears everytime someone asks the Supreme question.
My car now already has a set of headers so no new mods will need to be done. No idea who makes them. They a few dents and dings everywhere. The primaries are cracking/rusted out at the flange. In '99 when I had the engine out I mig welded some cracks in the same spots. I think these have done their time.
Cash flow is really tight right now and I trying to get this car together before moving 1100 miles at Christmas time. Coating will have to wait, or a higher end pair will replace these later.

Adam

jasm8

Hi guys,
I am currently restoring a '71 Cutlass Supreme with my father, and I just read through this thread and found some helpful information regarding the headers "myth" for the Supreme Coupe. I'm going to be running a re-built rocket 350 with a muncie 4-speed & headers, and my question is are there going to be any special difficulties/modifications that will need to be done (aside from the ones listed above) for headers with the manual transmission? Or is it pretty much the same as doing the automatic? Thanks!