craftsman1956

I brought my 72 cutlass to sears for an alignment and to put on 4 new tires I bought on the internet.Should a car owner just let them do what they want and how they want,or am I,as the owner,someone who can and should take charge on how my car is treated ? I worked for GM for several years in auto body and painting starting in 74, then had my own shop for many years.I feel I its my right to say for example,to use a fender guard while working under the hood and not to lean too hard on the body parts.I gave the guy the papers I copied from the shop manual on the front end specs,and I saw him throw them back in my car and never looked at or used them.It shakes at times in town driving.The fender has 3 scratches on top,and when I walked out to watch for awhile,I heard the fender pop when he pushed on the side!I saw the trim rings face down on the ramp and the painted rims are scratched where the wrench was used to tighten the nuts,and he used a power wrench to screw in the center cap screws full speed.When I walked in the shop to talk to the 2 guys working on my car,about the above things,they didn't like what I had to say and customers don't tell them how to do their job.I didn't say any more so something worse would not happen to my car.I guess I feel that with all my years in the automotive area,all the restorations,,from now on I am going to have a polite talk with who ever may work on my car,there is just too many people who don't know enough about respect for others to care for my car.Back in 76 at the GM dealership,I heard the top mechanic talking,saying he was wondering who he could trust with his cars when hes too old to still work on them himself,,now I know what he was talking about.

lshlsh2

I try to do my own work but some stuff is beyond me. I have a good repair shop near me small and independent. He also is a car buff. Old buicks mostly. I would look for a small independent shop rather than a large chain. If you are in a car club ask around. There are good ones around but you have to look hard. I think I would have taken my car away when he through the papers back in the car. But hindsight is always 20/20.

Larry

rocketraider

Quit bullshitting around with the hired help and go straight to the shop manager, and to the Sears store manager or higher if needed. If you have to show your hindparts, do it, and invite them to repair the damage. You might be amazed what a letter on a legal firm's letterhead can accomplish.

You need to compare the alignment printout they used to what the shop manual calls out. I can about guarantee you their computer did not have the 72 specs in it and they guessed at it, or worse used specs for a later car that the geometry is different. I'd have stopped the job right then and there when the guy tossed the alignment specs out, and made him show me the specs he planned to use.

There is NO excuse for not treating a customer's car with respect. I'm paying you to do something, you will do it to my standards or not do it at all. You get independent on me, you will find out just what an ******* I can be. I guess I'm lucky most people stand up when a 6'4' 230 lb ******* with fire in his eyes speaks his mind.

coltsneckbob

I see this attitude time and time again. Not just with car repair, but everywhere. Its like the worker feels he doesn't get paid enough to do a good job. Well, to that I say you are the one who chose this job....either because u thought u liked it or couldn't do better.........so don't complain. This is why I do so much of my home repair, and car repair myself.

sx455raidercelticfan

i would file a complaint with sears!! the problem with shops like sears is they have 1 certified mechanic and the rest are non certified cheap hourly workers there job is 2 wrench and labor for the head mechanic, quality service in 2010 is very hard 2 find and when you find a good shop it costs a arm and a leg!! I DONT TRUST ANY1 TO WORK ON MY CARS!!!

geckonz08

And that along with freddie n fanny is part reason why the chinese have spied n taken an opening. Excuse the politics .I too get very pi%$ed off at shoddy workmanship or, even worse ,knowingly shoddy workmanship.
No question in my mind ;drop a letter of complaint with all times dates etc to the Sear`s manager .No joy there, go up the ladder.
mike

craftsman1956

Even though I have over 30 years into auto work,I can not do it all.But I will speak my mind to let them know my background,and show my Mr.Goodwrench award and pin,pictures.Its like parts stores and salvage yards,they treat me like I'm a kid,then I speak up and tell them what I've done since 74 and they back down and just give me what I ask for,but I do it in a nice way.Yes,I should have taken my car out then,but I had 2 shows that weekend,and they were the only shop open fri night.I went back and talked to the manager who defended the workers.I have worked on and restored more 70's cars than any guy in the local shops,just listen to me and do what I want done,my way,I am just buying the labor.I will be strong willed in the future,but not a jerk.Someone here said I shouldn't complain,well,I expect perfect quality work when I pay out for it.I went to a local gm dealership to check the alignment,I got the car back with 13 scratches in the drivers door,they were not there when I polished the car before going to the dealer.I am at a loss for words.Thanks for the replys!

gearheads78

If you have to take your car to a place like that talk to the manager first and explain how much you value your car and its treatment. If you agrees to take special car proceed and watch that he does. If he does not seem receptive or responsive to your request then drive off and and find someone that does.

