Planned obsolescence,
Finished my honey do's today (new faucet washers in the shower to repair drip) and was just sitting around stewing about the amount I just paid for a set of decent tires for my Grand Cherokee and it got me to thinking about planned obsolescence, one example would be tires !!!! with todays technology and break throughs in chemistry and man made polymers that some one can't come up with a tire that actually last 60k-70k miles ? of course they can !! however where would the tire industry be then ? Planned obsolescence at it's finest !! another example would be major appliances, remember Grandma and Grandpas old Philco or Frigidaire refrigerators ? they lasted for 20-30 years in fact I' ii bet there are hundreds of them keeping Miller Lite's cold in basements across the USA but now days the average life expectancy of a fridge is 10 years !! same for dish washers and microwaves, they could make them to last but don't because they need you to keep buying their products. I have a friend that owns a garage door business when I moved in he gifted me a used Genie garage door opener that some one insisted that he replace even though it was operating just fine !! it was a 1969 model !! IT'S STILL GOING STRONG !! he said because back then the bearings were actual ball bearings used in construction then they went to brass bushings now there using nylon bushings (junk) So lots of products with planned obsolescence but I guess were stuck with it !!
I guess it's a good thing we have chosen the hobby we have so we can still enjoy things that were made to last !!

 

Oh yes Solly, must keep the economy going...

Lightbulbs were perfected in the 1800s and could stay functioning for 100 years. Then intentionally compromised down to telling us exactly how many hours they will work before needing a replacement. Today a 60 watt bulb last 1000 hrs, approximately 41 days.

Cars exactly like yours can last and serve their purpose for our average lifespans. Cuba has proven that. Imagine the incredible loss in GDP if all of us just bought one car forever.

 

Oooo solly you touched a sore spot! Ya I'm 200% sick of the cheap BS.
When I walk through Home Deep Hole or Highs (Lows), Auto China Zone, Oreillys (Chin- Irish), Napchina et al ....there isn't a USA made anything anywhere within their walls. Maybe the home deep hole has USA mulch or tomato plants.

Its directly due to the fact we let china and the bean counters run everything deeply into the ground. I will pay 3X to not have the part say china on it! I cant find that, new.
Anyone who knows me knows I stand on the anti-china soap box hard core. Have been for many years.

I am willing to pay for something I wont have to replace for a while. They (whom ever "they" are) need to take the word durable off the phrase durable-goods. No such thing exists unless its 30+ years old.

Spend 700 or 3000 on a clothes washer and both have the same cheap *** chineasiun junk internals. One has 2300 additional layers of lipstick on it. Guaranteed to last exactly 750 cycles. Not 751.
The next one will last 500 cycles. Will they eventually become single use? Its almost to the point of being a nuance having to buy **** over and over. Or is it a comedy? Or nightmare?

I'm redoing my kitchen. I need a down draft gas stove because the nuclear physicist that redid/rearranged the layout on the last remodel blocked off the exterior wall vent. Yep zero venting to the outside and no place to install an overhead vent and I'm not takin er down to the studs.
I know I'm going to spend 5-7.5K on a brandie new shiny giant lipstick sportin pig POS stove that will S-T-B in 9 years....vomit. . I might go commercial at 15K to get 9.5 years.
I'm keeping the 30 year old completely working non-down draft almond colored Kitchen Aid in the basement as a back-up or maybe Ill put it on the black market...its made in the USA..125% choke on it china.

 

We definitely live in a global economy, its the way the world works !! trade with other countries has been going on for a long, long time and its increasingly difficult to find products stamped MADE IN USA.
being retired and having time on my hands and being a internet junkie a lot of research goes in to my purchases ,for example when researching my tires for my Jeep and eventually settling on Yokohama Geolanders
I was pleasantly surprised to find the Geolander line of Yokohama's are made in Salem Va, not Japan. WIN !!
In addition to being a classic car quy I'm also a gun enthusiast, there are a lot of foreign made fire arms these days ( Turkey coming on strong ) but this is a segment where USA still has a large presence , for example
Smith and Wesson still all made in USA, Ruger still made in USA and my favorite Henry Fire arms where their motto is "Made in America, or not made at all".
I guess somethings we just have to deal with, planed obsolescence, the decline of quality products.
These days things being what they are price is a contributing factor also so all we can do is make the best informed decision's we can.

 

Ain't it the truth!

 

I've been running on LED bulbs since I renovated the house. So far, I have had one fail early, one die in my all-night-long light, and both bulbs in the 2 can lights I leave on most of the time I'm home and up in the kitchen. Some bulbs show some weird startup but all still work. This is 9 years timing on these events so far. 4 can lights and 23 bulbs still trucking.

 

Several years back my wife and I visited SF & Yosemite, at the time via a Mythbusters episode I heard about the 'Centennial' light bulb first installed in 1901 at a fire station.
It is currently housed in Livermore, CA so I dragged my wife to the firehouse for a visit as there are visiting hours for the light bulb.
The two firefighters showing us the bulb couldn't have been more gracious to my dorky visit, they were certainly used to it and it was an interesting visit...

