johnnyjaws

johnd cant u just fill in the opening with some brazeing rod. If u don't mind how much did this car cost u when u bought it ?

Johnd

JohnyJaws - I paid $8600 for the car and another $600 to get it shipped to MA. I had no idea the interior floorpans, dashboard, and console were as bad as they were. The other things like the trunk pan, rear window panel, and trunk lip I knew were bad. What I was really paying for was the fact it was an original 1970 442, correct engine, correct transmission, correct rear axle, AC Car, Gauges, Dualgate, and came from the factory with a ram air hood and spoiler. But more importantly it was the color I wanted - burgundy mist with white stripes.

Johnd

Well after a couple of setbacks the floor pans are in and look really good. With the exception of a small section we needed to cut and stitch weld in a piece of metal to fit to the brace, and even that isn't too bad. Once we finished we sprayed on some 3M Schutz to protect it from future moisture or rust. We also started work on the rear trunk lip and plan to remove the rear window section next week. Below are some pics.

Johnd

To spray the underside of the car I needed to remove the old exhaust, which was pretty rusty. In the process I cracked the passenger manifold where the exhaust bolts up, and the drivers one already had a crack. I ended up going with a complete new exhaust and manifolds from the parts place. I also ordered a new gas tank, sending unit, and straps. I figured once the trunk floor is in and the underside is sprayed, why bolt on old parts.


I also took the time this trip to fix the transmission leak, which turned out to be the modulator valve and the o ring on the dipstick tub.


I am hoping to have the metal work finished in the next 6 weeks, so I can start the suspension and brakes. It is slow going but it is going

Johnd

Spent the weekend in NH. We welded in the seat bracks, cut the hole for the transmission cable, installed the drain plugs, sprayed another coat of Schutz, and installed the shifter.


I also put on the new manifolds, motor mounts, transmission mount, and various other parts. We are cutting out the rear window this weekend, once that is complete, we are moving to the trunk floor, and finally the trunk lip.


Overall, I am pleased with the final product and know with the amount of POR15 and Schutz that this thing will never rust from the inside out again, and will long out live me...

Allan R

Nice job on the pans! Yeah, I like working with new parts to a degree. But that's also why I bought a media blaster. To get some of the OEM stuff back to basic. Stuff like a busted e man is not in the cards though.

Just a comment (hope it's taken right). If you knew that the trunk pan, rear window panel, and trunk lip were bad, it's almost a sure thing the floors were gone too. Hows the frame on this car? Have you checked it for weak spots?

Johnd

Hi Allan,


Your comment was definitely not taken the wrong way. I knew the trunk, rear window, and lip were bad. However the seller said the interior pans were solid. On my other 70 442 (convertible- which I regret selling) The trunk and quarters were shot but there was no other rust on the car. In this case, I listened to the seller, versus flying out to look at it - lesson learned. As for the frame, trunk braces, floor braces, and torq boxes, they are all in excellent shape - Sure they had some light surface rust and a ton of dust bust they are better than a friends 2009 crown vic I was under this weekend. If you look close at the attached pic you can see how nice the rear section is - most of the other cars I've seen this is all pitted, but this one still looks new.


Do I have buyers remorse, some days yes, others no. The guy doing the welding teases me all the time about what a rust bucket the car was. However, he said he can't believe I found a numbers matching car, with ram air, ac, dualgate, rear spoiler, gauges, etc. that hadn't already been restored. In total I am 17K into the car, and with suspension, brakes, engine detail, etc. I will have a little over 30K when done. Had it not been for the free metal work I would be closer to 40K - so on a good day I like the car

Johnd

BTW - all the options were from the factory - so nothing added to clone a W30. This was a true 442 ordered with all the goodies

Allan R

Holy Samolians John! I didn't realize you had spent that much already. You obviously did your research and set a decent budget for this project. LOL, the back of that car (what's left of it that hasn't been cut out) does look pretty good.

Is that a W27 axle or just the cover on your differential?? If it's the axle, you have a major nice feature on that baby. Do you know what gears this car came with? The axle tube should have a stamping just to the side of where the vent tube is. That code will identify the gear set.

Johnd

Hi Alan,


I pain 9K to get the car to my door, and the other 6K went towards the interior which is done, new bumpers, grills, chrome moldings, correct carb, hoses, new trunk lid, new doors, etc. The only pieces I need to finish the body are fenders.


