Pulled the trigger on FAST EZ-EFI
April 22nd, 2013, 05:27 PM
#1
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Tinley Park, IL
Posts: 824
Pulled the trigger on FAST EZ-EFI
After going back and forth for months on what to do with my fuel system, I finally made a decision.
My system was: Q-Jet built by Sparky (to old engine specs), Mallory 140 pump, Mallory regulator, -8 feed and return lines, RobbMc 1/2" pick up, new stock tank.
I will be reusing the lines, and that's it. I went with the base FAST 30226 kit (no fuel lines, pump, regulator etc), Tanks Inc EFI tank with a nice built in fuel bucket/baffle, Tanks Inc Walbro 255 pump module, their matching sending unit, FAST regulator, and the needed fittings to use my -8 lines on the pump, regulator, and fuel rails.
Part of the reason it took me so long to decide is I wasn't 'sold' on the idea of throttle body EFI and also the cost involved with having timing control, which I originally wanted. I had recently updated my ignition to full MSD with the 6AL-2 box (6530) and that has timing control built it. The timing control in that box is NOT the same timing control as a real time tuning device, and I'm aware of that. But for the small price difference over a standard 6AL, I felt it was worth it and I'm happy with my ignition system.
So that out of the way, I didn't care about timing control in my EFI system. So then the decision was which brand, and then which specific kit.
Edelbrock - too expensive.
MSD Atomic EFI - too expensive and less serviceability.
FAST EZ-EFI 2.0 - too expensive for features I don't need
Holley Avenger - this is the only one I really considered besides the FAST EZ-EFI. Mostly because it has timing control and the price was next closest to FAST. However I didn't like that the injectors are above the throttle blades, and you can't get it without a fuel system.
Once I found the FAST stuff online for $300 less than Summit from other vendors, I was sold on FAST EZ-EFI.
My main reason for wanting EFI was I simply didn't want to spend more money on the carb, and still have a carb. I've been building this car for 6 years, and I just want to get **** done and drive it. With a carb, any changes I make to my combo I'd have to then tune the carb, and I just don't want to deal with that. Ok... I wouldn't HAVE to tune the carb all the time, but I want my car to run at peak potential, so it would bug me knowing it's not running as best it could because I added a cold air intake system, or the weather changed etc. The Q-jet is in great condition, but just not tuned to my current engine. It's hard finding a local guy with a chassis dyno who is willing to work on one, and that's just another expense anyway.
So long post, longer.
I'm looking forward to not having to worry about my fuel system for a long long time. I have no plans for nitrous or boost, and if I build another NA engine I doubt it will pass the 600 HP that this system is capable of, and if I do I can just run "dual quads" EFI throttle bodies!
And, if I ever decide I want to go with MPFI, the EZ-EFI kit can be converted to that as well. Just have to set the intake up with fuel rails etc.
Here is the tank and pump I ordered: http://www.tanksinc.com/index.cfm/pa...rod/prd377.htm
Fuel pump module: http://www.tanksinc.com/index.cfm/pa...rod/prd227.htm
Got that from Matt's Classic Bowties for less than listed on the Tanks Inc site. http://www.mattsclassicbowties.com/
And got the FAST system from D&F Performance, best price I could find and most of the online FAST vendors just drop ship from FAST anyway. http://www.dfperformance.com/fastezefi.html
My system was: Q-Jet built by Sparky (to old engine specs), Mallory 140 pump, Mallory regulator, -8 feed and return lines, RobbMc 1/2" pick up, new stock tank.
I will be reusing the lines, and that's it. I went with the base FAST 30226 kit (no fuel lines, pump, regulator etc), Tanks Inc EFI tank with a nice built in fuel bucket/baffle, Tanks Inc Walbro 255 pump module, their matching sending unit, FAST regulator, and the needed fittings to use my -8 lines on the pump, regulator, and fuel rails.
Part of the reason it took me so long to decide is I wasn't 'sold' on the idea of throttle body EFI and also the cost involved with having timing control, which I originally wanted. I had recently updated my ignition to full MSD with the 6AL-2 box (6530) and that has timing control built it. The timing control in that box is NOT the same timing control as a real time tuning device, and I'm aware of that. But for the small price difference over a standard 6AL, I felt it was worth it and I'm happy with my ignition system.
