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99℅ sure its a girl ( our first is a boy). And i chose the name already. Years ago we made an agreement with my wife that she chooses the first name of our first child, and i choose the second name. And vice versa with the second child.
And then about the car.. Sure it costs something, but ive long ago stopped worrying what it costs if i want it.
If it takes longer to be complete; so be it. This year i can happily drive with just a hole in the hood if thats what it takes.
Are you sure your carbs does not fit under your hood without cutting it? That intake looks lower than RPM. Your newer body might be different, but in -69 with RPM, Street demon and original air cleaner with flatted base and 1/2" lift ring fits without no problems. Maybe you can tinker with your assembly a bit if it's a question of few tenths. Spacers, cleaner base.....
Custom headers is a great idea. Keep in mind that you will spend most time in low or mid range. Measure the headers to support that area. Usually people have too big of a diameter header pipes and they are too short.Take also the trouble to fix the horrible exhaust port floors from the exit side with steel plates.
Google "Headers by Ed". Old school header tech, but still valid. Could not agree more.
Sorry for really late reply. Measured long ago. Problem is at front, since the cleaner extends so far. And i dont have a problem to cut the hood. Ultimate would be to get fiberglass hood, i know they sell em at USA, but shipping for such a large part is enormous id believe.
Soo.. Heads went to machinery #2 to get finished after the headguy.. Re-surfacing is needed to get fine-enough Surface roughness to hold with MLS-gaskets, plus something not headguy-related like milling rocker stands down some.
Milled down the guides for posi-seals and enough lift for probably any wise choice for a cam driven at street.
Faced new problem.. Compression overshoots now from calculated. Double-mill the decks due to some %¤&#%¤#&/#¤ headguy, and valves ended up to be "lower" than quessed, so less volume. Was stupid enough to order cam with pre-measured information, and i quess now i need to get a bit bigger to bleed some compression, since i was already on the verge with cam i quess. Thats kinda positive problem, usually bigger cam means more power when everything else matches, and i /we think the dual-quad manifold works the better the more revs, but that again might push me to change gearing higher to not lug it down. And the old one is pretty new already.. That engine has been one hell of a money-pit due to incompetent machineries/ due to head-guy not reading the order and cutting the deck, and later blaming that we didnt have any talk about using MLS-gaskets..
Well, soon ill get back to my car again, family-life is getting back to tracks, and i changed work to one where i can do 4-day week, so more time at home. Swapped mainly to have more time with family + alot more interesting job, but the car-hobby benefits from it on the side.. If this pile moves at some day ill be amazed, ive lost all hope already.
Last edited by Inline; August 23rd, 2019 at 10:17 AM.
I know there can be situations in engine build where you need all the motivation available to proceed. Just keep it going and sort things one problem at a time.
What is your compression calculator really telling you now? You need to keep it under 10 with iron heads, unless building for ethanol. I assume you are around 10 with your CR, and therefore your intake degrees need to be around 220° (0,50). Playing with static compression calculators may also be helpful. For example Wallace racing has one. You can also "bleed" some compression, or in other words lower your static cr by degreeing your cam a bit later, to close your intake later. This moves your power band upwards. To adjust your compression, MLS head gasgets are available in variety of thicknesses.
If there is a problem, there will be the cure!
Could you post a picture of your intake plenum, just curious to see.
Good old 50's high-tech? Banks separated from each others, so 1+3+5+7 and 2+4+6+8, and open between banks. A tad problematic. As cast the wall shapes were irregular, bumbs here and there randomly, and short-side turn was really sharp ~80 degree turn. Now the walls are evenly contoured, and short-side turn has a nice smooth turn. Ports matched heads beautifully- something to say about when comparing to Edelbrocks current offerings, just to say.
Thats the sole reason i use MLS gaskets, that i get them at size i need. Wouldnt otherwise bother if i could do with 10 times cheaper regular gaskets…
Compression is over 10:1.
Edit:
Just visited garage to just see if my car actually is Still there, and installed trans-cooler. Made the rack and utilized attaching points of AC condenser. 20500BTU B&M.
Last edited by Inline; August 10th, 2019 at 07:06 AM.
