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Did an R&R on the intake manifold gasket & valve cover gaskets. Going to R&R oil pump & R&R rear main seal.
I'm @ TDC w/ distributor removed, radiator support & fan shroud screws removed, oil drained, RH exhaust pipe disconnected & engine mount bolts removed. Ready to remove oil pan. Engine lift is ready to hoist engine up as far as possible to gain access for oil pan removal. QUESTION: CSM states to "remove crossover pipe..." What crossover pipe?
(1) CSM referring to the transmission cross-member?
(2) CSM referring to a dual exhaust crossover pipe? I've seen pictures (elsewhere) of a dual exhaust crossover pipe - although, I don't believe I've found an OEM dual exhaust crossover pipe in the CSM for this series. Vehicle has dual exhaust Flowmaster. The Flowmaster pictures depict a (welded) crossover pipe for this series application. I don't have a crossover pipe in my current Flowmaster dual exhaust system (which is fine by me - no biggie).
Before I lift the engine I'd appreciate some advice as to what this crossover pipe is the CSM is referring to (p. 6B-18 V-8 ENGINE All Series - 1971 OLDSMOBILE CSM).
Most dual exhaust 350 cars used a block off plate to make the pass side exhaust manifold a dual exhaust manifold VS the single exhaust w crossover manifold it started life as. Thornton makes some baby WZ manifolds for the 350 to eliminate the crossover block off set up
Thanks Ranger. Indeed. I wondered about this after purchasing the vehicle. The vehicle listing stated Flowmaster dual exhaust w/ a 442 rear bumper. First time I got under the vehicle & viewed the exhaust I did notice a block off plate on the pass side exhaust manifold. Your comment has now provided some clarity as to for what reason this block off plate exists - it's now become clear. Since I don't know specifically if this dual exhaust is truly a Flowmaster system, it's possible it could have Thornton WZ manifolds as well, for all I know. Baby steps on maintaining/upgrading this vehicle but I'm getting there.
the baby WZs just eliminaate the crossover part of the manifold to make a true dual manifold and simulate the BBO W Z manifolds The std SBO ex manifold has the crossover blocked to make dual exhaust
Just a follow-up (sorta) to this post (eating humble pie). I managed to accomplish everything I set out to do by lifting the engine - and, then some. Plus it motivated me to move on to numerous other areas which needed updating.
However, I have to fess up. I really botched the bloody oil pan seal installation - not one-bit happy with my performance in this area. IMO, I used far too much Right Stuff RTV sealant. The cork seal blew out on me on two different attempts during the initial installation & I attempted to 'save' my disaster.
With that said, my next new oil pan gasket arrives Monday. I'm getting pretty darn fast at removing exhaust pipes, starter, motor mount bolts, fan shroud, cleaning oil pan & block seats, and raising the engine. In my defense...well, actually...I have no defense.
But hey! At least you're an honest man. It might not be right, but after I straighten the flange on the pan I only use a light smear of RTV on the pan side of the gasket - nothing on the block side. The friction on the block side of the gasket keeps it from squirting out. An alternative might be to smear the block side of the gasket and install it, snug the pan, let it sit overnight, then smear the pan side and tighten.
Last edited by 69 Ragtop; January 5th, 2019 at 05:56 PM.
But hey! At least you're an honest man. It might not be right, but after I straighten the flange on the pan I only use a light smear of RTV on the pan side of the gasket - nothing on the block side. The friction on the block side of the gasket keeps it from squirting out. An alternative might be to smear the block side of the gasket and install it, snug the pan, let it sit overnight, then smear the pan side and tighten.
Great suggestion. Those two options you stated are spot-on the exact methods I am now considering. Thanks.
Should not need to RTV all of gasket, use spray tack on pan and one side of gasket. Let it set up and gasket will not move. Use a bit of RTV in the corners of pan for a sure seal on top of gasket and let it skin a little. Are you using a one piece oil pan gasket?
Should not need to RTV all of gasket, use spray tack on pan and one side of gasket. Let it set up and gasket will not move. Use a bit of RTV in the corners of pan for a sure seal on top of gasket and let it skin a little. Are you using a one piece oil pan gasket?
Hi Chris. I'm using the x4 piece. I did see one person (YouTube) use a 3M adhesive spray to tack the side seal pieces to the block, then inserted the rubber end seals, then place a very minor amount of RTV on the seal and the dabs of RTV at the corners (where the oil pan meets the end rubber seals & timing chain cover).
Last edited by Vintage Chief; January 5th, 2019 at 06:25 PM.
I did find a Fel-Pro one-piece rubber gasket which I really liked. I did my best to research it pretty well. It was for Chevy 350 though. Looks identical to the Olds SBO 350 but never found anywhere where it stated it was the same fit for the Olds SBO.
Spray tack is a red spray on permatex product, will keep cork gasket in place. Place heavy beads of RTV in all four corner top and bottom. Tough to put pan up straight with engine in car, good trick is to put some pieces of threaded rod in four corners to guide pan into place.
Tough to put pan up straight with engine in car, good trick is to put some pieces of threaded rod in four corners to guide pan into place.
