plee3 64Olds

Hello to all Oldsmobile gear heads! I have a 350 out of a 68-72 cutlass in my 64 Cutlass. I think the timing chain is destroyed. Distributor will not spin when starting. That symptom seems to be the timing chain. I need a definite answer on how do we align the timing marks on the gears. I read that the cam sprocket should be at 6o'clock and the crank gear should be at 12o'clock while cyl #1 is at top dead center. Is this correct?? I also read that both sprockets should be at 12o'clock on an Olds engine. I'm a little confused. Question #2, How would I know that I'm at top dead center on #1??

Fun71

Either dot alignment method will work; you just need to stab the distributor correctly afterwards. It is easiest to align the dots with the cam gear dot at 6 and crank gear dot at 12.

I will say that it is best to use a degree wheel and "degree the cam" so that you know with 100% certainty that the camshaft is installed correctly. Due to manufacturing tolerances in the cam gear, crank gear, chain, and cam itself simply aligning the dots doesn't ensure proper camshaft installation.

I once installed a cam by aligning the dots and the engine didn't have the low end power that I expected. When I checked things with a degree wheel, I found the cam was 8º retarded.

plee3 64Olds

Ok. I have not removed the distributor at all. It is still in place. Does that help?? Do I need to remove the dizzy??

svnt442

I had something like this happen to me 31 years ago with a 76 Cutlass. The first thing I did was install a new chain and gear set, but that didn't fix the problem. The gear on the distributor was worn so badly that the teeth on the cam weren't engaging them. The teeth on the cam were also sharp, meaning that my cam was bad. Being 18 at the time and broke like an 18 year old, I installed a new distributor and went on my way until the engine developed a rod knock a few months later.
I guess my point is that you might have one heck of a can of worms that you are getting into. Check EVERYTHING.

plee3 64Olds

Humm. that's interesting. Well, I will be pulling the dizzy to make sure everything is tight.

Gpc1

If distributor isn’t turning check for a broken pin on the distributor gear. Inspect both cam gear (with flashlight) and distributor gear for abnormal wear. Also distributor for excessive side play.
have fun

plee3 64Olds

I finally broke down the front of the engine. Yes! timing chain snapped! 2 teeth broke off the crank shaft sprocket. I got a double roller sprocket and chain from Edelbrock. I want to make sure that I got things in order. When I removed the sprockets, I did my best to align them. When I removed the old sprockets, both cam sprocket and crank sprocket are pointing to 12 o'clock and I see that the rotor on the distributor cap is pointing at the #1 cylinder. ( I never removed the distributor during the process) Is it a go to assemble the cam and crank gear sprocket in the same order as I removed them?? (both alignment dots at 12 o'clock)?? Is it safe to say that the engine is at top dead center??

oldcutlass

Its easier to align when the crank is at 12 and cam is at 6 with #1 at tdc (in this position #6 is firing). Once assembled, turn the crank 1 full turn (puts crank at 12 and cam at 12) and install the distributor pointing to #1.

joe_padavano

The crank turns two times for every time the cam turns. If you install the chain with the crank at 12:00 and the cam at 6:00, then turn the crank one full turn, both cam and crank will then be at 12:00. It doesn't matter, but as Eric points out, it is easier to see the alignment if you have the cam gear mark down next to the crank gear.

plee3 64Olds

First off Joe, you have been a Godsend for me and I’m sure a lot of other Olds enthusiasts here on this forum. I thank you for your assistance. Now, I have installed the timing chain with the cam sprocket at 6 and the crank sprocket at 12. Now the position of my rotor on the distributor is pointing at cylinder #6. Now what do I do? Take the dizzy out and align it with cylinder #1? Rotate the engine? I’m almost ready to put things back together but I really want to make sure what do I do next???

plee3 64Olds

I understand aligning the timing marks at 6 and 12. Trying to do both at 12 sucks!!!!

Oldsmaniac

If it was me, yes pull distributer and align rotor to #1 spark plug wire on cap, TDC on balancer, compression stroke.

oldcutlass

With the crank sprocket at 12 and the cam gear at 6 the distributor should be firing on #6, so your good to go. If you turn the crank 1 full turn the crank gear will be at 6, the cam at 12, and the distributor will be pointing to #1.

joe_padavano

Actually, with the gears at 12:00 and 6:00, if you turn the crank one full turn, the gears are then at 12:00 and 12:00.

And while we're on this subject, do NOT forget to put the oil slinger back on the crank! Do not ask my how I know this.

plee3 64Olds

I think that's the way to go. Im not that experienced with timing. Well, Im about to learn today! Ok, how do I find TDC the compression stroke on cylinder #1?? I understand that once TDC is established, I can remove the dizzy and point the rotor to Cyl#1and install back in. Install cap, check wires. Should fire up? Correct??

oldcutlass

Again, your distributor is fine where it is. If you pull it out and change it, you will be 180* out and have to put back. It will start where it is.

Gpc1

Remove #1 spark plug, place thumb over spark plug hole , crank engine until you feel the compression, stop cranking immediately. Turn crankshaft by hand either direction it needs to align timing marks to 0. Then install the distributor with rotor pointing to #1 spark plug wire. That should get it close enough to start, then reset timing using timing light.

plee3 64Olds

Got it! I will refer to #8 and roll from there. I'm about to button things up and try it out.

plee3 64Olds

Wow! it started right up! we gave it a good adjustment on the distributor and it purrs!! No, more of a growl!!! Thank you gentlemen! Its a pleasure to learn form true Oldsmobile enthusiasts. I'm the only odd ball in my circle. They all got Chevys. I do have a pretty good coolant leak coming from the bottom of the water pump. Yeah,over torqued the bottom 2 bolts. They are stripped (stupid me. and I have a torque wrench in my box!!) Only true fix is to weld some nuts on the back. Correct??