Good old 50's high-tech? Banks separated from each others, so 1+3+5+7 and 2+4+6+8, and open between banks. A tad problematic. As cast the wall shapes were irregular, bumbs here and there randomly, and short-side turn was really sharp ~80 degree turn. Now the walls are evenly contoured, and short-side turn has a nice smooth turn. Ports matched heads beautifully- something to say about when comparing to Edelbrocks current offerings, just to say.
That thing will be interesting to tune. Good luck with that. I admire your dare to try something different!
Finally took myself from neck and did the battery/junction post ready. New battery cables all-around, 0 gauge as AWG, or 50mm2. Cables to junction-box are 2 gauge or 35mm2.
Cables are made by myself. One reason was to get rid of side-post battery, theyre next to non-existant publicly here, wont care to strand due to no available battery.
Main-current switch was a by-product when i was wondering how to get power to that junction-box running all additional electric stuff through fuses and relays. That made it easy + now its easy to just turn current off when leaving the car for few weeks not driven, for example. Minus-cable nor cable to starter not shown at these pictures.
Then my new wheels, finally! 15x7's for front and 15x8 for rear's. Plus matching spare When i had my Keystones i swore those were the last unilugs i had. This time around the decision was easy, wheels id really wanted would had cost +2000$ for me, those did cost ( including matching spare) a whopping 450$. Ultimately i want to repaint those to another colour ( that was planned when ordered) but lets see if i just get them under as-is. Going to run the same tried-and-true 215/70/15 - 255/60/15 sizes as last time around.
Not much else. Just thought to drop few pics. My engine build has stalled, once again, due to heads at machinery. When i get them, its time to assemble it, paint it and drive it in. Were sooo close.. But so far away still. And a boatload of minor stuff of course, which turns up after every step, which you didnt even imagine/ remind. But thats normal, i quess.
Time flies, i see. Last year didnt treat me nice, hope this years better. IE, life happened almost harshest way imaginable.
Slowly returned back to hobby. Just thought to update this for the sake of it on its current state.
I made a short-list of what still needs to be done:
Engine:
- Finnish the paint
- Order correct length push-rods
- Carb linkage ( i have one "trash" mock-up, as are the carbs at pic ( funny thing; those carbs were sold as working ones together with intake, they worked maybe 20 years back then))
- Drive it in and tune it
Chassi:
- Fuel line from front frame-rail to carbs
- Exhaust from headers to rear bumber
- Finnish the electrics
- New tires
- New radiator, old is leaking
Thats it. Not much, but still alot.
Wheels turned out interesting. Colour choice was a bit shoot in the dark, but they were cheap enough that i wanted to test it, and if not liking, repaint them next winter. Its " pearl gold" RAL colour, like old golden Ducati rims etc; cant get a good pic with camera which would show same as my eyes. But they change colour with different lightning. At some lightning they look like babies poop, and at some light they are awesome. Do i have now triple-brown car?
Engine has been just standing there waiting for finishing of paint, and correct-length pushrods. Will continue when other, more important things permits. No RTV-Warriors were present while building this. I could strangle everyone who builds engine with RTV on every place. PS. I said its high. Its awesome. Greetings to Greta Thunberg; no pollution control for me
Just in time when they are painting the picture of fuel prices up to $8 / US gal. here at august to fight climate change. Yea, right.
Last edited by Inline; January 31st, 2020 at 02:13 AM.
That seems really handsome! I also want to say I admire your attitude to do something differently.
Therefore, I'm a bit sorry to say, but I see few issues with that intake. With Olds V8 powerband the intake runners in that design are too short. Angle of the Intake runners is no good. I'd like the runners hit the ports from higher (tunnel ram being extreme example). If you think the firing order, you can figure a thing that won't make the tune up easier. Compare how dual plane works together with firing order.
In many ways, your engine performance would benefit from Edelbrock RPM intake, and also your life with it would be much easier. Downside would be more conservative outlook. I think that (Offy) intake is more for good looks than serious performance.
This is only my opinion and we can do our own engines however we like, and thank god for that!
No offence taken; i agree with every bit of your thoughts. When i started this build, i had Edelbrock RPM intake on my ownership, later sold it. Then i thought that do i want to have the same basic combo that everyone and their mother is running? Hell no, even if that means serious power loss and difficulties in tuning. Id rather take cool looks ( aquired taste), since to be fair, these old land barges are going to be always slow compared to what you could get from used car market with the same money you just sink to engine; so why bother?