Not nearly as tough as lifting that F***ing 50lb intake manifold & dropping it in place with the turkey basting valley pan intake gasket...LOL
Which, BTW, I did make a couple of nice small steel dowel rods placed into a couple of the manifold bolt holes so I could drop that beast in dead center and was still a wrenching affair. Should probably had a friend help me with that one, yet the intake manifold gasket appears to have been spot-on.
Should not need to RTV all of gasket, use spray tack on pan and one side of gasket. Let it set up and gasket will not move. Use a bit of RTV in the corners of pan for a sure seal on top of gasket and let it skin a little. Are you using a one piece oil pan gasket?
This is good. Definitely use a small dollop of RTV in the corners, but in your research I'm sure you've seen the hazards of getting goo-gobs of RTV inside the engine. It has a way of finding its way to the oil pump pickup and beyond. If you search Ebay for "spray gasket sealer" you get this: https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_fro...ealer&_sacat=0 . Loctite also makes a spray product called "Hi-Tack".
Also, the one-piece Chevy gasket won't fit the SBO 350.
...goo-gobs of RTV inside the engine....the one-piece Chevy gasket won't fit the SBO 350.
I installed a new oil pump and new pick-up tube/screen during the oil pan R&R & examined the timing chain. When I say I put far too much Right Stuff RTV sealant on the gaskets I'd say it wasn't really "goo-gobs"...it was just far too much. I'd say I placed between 1/8" to 1/4" of RTV on each side of the cork gaskets (as per the CSM which states to coat both sides). And, from your guys responses & my own visualization that amount is too much. There is no RTV sealant floating about anywhere, what 'oozed' (blew) out remained firmly attached to the blown-out seals and casings - no worries there. I think I was overly paranoid having read previous posts regarding changing this 4-piece gasket set - lesson learned. I'm going to treat this gasket like I would any other gasket (trans, water pump, thermostat housing, etc.) which I barely even touch with sealant - applying only an extremely light coat of RTV sealant - just rubbing it with my fingers until it coats the gasket (except in the corners where I'll place a 'dollop').
Thanks for confirming the Chevy gasket won't fit.
Yeah I don't really like the RTV type sealer for flat surfaces like oil pan or Valve covers. I like to use the old school gasket shellac which gets tacky and holds the gasket in place. Work good for me....
Not nearly as tough as lifting that F***ing 50lb intake manifold & dropping it in place with the turkey basting valley pan intake gasket...LOL.
Yeah, I remember back in high school the first time I put the intake back on, leaning over the fender and the weight of the intake lifted my feet off the ground and I almost fell into the engine bay - I wasn't a heavy enough counterweight. That's one big reason why I swapped to an aluminum intake manifold. It is so much easier to work with.
Just another follow-up. It's been rather chilly as of late. None-the-less, my 2nd go-around of installing the oil pan gasket was much easier than my first....hmmm.....let's say 'practice run'. Thanks to Chris for the initial suggestion of the http://Permatex 80065 Gasket Sealer; Spray-A-Gasket (R); Aerosol Spray Can; 8 Ounce spray-on sealant. The first time I used the Fel-Pro cork gasket, this second time I used the Fel-Pro rubber/metal gasket (which I liked much better than the cork). I used a slight combination of several different scenarios:
(1) Cut x2 longer (1.75") oil pan bolts as guides;
(2) Used the spray-on sealant on the block and block-side of gasket;
(3) Allowed sealant to set 10 minutes;
(4) Placed gasket on block;
(5) Inserted oil pan bolts and longer guide bolts - tightened oil pan bolts snug;
(6) Allowed gasket to set ~30 minutes & removed oil pan bolts;
(7) Lightly glazed oil pan flange with Ultra-Black RTV - I mean 'lightly' as in rubbed on some RTV as if applying a light film to an oil filter gasket;
(8) Installed oil pan, torqued to value (put the rest of the stuff back on and lowered the engine);
(9) Allowed to set x24 hours;
(10) Filled engine w/ oil, rode tested hard.
Upon return had oil leaking (about 12 drops) from rear of oil pan. Let sit overnight.
Re-tightened oil pan bolts to torque values but added another couple of good old-fashioned SWAG torque values of my own (it's a 47 year old oil pan).
Let sit overnight.
Rode tested hard.
Not a single drop of oil anywhere. Not a single drop of seepage anywhere.
All things considered, I used new Grade 8 bolts, bolt holes were very clean, and IMHO - for a vehicle which has 125K miles, one shouldn't expect original torque values will be adequate on oil pan bolt hole threads which have probably had ~x40 oil changes of oil pan bolts run in/out - those threads don't hold their tightness forever. Much like the transmission oil pan bolt hole threads. I've become quite good at installing heli-coils over the years - lol.
Thanks everyone for the suggestions.
Last edited by Vintage Chief; January 16th, 2019 at 02:16 PM.
Such a Hodge-bodge of misinformation on the Internet. One site says this, another says that, some say nothing at all. Some even say cork when in fact, the seal is not cork but neoprene, instead. Even RA has this gasket description listed incorrectly. There is no cork in this gasket.
This is the one I ordered from RA and the one I received from RA. The side pieces are black neoprene rubber with a full metal interior. Rubber end-pieces are identical to all other types. Very satisfied w/ this gasket set. https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...=1435198&jsn=1
December 15th, 2018, 07:04 AM
Much like the transmission oil pan bolt hole threads. I've become quite good at installing heli-coils over the years - lol.
