Seff

Yeah, at this point I've just resigned to the fact that I'll have to go all-out, more or less.

Jamesbo

Self,
Looks good. Be sure to protect yourself with a good mask Silica poison from sand blasting can kill ya.

Seff

Is this Silica poison released from the paint? I have a water-based sand blaster, which should be safe.

Jamesbo

No from the sand particles in the air.

Seff

Pardon my skepticism, but are you sure? The sand I use is so rough that there's no dust at all - I wear safety glasses to protect me from sand springing back , though.

Seff

These look worrying, but then again, not like something that'd inhibit function.







These might need some TLC. :P



As mentioned, the sander died midway.

jturkey69

LMAO...I also take too many breaks...kids is my excuse.....lol..whats yours Oldsguy?

jturkey69

Seff...you should be wearing a face mask when your doing the sand blasting...a cheap medical style mouth and nose mask at least!...the media that your using can wreck some long term havoc on the lungs. after your done for the day, take your shower and blow your nose...what color is the mucus build-up?..Im betting grayish black..lol. be careful bro, and also to comment on the speed of your progress..lol..yeah, you have some energy alright...very fast work on your teardown...thanks for the update!!!!

By the way...your homeland band Volbeat?....tearin up North America, and gaining fans by the minute!!!...and I have been tellin people for a while now to give them a listen!

Seff

Yeah, but since the sandblasting is wet sandblasting, it leaves no dust - it's the sanding, which I DO use a mask for (after having coughed up the first black and red pile of slime, yes) that makes for dust.

Imma gonna put some Volbeat on right now. :P

oldsguybry

kids too, and im just a putz......I like to take my time and enjoy I guess......Seff , I did a fair amount of blasting , but it was the media kind and I did not wear a mask part of the time.....will never do that again.

Seff

Just ran through the preliminary parts list at rock auto - shipping to Denmark is $2000+... I think I need to ally myself with some kind of vendor over here to get this stuff. Parts themselves were half of that, which somehow seems wrong.

Sanded the rest of the hood, forgot my camera. :P

Seff

Sander is back in action, and this means I have only that stripe, the doors and one fender left to do. The comes the insides of... everything. :P



Engine's ready to go to the shop. They'll hone/bore as needed and take a look at everything to see if it measures up, as well as doing the valves. I considered having them assemble it, but the guy knew so little of old American V8 engines that he didn't want to risk it. Money saved, I guess.

jturkey69

WOW..so you will be doing MOST of the work..lol...pretty simple engine wise really, just have to make sure you measure twice before ordering bearings after of course you have the crank polished should it need it, and rod ends. and installing cam bearings.

Seff

My dad's dropping it off at the shop this week. We'll see what the knowledgeable guy says when he's taken a closer look.

At this point I've begun looking for a manual transmission. 5 speed is what I'm going for.

Jamesbo

Yes, I'm sure. Protect yourself.

Seff, I now bestow upon you, Jamesbo's much coveted Great Thread award.

starfire

Seff,

Your Chassis Service Manual will help you a lot with your re-assembly, but you will also want this:

http://wildaboutcarsonline.com/cgi-b...=9920348356921

It's the Assembly Manual for 1971. Your '72 should be pretty much exactly the same as the '71. There were only minor cosmetic changes for '72.

jturkey69

Whoa!!...awesome link!!! Thanks for sharing!!...I think Im gonna need this too...lol

Seff

Jamesbo: This GREAT honor bestowed is thoroughly appreciated. Truly flattered. :P

Starfire: I'm not likely to turn down any help with this, so thank you - I'm waiting for that moment when I'm truly lost and need real help.

Seff

Heard from the shop - the crank will need to be polished, I need a new oil pump, new rockers, three new exhaust valves and new push rods. The seals on the side of the block are blown as well. He talked about replacing the camshaft as well (or maybe it was replacing the crank and polishing the cam. Will have to ask). He says it needs to be bored about 1 mm, which is ~0.040". I'm told this means I need new pistons (sounds about right) - are pistons from Rock Auto worth anything, or should I be looking for something else?