Intake required heavy massaging on short-side turn to heads, originally it was really sharp 90* bend at near floor. Head-guy raised the turn as high as possible on casting and smoothed it out to be radiused. AVS2 carbs comes to help with low-speed atomization, atleast from carb; fully adjustable ignition to get most out of it also.
As this is a road car, and +50% driving ill do with this is at motorways, engine is spending most of its time at 3000rpm plus, not even trying to luq it down.
Lowest it will see when driving is 2200rpm at our speed limits. When this was on one part last time, i happily drove our motorways at 85mph.
Took myself from neck and went on to measure pushrods. 8.350" they are. Like that would mean anything to anyone since you need to measure them.
It was kinda best compromise, shorter and the mark would widen, longer and it started to go too near valve-tip edge.
Engine looks awesome at gold. Hope its worth it; used POR15-family with 4 coats total, hand painted. Was a tedious job to do, but hoping it pays off and not burn off on first start.
Intake went to resurface to get it percetly flat since im using the turkey-pan style steel intake gasket.
I have that same offy manifold. When tuning I personally found it ran best with an almost one-to-one progressive linkage. I had elb carbs and I put the same jets/rods in both carbs. My car runs at high elevations so my jetting would be out to lunch for your needs.
I have that same offy manifold. When tuning I personally found it ran best with an almost one-to-one progressive linkage. I had elb carbs and I put the same jets/rods in both carbs. My car runs at high elevations so my jetting would be out to lunch for your needs.
Im going to run straight also. Despite what some guys say, few real carb gurus who has been tinkering with dual quads their whole life, so they have reputable experience with them ( has even own shops), have stated that straight runs best always when you got them sorted. AVS2 should be the best carb available currently. Atleast they had better moldings since my last AFB750 i had. It was horrible cast. Maybe Weber is renewing their moldings? I remember ther was same kind of issue 8 years back on 55 DCO side-drafts, they didnt even warrant them up here, and they sure needed some loving hand. Heard they fixed/ replaced their casting molds since then.
How has it run otherwise? Interested to hear. How long you have been sporting that setup?
Last edited by Inline; February 14th, 2020 at 10:13 AM.
14 freakin days to receive my pushrods- just to notice when setting them up that i need adjustable guideplates.
Comp Cams-ones didnt quite work to get rockers centered side-to-side on valve tips to acceptable level. Well, i quess i wait next 14 days for those Isky guideplates.. Baah….
Got my Isky adjustable guideplates thursday, and assembled them today. Busy again since work started historically early due to virtually no winter.
Now i got my rockers centered on valve-tips perfectly.
Had a problem where approx. 50/50 of rockers didnt center on valve-tip; i didnt know what the actual problem was, just ordered Isky's. Now when looking CC ones, the problem seems to be(?) the difference on stamping/ QC. They vary a bit on each other for openings for pushrods, and also are alot wider than Isky's allowing side-to-side movement.
Oh well, on the track again. And of course, money pouring in again due to work continuing.
Dragged one of my new wheels to sunshine. They are RAL Pearl Gold ( same as, for example, those golden Ducati wheels). Sad my crappy camera dont give em any justice, they look _awesome_ on sunlight- if you happen to like the colour at all.
Quad-Brown car now? Brown interior, two-tone Brown exterior, and "Brown" wheels.. Thought to try Vitour Galaxy R1 wheels this time. No more Cooper Cobras for me.
Whoever says Oldsmobile's oil fill tube is too long, should check their intake-system height.. Its like throttle-lever short of ready ( the engine). Jammed the front carb choke open and unconnected, rear having electric choke. Lets see if it even needs it. On original Carter dual-quad pairs, the front carb top dont even have choke-blade shaft holes drilled.
Had a bit of trouble when changing CC guide plates to Iskys adjustables. They were like 3 times thicker than CC's, and i had my rocker-pads milled down by the amount of CC guide plates.. Got that thing sorted out, but one more setback. What you see on right side of the motor, is a bracket i made to hold air/oil separator. M/E Wagner adjustable PCV-valve connects to that from same-side rocker cover, and then from air/oil separator to front carb. Since i had originally AC car, both PS and ALT are on left side on motor, didnt feel like searching for whole set of correct pulleys and brackets for non-AC car. Added benefit being i can run dual-belts now for whole "system". Dont need to be as tight + if one breaks im good to continue.
