w-30dreamin

I am getting ready to give my car an oil change.No more off the shelf at the local parts store stuff for me.I want protection for my 100,000 mile stock flat tappet cam.

Have determined through threads here on the board,I will be using wix filters from Napa from now on.

What do you guys recommend as far as oil and or zinc additives?
I would prefer conventional oils,no synthetics.

thanks

InfoJunkie

Does this mean NAPA is not a local parts store?

Wix is a good choice for filters.
Thread on oil preference.
It seems Rotella 15W40 is a common choice.

w-30dreamin

Napa isn't a local parts store for me. AutoZone and Advance Auto are within a few miles from my house.The nearest Napa is about 10 miles...see,it's not local.

Thanks for the link to the oil thread.I did a search and came up empty handed. I need to refine my search talents.

Kyle's 77 Cutlass

prefer conventional oils,no synthetics. How come not synthetics?

InfoJunkie

There ia also Hyperlube which is a zinc replacement additive. We have sold a quite a few bottles at work but I haven't heard any feedback on it yet.

mlouderback

I use Valvoline Premium Blue 15-40 diesel oil. It has more zinc and phosphorus than any other conventional oil. I think NAPA even has this as an in store generic that is the same thing but says NAPA instead of Valvoline. For $1.00 more I would just buy the Valvoline and be sure.

Kyle's 77 Cutlass

What about this Royal Purple Motor oil?

auto_editor

All manufacturers will (and do) say that what's in your owner's manual is what you should use, and that if the recommended weights and SFI certifications are there that's all that really matters.

But even since 1989 (B-Year for my 'Cruiser) there have been many advances in oil technology, including widespread availability of synthetics, blends and "extra" oils (extra mileage, extra life, etc.).

I spoke to a GM engineer about this (from Cadillac, as Olds was long dead), and he said that the weight and SFIs are all you should go by, and that you should never, EVER "add" anything to oil as the oil has everything in it your engine needs already.

In fact, sticking with the "old" (Olds?) stuff is the way to go with most things, including gasoline as ethanol is bery, BERY bad for engine "systems" not designed to use it.

I brought this up with Pennzoil and Valvoline engineers as well, and they--after pimping their latest and greatest--admitted that for older cars there is no advantage to using "specialized oils" in "older vehicles."

[The analogy I like to use is "Excedrin for Migraines" as it is EXACTLY THE SAME MEDICINE as "regular" Excedrin, just in a fancier box.]

So that's the "official" line, for what it's worth. I have been furiously researching this subject as my 307 is making "scary bottom-end noises" and I wanted to give it every lubrication "advantage" I could to eke out a few more miles.

[And if every major oil company--against its very nature--answers you with a general shrug and "sorry", it makes that horrible answer that much more believable...]

72xw30

What about - "The Green Oil" , By Brad Penn! Any ideas on this.


http://www.bradpennracing.com/



When I purchased my 69w30 the previous owner said to use this oil as that is what he had used in it.

Any benefits in using this Green Oil?

Thanks in advance

67 Cutlass Freak

Opinions on this are like a--holes. Everyone has one. Here's mine. When it comes to viscosity you'll need to consider the ambient air temperature your vehicle is to be used in. A lot of folks like to run 15w40 or 20w50 in their race cars because they feel it gives them better oil pressure and protection. This is not always the case. Our ancient V-8s should run well with 10w30 or 10w40. Most of the wear and tear on your engine occurs within the first thirty seconds of firing it up when the internal engine components have not gotten oil coverage. Thinner oils help with faster oil delivery. If your running 20w50 to hide a clearance issue, knocking, or low oil pressure you should repair your engine. I also agree that addatives are not needed unless you are breaking in your cam. Zinc is needed then. Napa sells racing oil, not for street use, with the addative in it. You should contact your machinist to find out what he recomends for your engine. You might also want to check with your local parts store for a Wix filter that has been repackaged in their house boxing. Napa and Bumper to Bumper does this. They also may have two lines of quality Wix filters ie: gold and silver for Napa. They are both made by Wix. Their's really only a couple of different oil refineries supplying everybody with oil. The difference comes in with the addatives those companies put in. It more or less comes down to how well does the company stand behind their product. Penzoil is one of the best. They also own Quaker State. Valvoline is also very good. I have not had good luck with Castrol. It seems to break down too fast. When it's drained out for the oil change, it looks like water running out. That's like opposite to their advertising. I haven't used Royal Purple so I can't comment. I do know some quickee oil change places use recycled oil that has been refined again. They say that oil never really goes bad. If you could filter it well enough and keep thinning agents, like fuel out, you probably would never have to change your oil. I really like synthetic oil, but it's not for everyone. For most vehicles you should break in your engine with conventional motor oil and then switch over after 5-10K miles. That is, unless your car came from the factory with synthetic motor oil. You should not switch back and forth between the two. I use synthetic oil in all my vehicles except my race car. I get better gas mileage with it, there's less wear and tear internally, and I go 5000 miles between oil changes. I do not recomend switching over to synthetic for higher mileage cars or anyone that has even minor oil leaks. That stuff is so slick it will find it's way out of your engine. I've been working in the auto industry for a long time, and I've seen alot of engines gummed up by Slick 50. If you realy want to use an addative make sure you mix it up well before dumping it into your engine. I have seen Sea Foam and some other products that are real thin, actually work very well for freeing up a sticky lifter. We put the addative in and run for 5-10 minutes @ 2000 RPM, and then drain it out for normal oil change. I hope this information might help you to find the right oil for your vehicle.