442much

Every year I have to take my 442 in to get the tranny oil changed so it is still gauranteed for life. When I pull up I get out and I keep the keys. The guy says that he needs the keys to drive the car in. I tell him that's fine. He can also pop the hood, BUT I WILL OPEN IT, AND I WILL CLOSE IT. I also tell him to check out the fenders. He walks over and I say "I just want to point out that there are no scratches. I don't want to get the car painted again EVEN IF I WON"T HAVE TO PAY FOR IT." Nudge, nudge wink, wink. He gets the hint as do others.

It's your car, and your money. I've been told that due to insurance, I can't stand inside the bay. So I go to places where I can stand outside with the car 5 feet away. Now, I'm not a hard ***, but I won't be talked too like they are doing me a favour. I'll ask for the owner if I need to.

I do tell them that I am a president of a car club after they've commented on my car. Lots of members, lots of potential business. I also tell places that I'm looking for shops that do good work on older cars so I can tell my members. Boy, do I get good service. Try that one. It works great.

Bluevista

Those driver's door scratches are usually from 2 post lifts and opening the door and bashing into it or climbing a ladder and leaning into the car when it's up on a rack.
I take my regular cars to a little two horse shop, real mechanics and and they own the place.
It doesn't happen very often because I take care of the brakes and all the normal maintenance , otherwise my horrible post-2000 American cars rarely need anything for some reason?
I can watch them if I want but if I knew what they were doing I would of done it myself so what's the sense.
That insurance regulation thing is there for when they don't want you watching, the big places have to be careful because they have people fishing for lawsuits but any smaller shop lets you if you aren't a problem and you're cool about it.

In nearly 40 years of working on old cars the only thing I've ever let anybody ever do mechanically to any of them are wheel alignments. You can do them yourself but with the computerized alignment it's so much better and they use all four wheels so everythings checked, get a printout of before and after.
My painter guy does some mechanical work and has a nice alignment machine, lets me hang around and help so I watch closely.
I did take fender covers and had him use them for the Vista. I know he should know better and would know how to fix it since he painted it if he did any damage but why take the chance. I cover all the bases just in case, better to be safe than sorry.
I took the book and the specs in too and he told me he didn't need them, just the registration card for the VIN, mostly so he didn't have to walk over and read them off the dash.
If they have a Sun or other type computerized alignment machine the specs are entered into the machine using the VIN number, it knew what my '71 Vista was and had all the specs soon as he did it. I don't know how far back they're database of alignment specifications go but it's at least to '71.
If it's anything like the exhaust pipe bending places they can go back into the early 20th century and bend up systems for nearly anything.
They don't use the same alignment specs as the book anymore anyway, newer type tires and other factors have changed things a little from what I could see.

I don't let anybody touch my cars unless I could trust them with my wife and kids, even more importantly... my dogs.

firefrost gold

HELL Yes you do . I try to check around and use a shop that works on rods a classics but it dosent hurt to pre tip and to let the people you entrust to do the work for you that You are my guy and I picked You as my guy to do my work becouse You are the Man and I found some upfront pro words lets them know that I expect good things I went to a shop a month agoe that I heard good things about I spent over a hour to get a estimet for a mufler and tail pipe cam back with a list of your car need I smiled said that was a wast of time I need a muffler and left went a got parts at napa and did it my self will never go back .

cutlassgal

YES YOU HAVE A RIGHT!!!! When I took Teepo to this Goodyear to have her oil changed last year, I told the guy I would pull her in, and I did. Then I stood by the door and watched the mechanic's every move. I backed her out when he was done. The guys at Defer, where I usually go, handle her with kid gloves. I've been dealing with them for years on all my cars. But she only goes there for oil changes, tires, etc.. I watch them like hawks also, even though I've been going there forever.

Don Sitts has old cars himself and sponsers a lot of our shows and cruise in's around here, so I take her there for major stuff because they are familiar with the oldies. I sure pay for it too, but it's worth it.

Then I am fortunate enough to live close to Blue also, which is a blessing!! Teepo bonded with him while he was painting her engine, and he is kind enough to help me. I know he is careful and trustworthy.... though she did hear some language she hadn't heard before.... "Excuse me, suh???"