While staring at this, one thing occured to me. What such an motor misses is that huge clutch-fan on it. That would be icing on the cake. I have all the wiring done to run electric fans, and i already have them ( well, wiring wont go anywhere if i decide to run clutch fan now, and some time to run electric).. But still im now seriously considering of running clutch fan.. My clutch, and fan both are shot, and so is my fan shroud, but i can save that one, plus i found few good ones from junkyards.
This might sound "sick" to someone, but for me its also alot about visual appearance. I test fitted my battered clutch fan on this, and it suddenly looked awesome. Dunno, lets see what happens. It was never about power anyways ( electric vs clutch, since such an thing as free energy dont exist), more about my laziness to look for new and correct fan, clutch and shroud..
Other mishaps include trans crossmember.. Long ago i bought it from US located junkyard, as being one for 73-77 A-bodies. Eyeing it it looked right, i cleaned it, painted it.. Never test fitted. Until recently. Quess did it fit? Turns out its probably from 71-76 E-Body by measurements……. Oh well, live and learn.
This is on hold currently due to Worldwide situation. Quess its better hold now and see where things turn, and have that money on pocket just in case, what i would use to this. Not alot to do anymore, anyways.
Last edited by Inline; April 1st, 2020 at 08:03 AM.
Some things happened due to corona. At first i learned that we have more work than ever due to Corona. Strange connection; due to Corona oil prices are really low, and when accounting that oil is used on various forms at tarmac, suddenly we have more work than in decades, when country decided to invest on renewing roads now when its cheap.
Secondly; i ordered the very last items i could figure out to complete this finally, 18th of April; they shipped out yesterday. Everything was in stock, but somehow due to Corona situation the leading time for shipping just grew and grew. Maybe because theres not that much planes flying over continent nowadays than days before.
Meanwhile i finally took myself from a neck ( again) and fabricated something to locate the coil. Wasnt so easy as it seems to fit around distributor, rear vacuum connection to PB, and not hit anywhere.
I assure you its heavy-duty enough to not break from the weight of coil and shake of engine. 5mm thick steel all-around, and MMA-welded all around to prevent cold seams.
Wires are for automatic choke. They just hang on there for now. Should start planning to bring the car from garage to home next, here im going to lift the engine and trans at Place rather than 14 miles away.
Finally.. The baby waits to get lifted to bay. After mid-summers fest thats going to occur. Hated messing with RTV on intake-gasket. Used turkey-tray.
You see. HiPo clutch fan... It just looks like it belongs there.
New radiator waiting to be assembled. Sized as stock. Old was leaking, and found out repairing it would cost more than getting new one, doh.. Saved the old still, just in case.
Intake system ready. Fuel-line continues with hard-line from there, the hose-nipple has already been replaced with NPT/AN-hard line fitting.
Also got new trans-crossmember. Opted to buy one, decided i have better things to do than weld one, like drinking beer at sauna..
Made by g-force, and Summit sticker just applied on top of it, reducing the price some. Weird market.
Hmm, looking those pictures, someone should clean that room..
Last edited by Inline; June 6th, 2020 at 05:36 AM.
Location: Edmonton, AB. And "I am Can 'eh' jun - eh"
Posts: 24,525
Hey Jouni, are you going to dyno that beast before you drop it in? Just curious if the HP and torque will be too much for the old TH350 that's in the car, unless you're also overbuilding it with different clutches, stall and shift kit.
I'd love to be there to watch that baby get stabbed back into place. Keep up the good work!
Trans have been gone through totally two winters back. Old parts are core, shafts and planets plus valve-body. Almost everything else is brand new;
bearings, steel plates, friction plates, shift-kit, dual-feed, modified drum ( cant remember which one anymore) etc etc. Almost everything i managed to persuade for me that its needed, lol. Plus new convertor, 2400 stall advertised.
Im going to chassis dyno with it. Strong belief it will work. If not- well ive seen more crap things than that.
Two years, and 9 months since it was last time at our property.
Now it needs something to get lifted inside. Hood also got some paint To be known; King Alcohol played a part there
I built "childrens swing" frame, and i have hand chain hoist for it. Picture tricks a bit, that frame is plenty high enough even if it looks somewhat small at picture? 2x6" wood all around, plenty enough to lift one engine.
