So the fuses arrived, popped it in, and the gen light works as it should. Comes on when the key is in the run position with the engine off. Just a couple hours ago, when I started the car, gen light is off, and I tested voltage right away and got about 12.9. As it warmed up and idled better, the voltage increased. I revved it a few times to get the rpm’s up, and the voltage went up to 14.1. It then hovered around 13.9 - 14.1. Not sure what’s going on but it seems to be acting properly now.

strange.

 

Some additional information:

I re-tested voltage at several points:

1) At the battery, 12.3 volts, running.
2) At the VR, same.
3) Volts are NOT increasing as RPM increases.
4) Tested at the generator; I got a strange, low reading of 1.5 volts.
5) Battery status is 'poor' according to my tester.

I am going to take the generator in to get tested. I have not tinkered with any wiring yet. I figured I would bring the generator in for testing first. Could the generator be a major issue here?

 

Gone from this ^^^

To this ^^?

You indicated at some point in the very not too distant past, you questioned whether you correctly polarized the GEN at the VR.

I have been under the impression you had this GEN rebuilt? Generally, a shop engaged in rebuilding generators is most often a good reputable shop. But, you suggested quite recently you may have incorrectly polarized the GEN at the VR. I think I'd double-check you correctly polarized the GEN. It certainly won't hurt to polarize the GEN again if the wiring is correct.

Because there's been ups & downs w/ changing and testing charging state components, my suggestion on making another attempt to polarize the GEN is this - start completely fresh. The GEN will have a tendency to retain (remember) the polarized electromagnetic field. So, let's completely start fresh.

(1) Remove both (+) and (-) battery terminals;
(2) Remove each of the wires from the VR. DO NOT allow any wires to touch any other wire, or touch any other surface (important);
(3) Reconnect each of the VR wires - cleanly. DO NOT allow any wires to touch any other surfaces except the correct location on each of the VR posts;
(4) Reconnect both (+) and (-) battery terminals;

(5) Polarize the GEN via the VR as previously outlined & provided.

(6) Retest GEN charging circuitry.

 

I provided you w/ a VR picture/image but I also provided you w/ a URL link for polarizing an "A" circuit (used on GM vehicles).

Here is the URL for polarizing an "A" circuit:

https://texaspowerwagon.com/polarize.htm

 

Link to the Post I provided previously >>> 9

 

Mike - I forgot to point this out. It is not necessary to HOLD the jumper wire to both VR terminals - a very simple "touch" is all that is required. You "should" notice a very brief "spark". The spark would indicate you've correctly polarized the charging circuitry. If you in fact, you see no "spark", it's quite possible there's a wiring issue.

 

Thanks Norm I will be starting fresh here shortly. I will repost the outcome. This is very strange.

 

Strangeness is why vehicle forums exist.

 

I have no idea how I went from that first outcome to this most recent one today. But I will follow these steps, carefully.

 

Just remembered this: the past couple times of driving it for carb rebuild test, I’ve heard a ticking or clicking noise coming from right in front of me, like on the firewall area, VR area. I finally got my mechanic stethoscope out and listens for loudest noise and sure enough, that clicking, ticking (sounds like a wimpy game show / carnival wheel where you spin it, and there are pegs around the circumference, hitting a fixed peg as it spins) sound is coming from the VR. Never heard it ever before……

 

1st thing is to correctly polarize the VR; then, see if your carnival/game show is still on the air.

 

Things are very weird again; I did what you said Norm. I started from scratch. Un taped and un loomed my wires all the way from GEN to VR. Took off both battery cables, all three wires going to the VR and the two connected to the GEN. Made sure things were connected properly according the diagram. Once I had it all connected, I attached the negative batt cable lastly, then polarized the GEN. One solid, good spark.

started the car, checked voltage, 12.8-12.9 idling. Rising voltage to 14.5 when RPMs increased. Proper vintage at the generator, proper at the VR.

not sure what gremlins are in my system, but once again, it’s acting properly. I’ll listen for the clicking once I take her out soon for a test drive.

 

Those are good working numbers. One solid good spark is a good clue polarization was complete (warranted). >90% of electrical issues reside on the ground (-) negative side of a wiring circuit. If you have not, it's always in your best interest to clean all ground (-) contact points on your car (especially) since it's an old beast w/ old wires and most likely significant oxidation/corrosion in places you might not suspect. Attachment points where GEN mounts to engine should be cleaned (sanded/wire brushed), the firewall where the VR attaches to firewall should be sanded/wire brushed & new hardware (nuts, washers, screws, bolts, etc.) installed. You want to spend a couple hours well worth your time spend it cleaning all your negative (-) ground wires, wire terminal ends & the attachment points where ground wires attach to the block, the chassis, the frame, firewall, etc. Electrons flow from the negative (-) ground wire(s) connection(s) beginning at the negative (-) battery terminal post & then to every single device, item on your car and back to the positive (+) battery terminal post. Don't overlook your battery cables and your battery posts. Every ground should be cleaned on these old beasts. If you remove the GEN and/or VR to clean replace hardware, etc. the GEN will most likely retain its correct polarized electromagnetic field if those are removed only briefly then reattached w/in a couple hour period. If in doubt, polarize the GEN via the VR, again.