NorTown Olds

SORRY to hear of your experience!! EVERY Car Guy and Gals Nightmare!!! ugh! whAT TOWN in Wisconsin was this>? I want to be sure to never got there if I'm up there visiting!! What a shame! I do lots of research too for those rare times when others HAVE to do the work; but I look for other "Classics" out back or on the rack before I darken the doorway and I always "interview the manager" or head mechanic before they get any of my cars. I always ask if they can keep it inside IF over night etc. etc. IF they don't seem accomodating or to understand what my rides mean to me, I go elsewhere; BUT you were really stuck w/ those shows the next day; I always watch the workers like a hawk too and I ignore those "Customers MUST wait in the lounge" signs! LOL! GOOD luck complaining to Sears Upper Management and at the store...keep us posted.

my72vert

I just had to chime in when I read of your experience. I'm a Harley tech and believe me when I tell you that the customer is very demanding, and rightfully so. My job is to repair their bike to their expectations no matter how crazy their request is. Their bikes are just as important to them as our cars are to us. You as the customer have every right to have the repair done right and with the professionalism you deserve and are paying for. Never expect anything less. What this shop owner might not realize is a bad experience for one customer can cost him dearly. All you have to do is tell everyone you know of the poor service. When word gets around of the crappy service, maybe he will realize he has to make some changes. Do what Cutlassgal does and find a place that has the same interest and respect for your car as you do. I'm glad it was'nt me if you know what I mean.

Nilsson

First off you went to Sears, secondly you came draging in your own tires to have installed. That is like going to Valvoline instant oil change with your own Quakerstate oil and filter to have that installed. You pissed these guys off from the get go. As for the wheel shake sometimes look for other problems other then the alignment.

Back to the Sears part, I would never take lawn mower to Sears let alone my car.

NorTown Olds

LOL! That's exactly what my buddy said last night as I read this unfortunate "True Story" to him in his living room about Sears! Oh well, SOME of them can be good; but I always try to "interview" them or check them out BEFORE I pull any of my cars in for them...usually they're ameniable to helping me out. I've brought my own tires in to places before; but only after I've established that 1. Their store CAN'T stock or special order the tires I need/WANT and 2. after I've usually bought other things in there or have my customer base established there so that there's "no hard feelings..." we get your point no doubt though!

BlackGold

I haven't spent a dime at Sears in over 25 years. That was the day I brought my car to them with a dead Diehard -- a 4-year battery with less than 3 years on it. I was a poor student at the time. Despite the fact I had a receipt, the store manager insisted (based on the date code) that the battery in my car was more than 4 years old and therefore out of warranty. She accused me of trying to scam them, saying that the receipt must be for a different battery.

I'll usually forgive one bad retail experiece before blacklisting a place, but when they accuse me of theft, they've lost a customer for life.

my72vert

Years ago the thought of bringing your own parts to have them installed was unheard of. But today its becoming more acceptible. I Install lots of non Harley parts parts for my customers. Of course the pay the appropriate labor. My point being, if a shop wants your business and the business of others who have heard about their professionalism, they will accomodate their customers. There's lots of places where I can spend my money. If the shop wont provide a service I expect. I can go elsewhere. Their loss.

Indy_68_S

Gotta agree here. If you really must use Sears (or anyplace else generic liike this) for something like this, I'd talk to them prior to bringing in the car & tires. Judge their attitude. If its acceptable, get assurances.

A little face time prior to the job goes a long ways toward them respecting you stuff.

That said - I've gotten to the point where I'll fix damn near everything because it seems like no matter where I go, they
1. Rarely do what I requested and plainly explained
2. Don't do it correctly
3. Mess up something else while they're fumbling with the primary work
4. Mis-diagnose what they screwed up
5. Refuse to acknowledge even obvious issues with the service/work

I've done numerous time consuming & difficult repairs on our vehicles (waterpump, front wheel bearings, etc.. on a VR6 Jetta for example) that I really didn't want to do just to avoid headaches and know that the job was done right.

The only service I get worth anything these days is at small 1-2 (usually older) man specialty shops like radiator repair, etc.. where I talk to the actual person doing the work.

auto_editor

I hate to say it (OK, I "don't like" to say it), but without Craftsman tools (and maybe Die Hard batteries) Sears would have no reason to exist. Funny how the potentially-costly tool-replacement program turned out to be such a boon for them. I'm chiming in because of a recent experience I had.

I took my CRAFTSMAN snow-thrower (a gift, not bought by me) into a Sears service shop for repairs and had to GO ON EBAY MYSELF TO BUY THE REPAIR KIT THEY NEEDED!