The guy doing the metal work was shocked at how solid the rest of the car is. He thinks the rear of the car was sticking out of a car port and the rear window leaked into the trunk and interior compartment, so the car rusted from the inside out, which is why the frame, rockers, etc. are so nice. The only spot of rust on the rear quarters is the drivers side behind the wheel and it is about the size on a quarter.


As for the rear end, it is 3:08 posi with just the W-27 cover. I plan on pulling the thing out when I replace the upper and lower control arms, and will paint it then. I will most likely paint the center carrier aluminum like you have on your car. I did this on my other 442 and it looks great

sammy

Subscribed

Cutlass Memories

I have subscribed too. Seeing how your restoration is going gives me insight as to how to work on my 70 442 project.
Keep up the good work!

Johnd

Went up to NH for the weekend, and my buddy finished cutting out the rear window. We are trying to reuse all the factory weld points when installing, but the rear seat section was a pain to get out and I had to drill through both pieces of metal.. I am going to look online for one and if I can't find one I will weld and grind.


Also, does anyone know if they make the top section of the trunk floor. I have a couple of small holes in mine.

Johnd

Well my search for front fenders is over. I bought the drivers one from a member of the board for $475 - it had some body work done on the front edge, but the bottom section of the fender and brace are solid. I just got back from picking the passenger side up in RI, it was dented in the same area on the front corner, and has a small rust hole on the bottom, but the brace is in excellent shape. The passenger fender cost me my old tailpipes, mufflers, and $175 in cash. So $650 for a set of 1970 fenders with two small dents and one rust hole is good in my book.


Now I am back to trying to find doors as I'm not thrilled with the ones I bought last fall. I want something a little nicer.

Johnd

Attached are a few pictures of the passenger fender brace and front section where it was dented

Johnd

We finished removing the old window and package tray section over the weekend, and test fitted the new piece. I am hoping it will be welded in next weekend... I still have to sand down some of the surface rust and treat the metal, but overall, it is a solid fix.

Johnd

Does anyone know where to by the top section of the trunk? Mine has a couple of holes and while I have the rest of the trunk out I want to replace it. Attached is a picture of the piece I need.

Johnd

The welder finished welding in the rear window, and I ground everything down over the weekend. Overall, I am very please with the way it came out. We are still stuck on what to do with the rear section of the trunk floor. They make a complete piece with braces for a chevelle and will be searching to see if it will fit my car with some modification. We also started pulling the engine over the weekend, so we can paint the front frame. I have 5 weekends left to get as much work done before the car is shipped to our new home in Florida.

costpenn

You are getting the hard parts out of the way John. Where in Florida?

Johnd

I am heading down to fort myers.. My brother works for the redsox down there and my mother moved down a few years ago. Work said I could work remote fulltime and the wife got laid off, so it seemed like a good time. It just stinks I am moving now. I have another friend who does body work and he said he would do the entire car for 3K once the metal work was done. The plan now is to ship it to FL. I will finish the engine, suspension, and brakes. Once done I will either have it pained down their or ship it back here.

Johnd

Well the transport company dropped the car off in fort myers yesterday, and it is just as ugly as I remember. Over the past few months I have been collecting more parts like a power steering pump, pulleys, date code water pump, and open face alternator. I am still trying to find a decent welder down here to remove the floors that were put in, install new floors, a firewall, and trunk pan. I have talked to several people who say to just patch them, but after dumping as much money as I have and seeing some of the other restorations on here, it isn't fair to the car. If I can't do it right, I would just assume part it out. I know I would take a hell of a loss but in the end I wouldn't be happy with it being patched together. If anyone knows someone in Florida who does welding send them my way.

Eddie Hansen

John just read this thread front to back awesome work, I amsure you asked dvap . If they had that piece? How big are the holes? I do belueve that if theyarent too big you could cut out a square around it and butt weld it in place, it can be ground on both top and bottom and you will have virtually no seam . I just wanted to pass on that the night is always darkest before dawn, be patient, and a solution will present itself, my resto is taking so dang long some days it seams like moses could have helped with the teardown, and noah helped with the rustproofing lol....

My folks lived over in naples till mom passed away, nice area..

Eddie Hansen

John went back and looked again at that piece it looks nearly flat except that raised portion over the diff... this may sound crazy , but what if you made a die out of wood? the angle looks to be about 45 degrees but whatever the angle is you could set the angle on a jigsaw , rotosaw etc and cut out the square, then make another piece as the stamp that would fit the square it might take some sandwiching to get right height etc , but basically you would sandwich new sheetmetal between the two pieces of your mould and clamp together forming the piece, probably be easier with a floor press but I think its doable, sure finding a piece would be easier... but certainly better than parting this car out , she is a rwal deal 442 and deserves to live again...