At this point I'm comparing prices between fixing this up, and finding a different engine. Olds engines are damned hard to come by, though, and she'd be all faux with a Chevy 350 under the hood. :/

EDIT: Found a 'second generation olds 350 diesel' and a rusted-up-but-running 1976 Supreme for possible replacement parts. Depending on prices for the different parts, cannibalizing the '76 might work out in my favor. I read that the '76 motor is of the more desirable kind, yes?

72 cutlass455

350 diesel was not a very good engine. The level of the rebuild depends on what you want the car to do. They sell rebuild kits with seal. Sealed power pistons from rock auto would work fine. On ebay engine master rebuild kits can be bought for $450. these include pistons gaskets freeze plugs cam and bearings they are pretty complete.

Seff

I want the car to drive, and drive well, as well as lasting for quite a while. Not asking much, am I? :P I'm not looking for mad performance, though, so I don't need a crazy racing engine. Rock Auto seems to be running low on rocker arms and other assorted things I'm told I need new ones of, which is worrying to me.

This list of parts I'm told I need:
- Pistons, .040 (maybe .050)
- Connecting rod bearings, .010 (if the standard measurement is 63,48 mm),
- Main bearings, .010 (if the standard measurement is 53,95/96 mm),
- 1 Intake valve,
- 5 Exhaust valves,
- 8 Valve guides,
- All gaskets (we knew this already, of course),
- 16 Lifters,
- 16 Push rods,
- Camshaft,
- Oilpump.

EDIT: Will I have to use an Olds cam, or will various other cams work? Olds parts are very, very scarce around here, so I'm exploring my options.

72 cutlass455

Get the master kit comes with cam oil pump 3 piece timing set all the bearing and gaskets, freeze plugs. Falcon has the kits on ebay and they do ship world wide. The other parts check out summitracing.com

Seff

Gotcha.

------
Got more work done today! Glad to be back in my routine of at least one day's work every weekend.


About as close as I'll get with the sander. Tons of little dents appear when you sand like that. The hood of this thing is about 2/3 the size of my mom's car. :P



Gave this piece more or less the finish I'm attempting to reach before sending it to the paint shop. Time vs. money spent, really, but I have the time more than the money.



Oh yeah, did the doors as well. :P




The left front fender had a cover of spackle under the numerous coats of paint, under which there were deep sanding/grinding marks and definite rust. Off it came!

jturkey69

HOLY 80 GRIT BATMAN!!!...lol..WOW..someone used some serious sandpaper....or rocks on the previous job!...yikes!..lol

Seff

I actually use 40 grit for the initial sanding, but only for the first few layers of paint. :P

oldsguybry

fun with sanding...fortunately with my 72 CS there is only two layers of paint on the car and I sanded most of that off already....I feel your pain.

Seff

Progress!


...I don't think I'll be putting this back on mah ride, for some reason.


This was a rather interesting maneuver to make single handed. No limbs were harmed in the capture of this photograph.


Apart from that WONDERFUL crack, it's in good condition. More or less. I see one bent rear member thingy, nothing major.


Sandblasting has commenced!


While I had the rear out I checked the number of rotations: 10 turns of one wheel took ~15 rotations of the driveshaft, which confused me, since I've never heard of a 1.5:1 diff. Did I do it right?

Jamesbo

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_Enyf67KTs

Seff

Yep, that's sure what I did. Weird, very weird.

GTI_Guru

Here's the math:

10 rotations of one rear wheel = 5 rotations of BOTH rear wheels.

5 rotations on the rear AXLE = 15 rotations of the driveshaft, or fairly close.

Sounds like you have a 3:08 rear end gear without a positraction unit.

If it's a tad over 3 revs of the driveshaft, it'll be a 3:08. If it's a little under (like closer to 2-3/4 revs) then it'll be a 2:73.

Make sense?

