griffey57

So much for the president saying all electric by 2030 which I didn't think was going to happen anyway, now he says he hopes to be 50% electric cars by then. Personally don't care either way still be driving my J2 oldsmobile and gas powered daily driver. Happy motoring

RandyS

When and where did he say that?

griffey57

His speech the other day on the news

Donaldbabineau

at 22 pounds of lithium per car and 50 percent of cars being 143,000,000 cars, you would need 1,573,000 tons of lithium for batteries. Not feasible. Not even close.

fleming442

interesting factoid

F-85 4-4-2

Global lithium reserves are 80 million tons, with 60% of that in South America. 2019 production was, however, under 100,000 tons, or 0.1% of the reserves.
Top six countries with the largest lithium reserves in the world (nsenergybusiness.com)

RandyS

The actual speech said HALF of all NEW cars sold by 2030 need to be electric........

Donaldbabineau

total reserves is a misleading number. Available reserves is a more accurate measure. Mineral reserves are largely not feasible due to cost to extract not to mention environmental cost of mining. Salt flats are available. I saw a breakdown somewhere but can't find it now. Big issue with a fast turnover to electric battery is the long lead time to ramp up production.

fleming442

Still not buying one.....

no1oldsfan

It is all just said to keep the "environmental" people at bay. Nobody brings up what all goes into building electric cars and how the world will be stripped in all new ways to supply the plan. There are millions and millions of gasoline powered vehicles on the road. They aren't suddenly going to disappear.

rocketraider

Develop them to point they have equal or greater range than a dino-powered vehicle, can be fully recharged in same time as a gasoline fillup, and upgrade the US electrical grids to be able to support charging all those EVs, and I might consider one. Course I'll be 75 years old in 2030 provided I live that long, so maybe not.

We used to have a popcorn smiley. Considering who's participating, it could come in handy!

Countdown to thread getting locked starts 1415 EST...⏲


BTW anyone getting nasty PM's yet?😼

Kennybill

Here's an interesting documentary from CNN. This shows how they mine the rare Earth minerals. Afghanistan has a billion dollars worth.
https://edition.cnn.com/interactive/...y-energy-intl/

Donaldbabineau

which I am sure the Chinese will make good use of.

bw1339

They are counting on this being someone else's problem by the time 2030 comes. Sleazy politics 101.

HighwayStar 442

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a3...la-rental-evs/

HighwayStar 442

Do not make this political, its technology

no1oldsfan

I read that too. The thing with electric cars (please excuse me actually using words) is that there are a lot of people that do not have access to charging stations etc. If someone rents a home they cannot add a charging station. I get the idea of a less pollutive world but you have to be real at the same time. The idea thrown out there is that this will save the world. No mention of how we have to tear up the world fifty times more than we already do to produce what is needed to produce these cars etc.

We are in America. We have zero clue about third world countries and what they produce into the environment. Hell look at Mexico for one. Look at the amount of dirty air that they push out there. Nobody even questions it. Same countries that the big countries want to destroy to chase what is needed to make electric vehicles. This debate will always be there.

no1oldsfan

Agreed.

HighwayStar 442

Georgia of all states. Is building solar along highways. At the unused, open areas at exit ramps. And will have charging station nearby. Like I said many times on here, 3 to 5 years. EV will start to be very common on the roads.

fleming442

The global aspect cracks me up. Our EPA stifles in-country production, forcing it overseas, just so they can thump their chest. The pollution is the same;it's just somewhere else!
I completely agree that they act like EVs are some miracle cure for hundreds of years of activity.
Why can't we have diesels like Europe? Oh yeah, the EPA....

HighwayStar 442

It more about profits, Why everything went overseas. Labor cost was a faction overseas and Mexico. And yes, you could pollute more in other nations. Many nation are cesspools compared to us..

olds 307 and 403

Battery technology really needs about twice the capacity to be useful here. Maybe the Lithium Metal batteries will get us there. Hopefully cold weather Supposedly the Danes have a lot of electric cars as a second car but use their electric cars much less than the gas powered cars. Charge time just make then not so practical. Huge power grid upgrades will be needed here.