'Nuff said.

coltsneckbob

I have looked at tires online, but there really is no deal to be had. This past spring I went to a Firestone shop to get the Indy 500s put on. I called them and told them what I could find online with respect to their own brand and others (BF Goodrich). They said print out the price and bring it in and they will beat it. Well, I did and they did by $5 per tire (x4) and that included the mounting and balancing. On top of that there was NO SHIPPING. So, when you put it all together I saved about $65 simply by asking and negotiating.

Incidentally, when they came to pull my car into the bay I politely warned the guy that the car was old and tricky and please be careful. He appreciated the friendly tone I think and was indeed very careful. I also causually mentioned that I was a pretty good mechanic. I then stood outside the bay while they worked.

One other thing........before the guy started work I tipped him $5 and said I needed a good job. He smiled and said you got it. In fact he even cleaned my rims. When he balanced each tire he re-checked the balance on each one. When I left I told him I appreciated the attention to detail and gave him another $5.

It works both ways.

Indy_68_S

This does work, and I've done this in the past. Dollars aside, even some polite & friendly conversation goes a long way. The problem these days is that you rarely have contact with the person actually doing the work. At stealerships you typically deal with the dreaded 'service advisor' who's only 2 functions are to try to sell you uneeded/unwanted service and cover the azz of the stealership when they inevitably screw up.

MDchanic

Yeah, I'm about to put myself in this situation, and I'd rather not.
I like the snow tires I've got on my little German car right now.
In fact, I've bought them twice.
When I went shopping for them the third time this month, I went to the local guys first, and they said they couldn't get them, so I checked online. Turns out, they're discontinued, and were on closeout at a great price from a banner advertiser here.
So now, I've gotta go to a local place and smooth it over and feel dumb because I know it's no bargain to buy online unless you've got access to a tire machine (which I once did), or you're buying discontinued tires dirt cheap.
But I still look like a schmuck.

- Eric

bil

Sears has really gone downhill on the goods and especially service.And unless the tools say Craftsman,the lifetime warranty doesn't apply. My friend John and I were banned from the sears in Santa Monica,they even called the cops when we complained about the service and wanted to talk to the manager.The place sucks compared to what it used to be. ---bil

71 Cutlass

I feel that anyone you pay to do work for you, no matter what kind of work it is, is hired help, just like a maid is hired help.This being the case, you have the right to tell them anything you want, period.

coltsneckbob

Well, I assume within reason. Meaning that you have a right to demand a good job and even state what you expect done and how you expect it done. But, you cannot abuse the person.

71 Cutlass

Who said anything about abuse?

coltsneckbob

LOL well just making sure.........though I might pay extra if I can

cwracer

I have only used Sears auto twice in two different states. Both times they damaged my car. Once was my new (to my wife) Cadillac STS. They lifted the car from the corner of the fender, warping the entire piece. After a year of fighting they finally agreed to pay half the damages, stating they are only half responsible. It was a take it or leave it and continue to fight offer, so I took it. I guess I was half responsible, I trusted Sears.

NEVER TRUST ANY SEARS AUTOMOTIVE!!!!!!

coltsneckbob

How could they be only half responsible?? Thus, implying because u had to pay 1/2 that YOU are also half responsible. I hate this BS'ing screw the customer cause we're bigger attitude.

I've never lost a battle with a company over something like this, but then that's perhaps because I try and do so many things myself.....from a faucet washer to household pumping/electric to front end rebuilds.

No company is immune to this kinda attitude. Last year I picked up my new Mercedes GL. It was very waxed (with that liquid crap) when I got there. A month or 2 later and after a few rain showers I noticed buff marks all over the hood and some on fenders. I thought some jealous jerk at work was sand papering my car. After consultation with an independent paint specialist it was determined that the scuffs were from steelwool and were done to remove tree sap. At first the MB dealer refused to repair it claiming they wouldn't have done that. However, after visiting their lot I found other cars with the sap on it (most had that paper hood cover, but some did not). A day later they agreed to repair - my guess is they asked the boy who prepped the cars how he removed the sap LOL! They never admitted guilt, but I am sure they knew they did it.

71 Cutlass

Great post!

Of course the answer to the question you posed is simple...anyone who would come up with that kind of "BS'ing" (as you put it), is an imbecile.

MDchanic

... or a genius.

- Eric

71 Cutlass

Ha, that's pretty clever ...I'm just having difficulty mentally processing Sears mechanic and genius in the same sentence

MDchanic

I'm still stuck at "Sears" and "mechanic."