Jbaranda

Greetings from all the way in Germany. Im currently stationed out here and while most folks come to Europe and get beamers or benzes im wanting to go against the grain and purchase good ol' american muscle. I found a garage out here that imports them into the country and has a black hardtop 72 cutlass for sale (13K Euro = 16K dollars). I've been corresponding with the owner of the garage and he says that before they imported it (has cali plates on it) they had new carpet installed, seats were upholstered, and a new grill installed. Once it did get here he said they only replaced "the belts and the heater" (his German-English terms). Other than that eveything else is stock. Based off the pics body looks good, paint looks good, and the engine "looks" good also. He said the docs he has show the engine at being 6490 ccm. Which from my own google searching comes out to a 396 (?). I plan on taking a look at it sometime next week and i plan to be thorough with the inspection and take it for a test drive. If it checks out to be a good solid car and the purchase goes through what can i expect to change or should change to make it a reliable daily driver. Aside from the basic tune up and oil change what else would you all recommend. I might take it out on the autobahn a couple times just for sh*ts and giggles but i plan on babying the car.

dancutlass

First of all welcome to Germany J where exactly are you stationed?
Have you already checked the prices for a comparable car in the US? It might be cheaper to import one yourself! If you want to go that route let me know, I've done that and can recommend a good company to do all the shipping! If you buy one in Germany, make sure it already has a H-Zulassung (historical registration) it will safe you a lot of money. If it doesn't have it, you must change a few things, like converting the headlights and add emergency flashers...and getting it inspected by the TÜV is also expensive. furthermore it MUST be original, which the 72 you're talking about isn't if it really has a 396 in it...I'm not a 72 expert but I think it should have a 350 or 455 in it.
I'm pretty sue you noticed the gas prices here?! :-( and the small parking lots...let me know if you have any questions concerning registration, converting to European standards or anything else concerning Germany
Greetings from Munich!
Dan

droptopron

What is the parts availability for a car like that over there? If tune up parts require a two week wait I'd think about changing to electronic ignition. If you want to drive every day and take on the autobahn I'd concentrate on the suspension. If it doesn't have power front discs think about a conversion. If it doesn't have it already consider a rear sway bar (and boxed control arms) and make sure shocks & springs are in good shape and radial tires as well. Good luck. If you can, post a link to the pics.

droptopron

Also, a Chevy big block will be easy to tell from an Olds engine. An Olds engine should have an oil fill tube on the front of the engine just to the left of the water neck. A chevy big block will have a very wide valve cover. Google pics of each and the difference will be obvious.

Redog

Yeah when he said "396" I though, "Oh boy, it has a BBC in it"

If it does have the Chevy, I wouldn't buy it. That 396 is better in a Chevelle. JMO

dancutlass

Totally agree with it! Not only because it is a Chevy engine in an Olds, but as I mentioned before, it will cost you the possibility of the historical registration. Spoken in numbers: Instead of 191€ taxes per year you would have to pay about 1600€ for a "normal registration" with a 6400ccm engine, furthermore you wouldn't be allowed to drive in most of the inner cities because of the environmental zones, which would be a big problem for a daily driver...convincing enough?

64Rocket

For $16,000 it better be a show room quality car!

Gene

Jbaranda

Thanks everyone for the input. Based off what you all see please let me know if you think its is worth the price. I've looked at trying to ship one from the states and its typically about $2000 give or take. The picture of the engine bay looks like there is an oil fill tube on front of the engine block unless im looking at something else. Dan - Im in West Germany about two hours away from Frankfurt. Dont think i will need to do the conversion because i will be able to register the car through my base and they dont make us convert our US spec cars. Attached are some pictures from the website. Additionally Dan if you wouldnt mind maybe you can translate the brief description that the garage owner posted about the car....see below...

Also....im thinkin that before the import they wanted to clone the cutlass into a 442 hence the badge on the grill and on top the engine block.


HU/AU - Neu
Cutlass im Rat-Look mit typischer US-Lackierung in schwarz, schöne schwarze Innenausstattung, ordentlicher Motorraum, Klima vorbereitet jedoch ohne Funktion, Oldtimerzulassung, abholbereit mit deutschem Kfz-Brief und Tüv.

1970cs

It looks pretty decent! I see a few issues missing vinyl roof, but trim work is in place, also it looks like Buick wheels? Paint quality is not what I would expect for $.

Given the cost to ship and premium for being in another country with limited choices I would make it your call!

If it was here in the U.S. I would walk at that price.

Pat
1970 Cutlass Supreme coupe
2004 Alero GLS coupe

MDchanic

Very wavy bodywork. I'd beware.

If you're active US on base, I think you could do much better shipping one over, and then possibly selling it there when you're done, than you could with that one.

It does have an Olds engine, but its impossible to see enough of it to say anything about it.
It's painted the wrong color, which doesn't mean much, except that it's been messed with.