Also, Nice job on the teardown. You're doing quality work there and a LOT of it! Can't wait to see what it turns into. Also, you'll have to have an Oldsmobile specific camshaft for an olds motor. See if the one in that '76 has more salvagable parts perchance. On any rebuilt engine, it's always good to spring for the basics.

-timing chain & gear (double-roller style)
-Cam
-Lifters
-main bearings (Don't buy these til the machine work on the block is complete for correct sizing)
-rod bearings (Don't buy these til the machine work on the block is complete for correct sizing)
-piston rings (DON'T but these til you know exactly which piston will be needed. Sizing as well.)
-full gasket kit
-Oil Pump
-Water Pump


More advanced options needed when things are too worn out to reuse, or machining is needed
-Pistons
-3-angle valve job
-replacement valve guide
-Piston wrist pins

All the other hard parts should be good, but make sure to have the rods checked for wear/breakage as well.

Doind an awesome job with little/no resources there. I wish I had some spares to send ya on the cheap.

-Jeff

Seff

Hey, thanks. :P

Yeah, that makes more sense - the rear end looks original (except for shocks, which is to be expected with a 222000+ mile car), so I figured something was off. I might go count again - someone might also want to go correct the olds FAQ, since that's where I got my faulty method. :P

I shied away from the '76 when I realized that it'd most likely be just as worn as my '72, since it's the commonly worn parts that I need, it'd be no good. It also had a automatic, which made it less attractive. Still keeping my options open, though.

I was told I needed new pistons because of the .040 boring I'll have to get made. The pistons themselves had the ribs(?) on the side of the head worn off, so I suspect they were pretty worn as well. The crank will be made to .010 undersize. I'm getting the valves done already, so yeah. As you can see on the pictures, some of them are pretty bad. :P

Thanks for the advice. As I said, my first car. I'm excited.

GTI_Guru

Do you have a direct link to the FAQ you used? I'm interested in seeing what it has to say there. I'm fairly new to the site and many more people than I have probably used it successfully, so I'd like to peek at it.

-Jeff

Seff

Here, in the 'Determining Gear Ratio' section.

GTI_Guru

Just read it over, and it's correct, albeit a little hard to understand. the way I recommend is to do this.

Get the car up like they suggest, and then chalk mark the shaft & tires so you know exactly where they started (or brake drums as the case may be for you)

Spin the rear axle (both wheels) one full revolution and count the turns of the driveshaft. How ever many turns it makes is the ratio, as all rear end gears are part of a ratio that usually leaves out the x.xx:1

Make sense?

Yes, sometimes it's easier to just turn one wheel and then use more math, as long as you understand the basic concept.

-Jeff

Seff

Makes perfect sense, but that's not what the FAQ said, which confused me. Never mind, it's something like a 3.08:1, which is acceptable.

Jamesbo

IMHO,

You get a more accurate measurement turning the wheel 10 x

Seff

Even if it turns the other wheel ten times? :P

GTI_Guru

What you may want to do is once you have a list of parts that you need, post them to the parts wanted section here, describe the situation, and that you just need decent building used pieces and see what pops out of the woodwork. There may be some guys that will help you out a little cheaper on some used stuff they have lying around since the shipping is going to be ugly to get them to you. I personally think it's very cool to know there's going to be a fully functional restored one of these tooling around across the pond!

GTI_Guru

I totally agree it's more accurate to spin the axle 10x in the rear to get the exact ratio, but I have found that if you know what rear end gear should be in the car to begin with, you can pretty much nail it on the head with this method.

There weren't a lot of different gears available from the factory compared to all the aftermarket ones. If you get a funky ratio that doesn't correspond to a known gearset, then it's time to take the cover off anyway and see whatcha got in there. Could be something valuable!


-Jeff

Seff

I'll simply conduct another test tomorrow, after the sandblasting. I considered asking for used parts on here, yes, but I wondered if it would end up being more expensive due to the millions of packages I'd end up getting all of a sudden. The list of things I need for this baby is loooooong.

Appreciate all the help guys, in case I didn't say so before. Would be lost without these forums.