So that out of the way, I didn't care about timing control in my EFI system. So then the decision was which brand, and then which specific kit.
Edelbrock - too expensive.
MSD Atomic EFI - too expensive and less serviceability.
FAST EZ-EFI 2.0 - too expensive for features I don't need
Holley Avenger - this is the only one I really considered besides the FAST EZ-EFI. Mostly because it has timing control and the price was next closest to FAST. However I didn't like that the injectors are above the throttle blades, and you can't get it without a fuel system.
Once I found the FAST stuff online for $300 less than Summit from other vendors, I was sold on FAST EZ-EFI.
My main reason for wanting EFI was I simply didn't want to spend more money on the carb, and still have a carb. I've been building this car for 6 years, and I just want to get **** done and drive it. With a carb, any changes I make to my combo I'd have to then tune the carb, and I just don't want to deal with that. Ok... I wouldn't HAVE to tune the carb all the time, but I want my car to run at peak potential, so it would bug me knowing it's not running as best it could because I added a cold air intake system, or the weather changed etc. The Q-jet is in great condition, but just not tuned to my current engine. It's hard finding a local guy with a chassis dyno who is willing to work on one, and that's just another expense anyway.
So long post, longer.
I'm looking forward to not having to worry about my fuel system for a long long time. I have no plans for nitrous or boost, and if I build another NA engine I doubt it will pass the 600 HP that this system is capable of, and if I do I can just run "dual quads" EFI throttle bodies! And, if I ever decide I want to go with MPFI, the EZ-EFI kit can be converted to that as well. Just have to set the intake up with fuel rails etc.
Here is the tank and pump I ordered: http://www.tanksinc.com/index.cfm/pa...rod/prd377.htm
Fuel pump module: http://www.tanksinc.com/index.cfm/pa...rod/prd227.htm
Got that from Matt's Classic Bowties for less than listed on the Tanks Inc site. http://www.mattsclassicbowties.com/
And got the FAST system from D&F Performance, best price I could find and most of the online FAST vendors just drop ship from FAST anyway. http://www.dfperformance.com/fastezefi.html
Last edited by Mr Nick; April 22nd, 2013 at 05:33 PM.
May 19th, 2013, 07:31 AM
#5
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Tinley Park, IL
Posts: 824
General install finally done, fired right up yesterday and let it warm up and I set the basic parameters. The one thing I read on all reviews is the amazing throttle response, and I have to agree. A quick blip of the throttle and it's instantly at 3,000 RPM.
I was having some trouble getting the idle stop screw set right while also allowing the IAC motor to do it's thing. I'll mess with that some more today, tidy up the wiring now that I know it all works and no fuel leaks, and go for a quick spin. I also need to make a clutch pedal stop before putting any real miles or hard shifts on it.
Local shop I use http://modern-muscle.com/ is having their open house next month, I may do some dyno pulls and compare them to the Q-jet.
I'll post some pictures of my install this evening.
Nick
I was having some trouble getting the idle stop screw set right while also allowing the IAC motor to do it's thing. I'll mess with that some more today, tidy up the wiring now that I know it all works and no fuel leaks, and go for a quick spin. I also need to make a clutch pedal stop before putting any real miles or hard shifts on it.
Local shop I use http://modern-muscle.com/ is having their open house next month, I may do some dyno pulls and compare them to the Q-jet.
I'll post some pictures of my install this evening.
Nick
May 22nd, 2013, 08:45 PM
#10
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Tinley Park, IL
Posts: 824
Finally some pictures:
Sending unit cut to correct length:
Tanks Inc EFI specific tank with Walbro 255 pump installed and sending unit. I had to use extensions because the -8 fittings were hitting the mounting flange. -6 line and fittings wouldn't need them.
Hooked up and ready to be bolted into place:
Pain in the butt doing this alone!
I used strips cut from the gas tank pad on the mounting straps, to help prevent scratches on the very nicely finished tank.
Sending unit cut to correct length:
Tanks Inc EFI specific tank with Walbro 255 pump installed and sending unit. I had to use extensions because the -8 fittings were hitting the mounting flange. -6 line and fittings wouldn't need them.
Hooked up and ready to be bolted into place:
Pain in the butt doing this alone!
I used strips cut from the gas tank pad on the mounting straps, to help prevent scratches on the very nicely finished tank.