442much

Wow! That's pretty much the exact conversation I had today with the guy who's rebuilding my 455. Wix and or Napa Gold filters NOT Fram. Synthetic oil (he uses Mobile 1) but not for the break in, Dino oil for that. I feel better about picking this guy to redo my engine now, even though he came with references. He also said that I should go with seals and gaskets that are either built in Canada or the US. He warned me about cheaper Chinese and Indian products. Thanks for sharing your expertise.

sparky44268

my engine builder suggested joe gibbs hotrod oil , high phosphrous and zinc for conventional flat tappit engines.

71 Cutlass

Amsoil and Wix filter

ziff396

I am running 10/40 royal purple in my 455 with 2 oz of Lucas zinc additive for added insurance. Expensive? Yes. But its only 1 time a year for me. Also a Wix gold. Did a 6300 rpm burnout last fall (stupid, and last time) however everything is fine to date. I also pulled the dual gate back to the right instead of the left once to downshift into 2nd @ 40 mph and hit 1st. The tach went off the wall! Still (to date) running great.

MDchanic

The Porsche people call that a "money shift" - You intend to go 5 to 4, but go 5 to 2 instead. Engine hits 9,000 RPM in almost exactly the amount of time it takes to say "S_IT!!!" and valves and pistons get a little too friendly.

Pretty much the only way you can blow a motor that's got a rev-limiter.

Your nickname should be "Lucky."

- Eric

442_Mustang

I run Brad Penn in mine. Only got about 2000 miles on it since this build but I have not heard of a failure using this stuff. Plus, my dyno shop that sells it is about 2 blocks from my work. I know Wix filters aren't as easy to come by so I currently have a Fram but that will be gone very soon. The parts stores are reluctant to stock filters for Oldsmobile anymore. Plus, I had to deal with a specialty vendor for all of my brake needs too.

w-30dreamin

Thanks to all who have contributed with all this great info.

Makes it easier to make my choice.

Kyle's 77 Cutlass

Thanks for the info, I am considering this oil

63 F85 Cutlass

Valvoline makes a conventional oil with zinc called VR1 Racing Oil. It comes in 50, 10-30, and 20-50. Im pretty sure the only reason they call it racing oil b/c its not the friendliest thing for catalytic converters, but that wouldn't be a problem for many of us. I know at Advance Auto where i work we stock the 50 and 20-50, but for one reason or another not the 10-30, but i found a few sources that do. Im going to give it a try on my next change, anybody tried it?

w-30dreamin

The Valvoline vr-1 seems to be pretty popular among the guys with racing or high performance engines.

w-30dreamin

Sorry,I meant to answer your question earlier and it slipped my mind.

I have heard a lot of stories about people switching to synthetic oil and all of a sudden leaks spring up. They say the thinner oil finds all the leaks.

My engine is a stock 350 with just over 100,000 miles and only ever had the valve cover gaskets and intake gasket changed. Don't want to experience leaks.

Nilsson

This is all I use, most part stores can and will order the 10-30 (which I use) for you by the case. Good oil and the price is reasonable.

Destructor

Castor oil

D. Yaros

Brad Penn oil is specifically forumlated with the proper zinc content for old rides.

oldcutlass

The VR - oils have way less detergents in them and the zddp is bad for converters and sensors. That is why they are listed not for street use!!

mmurphy77

I used the VR1 this last oil change because of the High Zinc (as much as 1400 ppm which I've read is optimal). I, somewhat reluctantly, went with the 20W-50 due to availability but since it's never started below 65 degrees (and is usually operated from 80-100 degrees ambient) I think it'll be fine.

toro68

I have been using Mobil 1 on the gold W-34 since 2004. For 2011 I am going to use Amzoil (more zinc).