As i said, now to go through all electrics and run fuel pump etc to see its all working, and lift engine inside. Have alot to do currently, both at work and at home, so cant comment on exact time-frame- but when time allows, it happens, at last.
Last edited by Inline; June 27th, 2020 at 07:52 AM.
New shocks installed to rear, throwed old airjacks or something away. Just cheap Gabriel Guardians to get something there. Raised the rear 2 inches. Ive planned to go over whole suspension at winter to replace old rubber, springs, shocks etc.
Been through the electrics; actually found an electrical gremlin made by myself, will fix it at winter, now i just passed it; it had to do with 13-point trailer electrics. Next i quess ill drop the tank once again, and replace all the already new rubber parts with, which should be better, hose, since i have it. Fuel pump worked as should, oil pressure and water temperature have been wired.
Engine is still waiting to get lifted. Need to get few friends at same time, and have good weather, to actually lift that elefant out of the room i build it, to hoist.
Opted to not use double gaskets and ordered and already glued to heads half-inch valve cover spacers.
Noticed that on new trans crossmember, the trans support bushing sits .4" inches lower than on original, made an spacer there.
So, alot of little things done as preliminary work, that when i finally get it lifted to bay, i could actually concentrate on it and not to the little things.
Last edited by Inline; July 19th, 2020 at 06:24 AM.
Fought a long time to get motor installed, and finally drove to garage and back, to obtain my old broken motor mounts. No wonder it wont fit.
Long story short; Summit refuses to sell Anchor Industries 2328 motor mounts to Finland ( there are every now and then some items where Summit says they wont ship them to Finland, go figure), but offered Pioneer 2328 motor mounts as equivalent. Measuring them against original mounts, they cant fit in any way. They bolt to the block, but not on the pads where it attaches.
Now, ill go heat sauna, and drink "few" beers.. Theres gonna be corpses...
Already forgot, have my new tires installed, finally. Really dont know yet if i like them or not. But the paint was so cheap i can paint them again if i want. When the sun hits them, they look awesome, and when not... Not so. On the pictures, its not shining to wheels. RWL-tires of course. People here actually praise those rubbers against BFG and Cooper Cobras ( from which i have personal experience) especially on wet. Will see. Same old 255/60/15 at back, and 215/70/15 at front.
Last edited by Inline; July 19th, 2020 at 06:33 AM.
This has been a fascinating build to watch from half way around the world. I'm no expert in any of the areas you've tackled, so have not offered any advice. But I can offer encouragement! Way to Go! I agree, you may want to re-think the wheel color, but everything else has been really cool! Keep it up!
This has been a fascinating build to watch from half way around the world. I'm no expert in any of the areas you've tackled, so have not offered any advice. But I can offer encouragement! Way to Go! I agree, you may want to re-think the wheel color, but everything else has been really cool! Keep it up!
Thank you
So, the motor mount dilemma. Got the Anchor industries ones. Outside they are identical, except one glaring difference.. Picture taken with vernier caliper stem to show the difference, not the greatest but maybe you got the idea.
Anchor Industries at top, Pioneer at bottom.
And that was the difference between Anchor Industries and Pioneer motor mounts. At the picture is Anchor Industries mount. On pioneer mount, the height between the "floor" of the mount which sits against frame-pad, to center of bolt-hole, was 5mm too short, preventing installation. With these mounts, i verified fit to frame pads before assembling them to block.... After that the engine went straight in with little wiggling to get bolts through. Job done.
Friend mentioned about not cleaned, greasy inner fenders. Im waiting to get at my work places big hall to wash all the oil out there, not to my yard. Plus there are awesome solvents to make job easy.
Air cleaner lid comes that much over the fender line. Just as i measured long time ago. Today ill tackle the fuel lines, drop the tank once more and chance the "old" rubber parts to Gates Barricade fuel-hose i bought. Too easy now to drop tank and swap them , and find year later those no-name rubber parts swelling.
Next week goes travelling around Finland ( work), then there are big cruise-inns im going as watcher, funerals etc. So in next few weeks i quess not that much happens.
Last edited by Inline; July 25th, 2020 at 11:11 PM.