 

Great advise Norm. I did that when I first got my car, the gen light was glowing slightly when the car was at idle in gear. It has stayed off since.
There are a couple of ground straps that aren't shown on the diagram that I found on mine. They are connected from the frame to the upper control arm on the passenger and driver's side right at the inner fender well. There's also the one for the horn and lights hidden away by the cover over the front grill.

 

Art - That's good info. I'm not familiar w/ the exact locations for each ground strap on Mike's car.

 

I went back out to the garage, and cleaned up all grounds that I could: block to battery, battery posts (the battery is a little over a year old), VR to firewall screws and mounting holes, generator bracket bolts, and VR terminals. After I reconnected the negative battery cable to the battery, I started her up, took her out for a short drive. She was driving just fine. I got back after letting it get up to temp for a while, and wanted to test the voltage while in park and engine running. Back down to 12.2 volts at the battery. Here is what I got for numbers at different testing points:

At the voltage regulator:
BATT term reads 12.2 running engine. No change with RPM increase.
ARM term reads 14.4 volts, changes with RPMs.

At the battery:
12.2 volts no matter what the RPMs.

At the generator:
Armature terminal is 14.4 volts, and changes with RPMs.

I am absolutely stumped here. The only thing I changed from when it was working OK was that I disconnected the negative battery cable to clean up ground connections etc. Any ideas? Thoughts? Is the battery potentially a culprit?

 

I am going to have to search for those other ground points. I wasn't aware of those! And since I wasn't aware, you can bet they haven't been touched in many years, if ever.

 

I believe there's a couple in the trunk too.

 

Honestly, taking it for a "short drive" on these old relics can be short of driving up enough amperage &/or voltage to produce/yield a good working voltage on the battery. I wouldn't get too bent out of shape just quite yet. If you had the lights ON (it's dark out), the interior lights were ON, the instrument lights were ON, the headlamps were ON, all exterior lights were ON and you went for a short drive. Take it for a drive tomorrow during daylight and make some measurements or take it for a long drive tonight. Generators have to work quite hard (especially older generators).

What's the status of your carnival/game-show clicking?

 

I will take a longer cruise tomorrow and retest Norm. The clicking has gone away, which is nice. I’ll also check those ground strap areas.

 

If you need to you can take a razor blade utility knife & slice into (through) the battery cables about 6" up from where they terminate to look for oxidation/corrosion. If you find Influenza colored blue/green snot occupying the cables - especially the negative (-) ground battery cable, you should install new cable(s). Here some images of the ground cable of my Indian motorcycle ground cable illustrating what happens inside a battery cable which you can't visualize unless you remove some of the exterior insulation. This type oxidation/corrosion seriously impedes electron flow and significantly increases the resistance. You can see one of the cable terminal ends is fine, the other side is shot.

 

My positive cable is about 4 months old, and the negative cable to engine block is only a couple years old. I will have to try and find more of those ground points on the chassis. I wasn't able to take it out for a drive today. Maybe this weekend. The clock is ticking for Back to the 50's!

 

Back to the 50's begins two weeks from today.

 

Right on! Can’t wait!

 

I took the Olds out for a longer drive this evening, about 30 miles or so. When I first started the car, I let it warm up a bit, and then checked the voltage. Battery was about 12.9 at startup, low idle, and as the RPMs increased, the voltage also increased. With a good rev of the engine, it would climb to 14.4 or so. Things looked good. After the cruise, I tested at the battery, generator and VR. The battery read 12.03 with the engine running, parked in the driveway after the cruise. The VR measure about 13.9 at the ARM terminal. The BATT terminal of the VR was the same as testing at the posts of the battery itself: 12.9 V. The terminal at the GEN read 13.9.

What could cause the battery not to charge after that long drive? Even when I increased the RPMs from under the hood while a meter was hooked up to the battery, ZERO change in voltage from 12.03. I also have a picture of the reading from my meter as the car sits with no engine running.

 

The first thing which comes to mind is the state of the battery. It can sometimes be the case a battery has lost it ability to optimally charge; the second thing which comes to mind is a parasitic draw.

SOH - State Of Health. The difference between your battery (the battery being evaluated by the meter) against known good battery of maximum charge. Your meter states your battery has the equivalent of 17.2% charge remaining. If the meter is correct and is reading correctly, you're unfortunately at a rather dire low level of charging capacity for your battery.

If it isn't the battery (but the meter says it is), then a parasitic draw is the only thing which comes to mind. Look new batteries can be and have been demonstrated to be bad. Drive your car to a parts store or take your battery to a parts store and have them perform a "free" load test on your battery to settle the question of whether your battery is capable of receiving a charge.

 

Thanks for that tip, Norm. I'll be bringing it to a parts store tomorrow to have it tested.
Would it be worth it to hook the battery up to my battery charger and let it charge overnight? Or should I just bring it right to a parts store tomorrow?