Nilsson

There are two versions of VR1 oils with one being marked not legal for street use.

jpc647

I just use Mobil Clean 5000 10-40. Maybe I shouldn't but I'm not spending an extra $10 for an oil change, or having to order special oil. Sorry. But I've only got a stock 72 350, nothing high performance about it, except how much gas it burns.

Higgins

This is an interesting article. www.classiccarmotoroil.com The Valvoline VR1 seems to be equivalent and probably more available locally.
Higgins

oldcutlass

The not for racing use VR oil actually has more zddp than the street use!!

citcapp

The guy who is building my 455 for the 48 recommends this oil. I have only looked at the site and have not studied the products.

http://www.joegibbsdriven.com/index.html

coltsneckbob

And who is going to check? Frankly, considering that there are so few older cars that would benefit (if even only a little) I don't see why such older cars are not grandfathered. This includes using leaded gas.

My engine is all stock and I run 3:1 (leaded racing fuel, with premium unleaded). I don't think anyone can tell nor cares. I get the leaded fuel from Raceway Park in NJ. Now the cars racing there probably burn more leaded gas in an hour then I will burn all driving season. On any given Saturday you'll find upwards of 100 cars racing.....for small trophies or just bragging rights.

Nilsson

The VR1 not for street use has no detergents so it is not suitable for steet machines. The steet use VR1 has more then enough zddp for performance street machines but less detergents then conventional oils. I change my oil every 2500-3000 miles and the motor is as clean as new.

MDchanic

I don't think they mean "Legal" as in "Legal."

I think they mean "Legal" as in "We could get in trouble if we told you this stuff was okay for your catalytic converter car and the cat got wrecked."

I could be wrong, though.

Similarly, I don't think it's illegal for you to run your car on leaded gas, just that it's not legal for the gas station to sell you leaded fuel to put in it.
Different, for instance, from "running on red," or filling your truck's tank with red-dyed, untaxed home heating fuel. If you get caught for that, you can get a big fine, predicated on the assumption that you've been doing it and avoiding the taxes, since you've owned the vehicle. I've never heard of weigh-station checks for leaded fuel, though.

- Eric

coltsneckbob

MD,

I could be wrong, but last year when I purchased some leaded fuel one of the other fellas there told me it was illegal to run the car on the street. I checked the EPA website and I tend to think that it is illegal. However, there is nothing that I could find there about enforcement.

Bayou Olds

First, to break in your FLAT TAPPET engine you NEED to use conventional oil. I am told that the synthetic oils are not penetrating and that is why you use conventional for break in. But you have 100K on it. In the mid 90s the EPA decided that Zinc was a bad thing and began to have oil companies remove it from motor oil. The problem is zinc is a needed metal to metal lubricant on flat tappet cams. ZDDP can and should be added in synthetic oil (which has no zinc) or you can use an oil that still has it, such as those mentioned or Rotella. Failure to add zinc can result in premature cam failure. The year of your car (at least pictured) means you do not have to worry about converters. Just take care of it and keep it on the road.

Bayou Olds

I've run Av gas, which is leaded. FBO told me he could sell it to me because my car is pre unleaded only. If he is right great, if not well I will plead ignorance.

MDchanic

Yeah, that's my take on it, too.

It's illegal for the oil companies to SELL leaded for use on public roads (but not for racing, boats, or airplanes), and illegal for drivers to disregard the "Unleaded Fuel Only" label on their gas gauges and filler doors, defeat the nozzle-blocking filler opening, and put leaded gas into "unleaded" cars.

Our cars fit into a grey area where there is no rule specifically making it illegal for us to BURN leaded fuel (like, let's say, if we'd stockpiled it), but where there isn't supposed to be any leaded fuel left for us to burn.

... Or so I believe.

- Eric

442much

I wonder about Amsoil. My engine builder has mentioned Amsoil and said it is a good oil. I have a question.

If you are building your engine using modern cams and components, didn't the manufactures of these new engine parts take the lack of zink in modern oils in effect? I mean a cam for a 455 Olds will not work in a V8 Aurora so these cams are specifically made for old cars. Knowing this, you'd think that the new grinds would be made to handle lower levels of zink, just like the cams in newer cars can handle it.