May 22nd, 2013, 08:52 PM
#11
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Tinley Park, IL
Posts: 824
Cut an access hole in the trunk floor for fuel pump wires and fittings. I'll make a cover for it soon. Middle rubber hose is the vent line with remote mount rollover valve:
I'll probably make it larger so I can use a wrench on the fuel lines if needed.
Fuel pump relay, ground for relay is controlled by the FAST ECU. The bolt I'm using for the fuel pump ground has a 12ga wire on the other side which is grounded directly to the frame.
I'll probably make it larger so I can use a wrench on the fuel lines if needed.
Fuel pump relay, ground for relay is controlled by the FAST ECU. The bolt I'm using for the fuel pump ground has a 12ga wire on the other side which is grounded directly to the frame.
Last edited by Mr Nick; May 22nd, 2013 at 09:08 PM.
May 22nd, 2013, 08:57 PM
#12
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Tinley Park, IL
Posts: 824
ECU mounted behind passenger kick panel. I use A/C kicks, which have the bump out on them, and will provide plenty of room for the ECU.
Wires tucked away
Main wire harness passing to engine compartment, had to use an (expensive!) two piece grommet for this
Wires tucked away
Main wire harness passing to engine compartment, had to use an (expensive!) two piece grommet for this
May 22nd, 2013, 09:06 PM
#13
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Tinley Park, IL
Posts: 824
Throttle body and fuel pressure regulator. Going to spend some time in the future making the wiring look nicer. 4 injectors, TPS, IAC motor, IAT sensor, water temp sensor, MAF... lots of stuff to try and make look pretty.
Close up of 2 piece grommet and FPR.
No road time time, the fuel rails hit the base on my drop air cleaner. Picked up a spacer today and hopefully will get it in the road for a test run tomorrow.
I got the idle issue figured out, I just re-ran the self set up for idle and TPS and was able to get it configured spot on. Next I'll program the MSD box with the curve I want, currently locked out at 34*.
I'm so close I can smell the burning rubber!!!
Any questions, feel free to ask!
Close up of 2 piece grommet and FPR.
No road time time, the fuel rails hit the base on my drop air cleaner. Picked up a spacer today and hopefully will get it in the road for a test run tomorrow.
I got the idle issue figured out, I just re-ran the self set up for idle and TPS and was able to get it configured spot on. Next I'll program the MSD box with the curve I want, currently locked out at 34*.
I'm so close I can smell the burning rubber!!!
Any questions, feel free to ask!
May 23rd, 2013, 09:34 PM
#16
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Tinley Park, IL
Posts: 824
Put about 20 miles on it this evening, I could feel a few rough spots but it has to self learn what to do under all conditions. On the way back home tonight it was only 50* out and when I fired it up, it ran a little rough for a minute, because I had never ran it when when the air temps where that low.
I basic kit is around $1,600, then the tank, in-tank pump, sending unit and FPR added another few hundred. You can do it for less if you use the master kit with in-line pump, but I wanted an in-tank pump.
So far I'm very happy.
I basic kit is around $1,600, then the tank, in-tank pump, sending unit and FPR added another few hundred. You can do it for less if you use the master kit with in-line pump, but I wanted an in-tank pump.
So far I'm very happy.
June 1st, 2013, 04:56 PM
#17
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Tinley Park, IL
Posts: 824
Minor update:
Have about 50 more miles on it now, all is going well. I'm noticing that it runs smoother each time I take it out.
Two minor issues I need to look into:
The battery died after a couple days of sitting, not sure why. I didn't leave the lights on but I may have accidentally left the door open overnight while working on it. I charged it and have checked voltage daily since then and no problems.
Stinks and smokes at idle like it's running very rich, but the handheld unit says it's on target with a 13.8:1 idle AFR. Makes me think I have an exhaust leak upstream of the O2 and the overlap of the cam and lower RPM's pulls some fresh air (O2) in making the sensor read lean and thus unnecessarily richen up the mixture. But... I also still have my timing locked at 34* and that could be a partial cause to poor idle. If the weather cooperates I'll load a curve onto the MSD box tomorrow and test it out.
Have about 50 more miles on it now, all is going well. I'm noticing that it runs smoother each time I take it out.