Oh, and the German bit basically says it's a nice-looking, shiny American "muscle-look" car with a pretty engine compartment, non-working A/C, antique plates, and approved for German roads.

- Eric

dancutlass

In my opinion from what I can see it looks like it has a lot of bondo on it.
When you look at the last picture the surface looks very wavy. You're right with the oil fill tube, it looks like an Olds engine, would be interesting which one. Well two hours is a big distance in Germany 2 hours in which direction from Frankfurt?
The previous owner has already converted it, otherwise it wouldn't have a registration, a big plus for the car!
Where on the www is it advertised? I've found it here's the link for some more pics: http://suchen.mobile.de/auto-inserat...163411456.html
Should I call him for you and ask any questions about the car? Sorry for asking so many questions, I just want to help

Translation of the description:
General Inspection/ emissions test (in German words TÜV) new
Oldsmobile Cutlass in Rat Rod look with typical american paint job in black (which actually means cheap and bad here), Nice black interior, clean engine bay, prepared for air condition, but not working, historical registration, ready to go with German title and TÜV

dancutlass

Eric was faster

67cutlass67GS

16k seems high by anyones estimation i think. Def Olds powered that i can say. Is it claimed to be matching numbers ? Also u can notice the body work. I dont ever trust pics, ive seen them do wonders for bondo buckets...Its missing a couple of ctr caps as well. For that money I would want & need every inch of documentation. Im not an Olds expert by no menas but the numbers seem high just from the regular research that I do. best of luck,,,

MDchanic

Only because I really don't speak German well, so I just got the sense of the meaning, rather than the exact meaning.

HA - the way it was written, I had suspected it was an insult, but wasn't sure.
You guys probably get all sorts of poorly restored American cars over there that would never sell here, plus, your small shop owners still value craftsmanship over productivity, so I am not surprised at this use of the term .

- Eric

dancutlass

Yes it definately is an insult and not a good sign. But you have to admit he was wary in the choice of his words
Yeah if I wouldn't see the great work of the guys in this forum every day, I would really think the Americans don't know how to weld and body work for them is riveting in the sheet of some old coke cans and covering it with tons of bondo. And exactly that is what might have happened to the car
By the way to complete the meaning of the term: it also means that not a single part has been taken off of the car before painting it.
NO OFFENSE to all of the great guys here!

dancutlass

Have you already looked at it?
I e-mailed the seller and got an answer today. He insists on the fact that the engine is a 6,4L, due to the VIN and the title. The car has recently been imported from California, but thats all he knows about the car's background...
I could bet he doesn't know much about Oldsmobiles in general...

oldcutlass

There are probably much better examples to buy at that price. As stated above, I'd keep looking.

dancutlass

X2!!


I asked him for the vin, too: 3J57K2Z114461
In that price range it's better to import a car yourself. And it's more fun, too

1970cs

Not Mine! craigslist Muskegon,MI seems like a nice car for the money!!!
http://centralmich.craigslist.org/cto/3140282476.html

$8200 U.S. = $6674 Euro
Maybe worth your time on this one! I think we have a CO member in Muskegon, maybe he can eyeball it for you?

Pat

1969w3155

What? you going to make me go out into my gararge?

DENT

Dose not look like $16000 , looks like $5000 at most. Just my humble opinion.

1970cs

Link to C/L is dead but this is the same car! baring any repairs that may had to done? pretty nice mark up!http://www.cars.com/go/search/detail...nal&listType=1

1969w3155

Ya know, I had an inkling that the guy was a dealer, though he feigned having knowledge of cars, I brought it to him in Kentwood, Mi. to a leased business address, not a dealership of any kind. I had it for sale two years ago for $10,500... no offers, last year at $9500.00 no offers, this year at $8,200.00, and got a little interest, and he saw it at The Gimore Car Museum's Red Barns Spectacular earlier this month...wadduyadu? It was a decent car and I always got comments on it, not w/o flaws...20' paint but a solid car.

ah64pilot

So you sold that car for $8200 and now the guy (dealer) wants $14,600 for it? I have a feeling if it was worth $14,600 you would have sold it for that, right?

1969w3155

Hell Yes!

1970cs

Did they do anything to it, by your eyeballs? Or did they just slap on retail price and let it rip.

Pat

1969w3155

Not that I can see, there are still paint chips visible, dirt kicked up below the "Cutlass" emblem, which would not be there if I still had it (wash it). They sprayed/dyed a tear near the drivers shoulder on the seat...it appears that they dyed the exposed foam, which was due to fabric separation. It was about 1/2" at it's widest 2-3" long. He asked about the rear tires being too wide for a car wash as he wanted to run it through an "Auto Spa". I said "I wouldn't know as I always hand washed it. and had waxed it/clay barred it!

1969w3155

The worst spot in the interior.

1970cs

Mike Holmes "lipstick and mascara" $8200 if that's what he gave you? $500 for recondition= $8700-14600=$5900 potential profit 67% markup!

I am lucky enough to make around 10, on new equipment.