CANADIANOLDS

Nope

HighwayStar 442

I am sure the guys with horses. Said the same thing.

fleming442

......and cars were supposed to be flying by now. What's your point? I'll take ion propulsion over a golf cart any day.

no1oldsfan

Funny thing is have you heard a Tesla in reverse? Sounds just like the Jetson's cars.

rocketraider

🙂

😆😂🤣

Loaded68W34

That is a really funny comparison. In 2003 I was a junior in high school and a presenter for the Pittsburg Institute of Aeronautics gave a presentation to my physics class. This is a pretty good school by the way that I actually considered attending. The presenter was convinced that within 10 years (= 2013) flying cars would be available to the general public.

FStanley

I am no expert but some things to think about and everything is tradeoffs..

1. I think an electric car for short drives might be OK. for a typical grocery getter. Long distance could have some limitations..

2. from what I have read lithium does not recycle well. Also the processing of it and tailings are not good. Where is the plan for mountains of used up vehicle batteries??

3. Also some applications like say heavy freight railroad transportation, could this realistically be made electric?

4. To make the electricity, how much is made by fossil fuel, like coal?

so are we just trading off one problem for another??

I'd like to see an overall plan..

Not an expert..

no1oldsfan

Amen. Great points. This country is billions of dollars away from having charging stations everywhere. Like you said. Give me the touring capacity that a gasoline burning engine does. Good luck. I will do what I do. Rebuild old antiquated V-8 engines and have them running smooth. I don't hate on Electric Vehicles (again excuse me for spelling) I just feel like it is something that will never be all or nothing.

FStanley

https://www.reuters.com/business/aut...al-2021-08-05/

F-85 4-4-2

Is anyone else studying that Jetson's clip and deciding which are factory fast, have been modified, etc? Is the guy with the helmet a racer?
Jeez, I need a life.

olds 307 and 403

That is another great point, dirty fuels powering electricity. China has quite a few EV's, they use a lot of coal. Even here in Saskatchewan, we are coal based for electricity. It isn't just as easy as switching. It is kind of like no longer eating meat. If we just stop eating all the cows and chickens, what do we do with all these specifically bred animals that can't really survive in the wild without us? Basically a major kill off with minimal breeding. Will everyone comply. People are ********, they only think of themselves and don't like being told what to do. The same idea, many things have to be done for years before it can suddenly happen. Our government and utilities need to start now doing huge upgrades and installing huge solar grids to make electric cars useful and actually green.

wr1970

On my never list!

wr1970

Those ******** don't like to be told what to do for a reason!! Mostly time has shown government is wrong.
When it come to car's and trucks in the united states' being the major polluting factor. Is the other nations going to comply no! So then you still have the problems.

BlueCalais79

Right now electric = short haul. The new Ford F-150 lightning's range is 300 miles UNloaded. No thanks. I'll take my 2014 STEEL F-150 with it 36 gallon tank that will get me 700 miles unloaded (on a flat HWY). These EV's just currently do not have the range yet.

Will22

As far as the electric grid is concerned, no amount of wind or solar will completely replace fossil fuels until storage has been perfected. Not to mention that when you look at the accreditation that the regional transmission operators give to wind and solar, you would have to overbuild these facilities by way more than double. I do think that hydrogen has some merit but is mostly being used on a small scale so far due to the costs and the amount of water needed to produce hydrogen. Additionally, wind and solar are not as effective in some parts of the US, meaning that more transmission lines will need to be built which takes years to do. I am not saying that the electric grid won't get there, just in my opinion, we are years away.

blakes7

Does anyone know how long it takes these electric cars to charge? What are you supposed to do during a long trip while waiting for it to charge, sit there at the station and twiddle your thumbs for hours?

I agree that it's politicians making promises to buy votes, knowing that they will either be long gone by 2030, or will worry about what to say when 2030 comes. Maybe blame their opponents for holding up spending the necessary money that we would have to print, borrow from China, or tax the people more.

rocketraider

Yes they do. They also pay premium prices to get the GOOD American coal, while US electric utilities basically get stuck with tailings and other low-grade coals. In return, that requires ever more expensive emissions control devices. A big coal-fired powerplant designed to use high grade Eastern bituminous coal is often forced to use more volatile (read explosive hazard) lower-BTU coal to stay online. It will burn 20-30% more fuel to produce the same power output along with increased furnace fouling and equipment maintenance issues.

Sounds like corn likker gasoline, don't it?😀

But just because I was there doesn't mean I know anything.😼

Get the US electric grids where they're able to handle charging these EVs along with keeping the rest of modern life going, then we'll have a viable plan. Pie in the sky and wishing it were so ain't gonna get us there.

4+4+2=10

How much is the range of an electrical car affected in the winter when the only source of heat in the car is electrical ?