 

I'd bring it straight away to the parts store. Another way to look at your numbers is to suggest when the SOH gets low (yours is low), the battery has a difficult time maintaining its charge & can quickly dissipate charge. So, again, validating the state of the battery is certainly a first step. It has to be able to take a charge and maintain a charge. If the battery is capable of taking a charge and maintaining a charge, the next thing to test would be a parasitic draw somewhere in your electrical which is drawing amperage away from your battery - this is a possibility, but having the battery tested is the first step. Battery cells may have deteriorated.

 

I have dropped it at an auto parts store. They said the battery is good, it's just very low, 12 volts. They are charging it up. It should be ready in about 45 minutes or so. I will make an update after I get it back and drive the car around and do some testing.

 

SOH 100%. The battery is fully charged and starting the vehicle, at a slow idle, we're getting about 13.9 volts. I will monitor it, but that seems like a good first sign.

 

A battery reading of 12.0 V has a state of charge of ~48% (often times might not be enough to start a vehicle). Tenths (0.10) of a volt are very important reading a battery. Hopefully you're trending in a positive direction. A fully charged battery reads >12.6 V. Maintain a watchful eye.
I'll generally take a fully charged (>12.6 V) battery & disconnect both battery terminal cables (or set it on a wood work bench) & measure battery voltage every 1hr - 2hr over a 48 hr time period to see if it's maintaining it's charge or losing state of charge.

 

Here are two documents I created quite some ago should you want/need to perform additional diagnostics/troubleshooting. One document is for measuring parasitic draw. To perform this test using a multi-meter the multi-meter must be capable of reading AMPS (amperage). The other document is for measuring ground resistance, continuity & voltage. These two documents are posted as attachments (which you can d/l).

EDIT:
I made an error in the Test For Ground Resistance file I provided (above). I think it was an old Word file (I had incorrectly performed a copy/paste function) then incorrectly converted that bad Word file to a .pdf file. The error occurs in the Test For Ground Resistance section. To that end, please use the (attached) updated version (below). I'm going to leave the original (above) I posted & provide the updated file so others who may have downloaded the previous file can view the difference.

 

Well, I completed the parasitic draw test and found the culprit; the 3A fuse for the clock. It's quite a bit shorter in length than the rest of them and it was an original fuse, as far as I could tell. I have never replaced it. I set the meter up per the instructions and got a 70.9 mA draw. I started taking fuses out one by one until I got to the clock fuse. Once that was removed, the mA draw went down to 0.4. Quite the difference. Could I just leave that fuse out? Not sure what would be causing the clock circuit to be drawing. That 3A fuse is dedicated to only the clock. Strange!

Anyway, I tested resting voltage with no running engine, and I am at 12.7. Things seem to look good right now!

 

I suppose you could leave the clock fuse removed if you don't want the clock - I mean I guess. If the clock is still working after you remove the fuse you have a much bigger issue. Preference would be to diagnose/determine what is causing the amperage draw. I don't even know if your clock was ever working so some information is lacking.

To diagnose that clock circuit, move on to the test for ground resistance & continuity.

 

My guess is that the clock wasn't working anyway.
Yes, you can leave the clock fuse out.
It's rare to find one of these clocks that still works after sixty plus years.
Unless it has been repaired or refurbished.

 

BTW, the clock fuse should be a 2 Amp fuse, not a 3 Amp fuse. I'm suspicious someone previously had an issue w/ that circuit and installed a 3 Amp fuse instead of the required 2 Amp fuse. With that said, a 3 Amp fuse would not be the appropriately sized fuse for the clock circuit (Post #29 image).

 

As long as I've owned the vehicle (since 2010) that clock has never worked! I would like it to, but that's a minor concern for me. There very well could have been an issue with that circuit for a very long time, who knows how long.

I will check out the ground resistance and continuity test. Thanks for the tips. I will report back soon.

 

To put it simply (working from my armchair), if the clock is "attempting" to work, it is then "attempting" to draw amperage in order to function/operate - continually "attempting" (striving) to work. It requires amperage to function/operate. It should normally require only milliAmps to function/operate. The circuit is protected via a 2 Amp fuse. The thing about amperage is this - if it can't get it's minimum, it will continually strive/seek to gain enough amperage to function/work - it will attempt to draw more amperage than is the required minimum. That is, of course, "if" the clock is "attempting" to draw amperage. Since we have no knowledge of the "state" of the clock itself (working from an armchair): (1) The clock is attempting to continually draw more & more amperage; or, (2) there is an issue in the clock circuit itself. Your call which way you elect to move forward.

 

At a minimum you isolated an electrical issue which was continually drawing amperage (since a clock should continue to operate in the key OFF position). The entire car should draw <50mA. The clock circuit alone was drawing >70mA - win, win.

 

Big brain fart moment for me here. My meters measured the mV. I don’t have a meter capable of measuring mA. I’ll have to grab one off Amazon 🤦🏻