Last time i do it alone on the ground... Until next time That bitch weighted a ton. Pro-tip ( ) -When filling torque convertor- resist the urge to cut hole at the bottom of oil-can Mini Exxon Valdez happened. Shouldnt do nothing when too tired to think clearly Also ( shame by me ) noticed only by now that speedometer cable (cover) was broken near the transmission. Ordered new one. After postages taxes, duties etc, $140 to my door. Thats economy for you. Installed the cardan shaft after re-greasing.
Fuel lines are done, fuel pressure regulator installed, fuel circulates and fills the bowls. On that department were good to go. Oil is at the engine minus 1 quart, get more at next week.
First start is short of installing the wire looms to engine, installing alternator, and setting initial timing before first start. Weekend or two i hope, and were Finally starting this first time. It might be the last one too, who knows
Pictured from sauna door. Its pretty much short of making new hangers for emergency brake due to new trans crossmember ( bought today 2 meter of 8mm "cold-pulled" steel to fabricate new ones), shimming the radiator shroud down, All electrics connected and working etc. And of course The Parts Place F***ING me second time with this car. No back-drive linkage bushing even after 2 weeks wait.. They were only worried about their crap Ebay rating i gave them, nothing else. Steer away.
Trans cooler lines going along the inner fender. I went to hydraulic shop, with measurements, ordered the best hydraulic hose they have, and installed it under "explosion cover" to go neatly together from cooler to trans-case,
Price was similiar to what those joints and hose, plus the guard would cost to buy alone as AN. Those were JIC. I wont never-ever anymore do lines by myself. Just measure and order custom ones.
Its 50/60 chance, if ill start it this weekend, or next. Cloose.
Last edited by Inline; August 21st, 2020 at 11:24 AM.
Got this close. Uploaded zero-retard curve, cyl count 8 and rpm limiter 3500. Then the sky broke loose. Well, i have beer. And theres always another weekend.
Theres also new alternator. Mysterious electric problem turned out to be alternator. Best decision i ever made was to do trans-cooler lines on hydraulic shop. $98 total from best hose they had, with pressed fittings and explosion cover around them, mainly to make install look nicer when they go under black cover.
As a side note, who the €+@/# uses serial-port at 2020?!? Few shops almost laughed me out when asking for usb-serial-port adapter. Found one from the whole city. Thank god it worked, ive read that not all adapters work with msd.
My lousy camera phone does no justice to thunder presented with only downpipes, no other exhaust. Neighbours found out aswell i got it started
Next step is to find MSD combatible timing light, mine refuses to work. Idling over 1000rpm, no idea about what my exact timing is, just set it close enough by damper timing marks and seeing how magnetic pickup was positioned at distributor. God im happy!!! Oil pressure is top notch aswell- Its beer time boys, it started raining anyways outside just now. Have a GREAT weekend everyone!
Last edited by Inline; September 5th, 2020 at 05:53 AM.
- Emergency brake cable routing, old hangers/guides wont work with new transmission crossmember
- Install the inner valve springs
- Heater needs to work on inspection, i just plugged the intake for now, i misbuild my coil-stand so the coil sits just at top of the heater outlet. Live and learn
- Exhaust
- TH350 leaking from 1-2 accumulator cover. Probably cut the seal when installing it, need to revisit that
- Get it jetted and ignition map done, ie. dyno
- Fabricate up gas-pedal to carb connection, stand, wires etc
Ill think thats that. But sure its going to take few weekends. I think ill take the october as my goal to have it inspected again and at road.
Bank really should give me loan for garage. I have one 20 kilometers away, but id rather have it at my yard. Thats why its now at yard under tarp, not interested to drive that 20 kilometers back and forth.
Temps stayed stable at 180f, hot oil pressure kept stable at 48psi @2500rpm with straight 30wt mineral oil and no leaks. Trans pulls too ( i rebuild whole trans also at home, good sign it even pulls, so somethings happening there).
All in all really happy now.
Ignition was only 22 degrees advanced ( found a working timing light) due to distributor body "ear" contacting to intake, need to grind that ear off.
Remember my old smog motor was a goat to rev even unloaded, even found old video about it to prove that, but boy that one revs with vengeance. Cant wait to drive it!!!
June 29th, 2019, 09:31 AM
Sure it costs something, but ive long ago stopped worrying what it costs if i want it.
If this pile moves at some day ill be amazed, ive lost all hope already.