Johnd

Eddie,


Thanks for the words of encouragement.. I go back and forth depending on the week and time of day. I know when this is finished it will be an awesome car, I just need to find the right shop to do the welding work. My brother has a 69 chevelle and he is trying to work with the same shop I am, so perhaps they will cut us a deal. They are coming out next week to look at both cars.


JD

Eddie Hansen

john most welcome here is a rough drawing if my rambling wasnt clear..

Johnd

Eddie,


Thanks for the picture... I was talking with someone else on the board last night and they said the full trunk pan shouldn't be that hard, so I think that is the way I am going to go.

Eddie Hansen

Cool beans john, just trying to help, glad there is a solution

Dbechtel71

What is the style or name of the covers on seat? They look different than mine

69ishHoliday

John,
I've read through the entire thread and I have to say that although you encountered a much rougher start than most could stomach the end will justify the means. I'm subscribed to follow it through. The final product will be outstanding. - Steven

Johnd

Well it has been a while since I last posted. I have been busy on the new house in Florida. Yesterday was the first chance I had to work on the car in three months. Over the past few weeks I ordered a new power steering pump & pulley, correct water pump, and an open faced alternator. I wasn't planning on tearing down the motor for while but it looks like the old waterpump is leaking and needs to be replaced. Does anyone have a good source for rocker arms, pushrods and guides?

Johnd

After doing the interior floor pans, I have decided to let the professionals handle the trunk pan, cowl, and detailing of the underside. I have been to several shows in Florida and everyone says Jack's restoration does great work, so I went their last week to check out some of his cars. After showing him pictures of my car, he said he wanted to see it in person to get a better idea of the repairs. He actually came to my house yesterday and spent an hour walking around the car and taking notes. He said the interior floor pans and rear window section came out very well and they just needed to be detailed, and that the firewall can be repaired. Below is a list of what he is going to do


1. Take the body off the frame
2. Install the new trunk pan
3. Install new trunk gutters
4. Install the new rear section
5. Cleanup the firewall and floor welds
6. Spray the underside of the car
7. Repair the cowl
8. Paint the dash and firewall
9. Sand down the entire rear clip
10. Fix all the dings and put it in primer
11. Jam the car


The quote was $5800 excluding the parts, which I think is very reasonable considering I spent almost $1000 putting the floor in myself. The car is going to get shipped to the shop after I finish pulling the motor and transmission. It will be nice to have the car in primer and ready for assembly.

Allan R

John, if he's doing all that work including the jambs on the car? Why not have him paint and wet sand/polish it too? That would leave you with just having to reassemble the interior and do the rolling chassis.

Johnd

Hi Alan - Happy New Years.... The reason I am having him stop at the Jams is I'm still not happy with the doors I bought and would prefer to have all the panels painted at the same time as it is a metallic based paint. Having him do the jambs will allow me to put the glass back in.

Johnd

Well I finally started getting the car ready to go to the restoration shop. I pulled the dashboard and wiring harness last night. While I have everything out I am sending my old gauges to Scott for a face lift. I bought some new lenses and face plates and Scott is going to refinish them for me and add a quartz clock tot he tack. Overall, it will cost around $350 to $400 but well worth it in my opinion considering how they look now. Attached are some pictures.

Johnd

More

Johnd

Didn't want to touch there so I left them in the plastic for Scott

costpenn

Good to hear you are back on it John. Have any trouble pulling the dash?

Johnd

Joe - it only took me a couple of hours to get the old dash out. Best part is someone actually bought it on ebay for $200 - I guess they really wanted the lower section as the pad was junk

Johnd

I spent the entire weekend removing all the wiring harnesses, steering column, shifter, etc. There is nothing left of the interior but metal, rusted metal, but none the less metal. This weekend, I will be draining all the fluids in preparation of pulling the motor and transmission. I can't wait to get the rear clip back from the body shop so I can start assembling the interior of the car and getting the motor back in. I really hope it goes back together as easy as it came apart... The wiring will be the toughest challenge. I will be replacing the front light, engine, and ac harness, as they have all been tapped. The dash harness is like new - there isn't one cut connection - which amazes me for a 45 year old car

ah7910

Love that 'DANGER" sticker on post #114 above.!


Spent an hour this morning reading up.
Great Stuff John!