Two minor issues I need to look into:
The battery died after a couple days of sitting, not sure why. I didn't leave the lights on but I may have accidentally left the door open overnight while working on it. I charged it and have checked voltage daily since then and no problems.
Stinks and smokes at idle like it's running very rich, but the handheld unit says it's on target with a 13.8:1 idle AFR. Makes me think I have an exhaust leak upstream of the O2 and the overlap of the cam and lower RPM's pulls some fresh air (O2) in making the sensor read lean and thus unnecessarily richen up the mixture. But... I also still have my timing locked at 34* and that could be a partial cause to poor idle. If the weather cooperates I'll load a curve onto the MSD box tomorrow and test it out.
June 27th, 2013, 01:24 PM
#19
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Tinley Park, IL
Posts: 824
Yes I do! The stinky and smokey idle was a non-baffled PCV valve because I changed the valve covers at the same time as installation of the EFI kit. I swapped to a baffled grommet and Mopar style breather, problem solved.
It starts and runs great, my only issue is coming to a light the RPM's drop below the idle setting then it catches itself and brings it back to normal idle speed. It has never died doing this, so I'm not very concerned. This only happens if I downshift and allow it to engine brake a little, then put it in neutral with my foot off the gas. My only theory is that the ECU sees an RPM signal over idle speed during engine braking, so it totally closes the IAC motor. Then I suddenly depress the clutch and RPM drops and the IAC motor can't open fast enough to hold it at idle speed, and the RPM's go to about 700 before idling at my setting of 850.
Overall I'm very happy with it, if/when I build another car it will have EFI for sure. Possibly another basic kit, or port EFI with timing control etc. Depends on what's out at the time and my budget.
I do with the handheld screen were a little nicer to look at, as it would be cool to mount it to a bracket like a GPS unit would be, for use while racing or tuning. But for the price, I'm not complaining.
Any specific questions you had?
It starts and runs great, my only issue is coming to a light the RPM's drop below the idle setting then it catches itself and brings it back to normal idle speed. It has never died doing this, so I'm not very concerned. This only happens if I downshift and allow it to engine brake a little, then put it in neutral with my foot off the gas. My only theory is that the ECU sees an RPM signal over idle speed during engine braking, so it totally closes the IAC motor. Then I suddenly depress the clutch and RPM drops and the IAC motor can't open fast enough to hold it at idle speed, and the RPM's go to about 700 before idling at my setting of 850.
Overall I'm very happy with it, if/when I build another car it will have EFI for sure. Possibly another basic kit, or port EFI with timing control etc. Depends on what's out at the time and my budget.
I do with the handheld screen were a little nicer to look at, as it would be cool to mount it to a bracket like a GPS unit would be, for use while racing or tuning. But for the price, I'm not complaining.
Any specific questions you had?
July 4th, 2013, 08:35 AM
#22
Registered User
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Tinley Park, IL
Posts: 824
Still playing with this, I have the AFR's where I think they should be, according to butt and sound dyno. Will mess with that at the track or dyno when time/money allows.
Been tinkering with the programmable MSD 6530 now, this engine likes timing coming in quick! At first I had all the timing in by 3,000 but it didn't sound clean and pulled a little rough if I accelerated from low 2,000 RPM range, in say 3rd or 4th gear. I changed my timing curve to be all in with 35* by 2,300, with an inital setting of 23*. Feels better but I think it wants more, or I need to tweek the AFR a bit. As of now, I do NOT have any vac advance, I need to purchase a MAP sensor for that and then build a curve. I have a feeling when I do that, I'll have to make the mechanical curve slightly less aggressive, so it's not over advanced at low load/low RPM situations.
Been tinkering with the programmable MSD 6530 now, this engine likes timing coming in quick! At first I had all the timing in by 3,000 but it didn't sound clean and pulled a little rough if I accelerated from low 2,000 RPM range, in say 3rd or 4th gear. I changed my timing curve to be all in with 35* by 2,300, with an inital setting of 23*. Feels better but I think it wants more, or I need to tweek the AFR a bit. As of now, I do NOT have any vac advance, I need to purchase a MAP sensor for that and then build a curve. I have a feeling when I do that, I'll have to make the mechanical curve slightly less aggressive, so it's not over advanced at low load/low RPM situations.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
72cuttys
General Questions
23
March 28th, 2014 04:14 PM