 

I wouldn't have a problem with china if the quality was there. I cannot trust anything china...car parts home goods tools etc... Everyone says Ohh the cheaper item is affordable and wins with most people. Little do they realize if you have to buy it at 3:1 compared to a high-quality item you are actually spending more and lining chinas pockets.
Cant stand the blue light spectrum on LEDs in my house or on the car coming at me on the road. I tried several LEDs. They last for about 4 months. I stocked up on USA-made incandescents before your government put a ban on them.
Maybe the playing field as far as quality will eventually come up to par. But I'd rather invest here versus there.

 

China CAN do it if they want to. I know 5th gen Camaro wheels were made there, and they are of excellent quality. But like everything else, once you get them here and GM gets their markups and all...they're never cheap.

I'd still rather have them made in the USA.

 

China can make quality stuff, if the buyer is willing to pay for it!!!

I was surprised to find that Yokohama tires are domestic made, with a name like that I figured it was foreign.

A few weeks ago I started watching a video series on vintage home stereo equipment, which soon lead to a video series on “whatever happened to…..”. Imagine my surprise to learn that Pyle Industry (big name in car stereo equipment in the 80-90s) was manufactured in Huntington Indiana, about 35 miles north of me. I owned several sets of their speakers, at one time a pair were in my Olds. Imagine my “surprise” (that’s sarcasm) to learn that about 20 years ago the business was sold and moved overseas.

One of the videos i watched was on Pioneer. I assumed with a name like that, it was also domestic. It actually started in the 1940s in japan.

As for appliances, my 1954 Philco refrigerator still works! I bought it 3 years ago in an estate sale. Over Christmas break, the transmission went out on my 7 year old Whirlpool washer, I replaced it with a Speed Queen. About 3 weeks ago, the control board failed on the dryer. I’m of the opinion that computers belong on desks, NOT in appliances!! I replaced it with a matching speed queen. I figured every appliance parts store told me the same thing, speed queens are the least troublesome. I guess we will find out. I absolutely insisted on basic models, mechanical timers, just like our grandparents had. Granted, they don’t have all the fancy features, but in all reality I need just 2 basic features, the “on” feature, and the “off” feature!!

 

Horsefeathers! Quality standards are dictated by the American companies that are paying to have their products produced in China. Certainly China is capable of producing quality products, just look at their high-speed trains which are the envy of the world. Do not be fooled as Corporate America is responsible for the quality of the goods sent to the shelves of the American consumer, regardless of the location it is made. Lay the blame at the feet of those responsible—Corporate America, not the Chinese employee.

 

You just need to keep a jar of quarters in the laundry room 🤣

 

I’m sure every manufactures regardless of where they are located are capable of building a quality product the question is at what point is the product profitable ? Quality materials cost more as does skilled labor, is the consumer willing to pay the difference ? In some cases yes ,example Snap on tools vs Harbor Freight tools a market for both . Hyundai vs Cadillac a market for both. I guess we’re fortunate to have a choice .

 

i get over 60k miles from my Bridgestone duelers on my truck, my ge can opener has been in use for 51 yrs,it was a wedding gift. Our furniture doesn't last, dishwashers been down 2 times, dryer is Maytag, keeps burning out element every 3 months,

 

True, and look one more step down the chain of sales--to the consumer. Americans love cheap. Many shop on price alone. Suppliers give them what they want.

Some of us oldsters have a different view, having been raised by parents who at least had family awareness of the Depression and how essential it was to buy durables only once.

As another example of USA cheap, compare our health with the health of French and Italians. They are slender, even at an old age. Their longevity exceeds ours. They get joint replacement about half as often as Americans.

One of the differences is that those healthy populations buy good-tasting, traditional food, made with traditional fats. Americans buy cheap, flavored, manufactured food made with soybean or canola oil.

Even our pork, chicken, and eggs are very high in vegetable fats because the animals eat cheap feed made with soybean meal.

Many investigations have implicated vegetable oils in our obesity epidemic. But in the USA, cheap still rules.

 

Hey , while we debate quality, price , place of manufacture and planned obsolescence let’s give a shout out to our cars !! After all they’re the reason we are all here !! Of course it’s with our assistance they are here, thanks to our love of classic, vintage and antique auto’s . I'll give a nod to my Plymouth 91 years old and still going strong !!! Product of good ol Detroit Michigan !!

 

I put a set of goodyear wranglers on my c1500 not too long ago. I noticed the other day, the tires already have some small cracks in them. They look like they are 8 years old, not 2. The truck sits outside, but its usually in the shade.
To put into perspective, my old man put a set of BFG mud terrain tires on his jeep in the 80s. The jeep sat outside its entire life, 30 years later I robbed what was left of the jeep and scraped the rest into a bucket. The BFG radials had no cracking, but were as hard as plastic.
Planned obsolescence? I think so

 

But you forget the most important thing- they have to drive Renault, Fiat, etc., while we're "stuck" with our Oldsmobiles. Pass me more of that greasy chicken, please...

 

You want appliances to last...don't buy the latest and greatest thing. Anything with a computer chip in it has a built-in shelf life. I prefer mechanical washers/dryers to these new computerized models. I've had the same set in my house for over 25 years. No computers in them, just dials to set. Very easy to work on. I've had to replace 2 belts in the dryer and 1 pump in the washer in all of the time that I've owned them. I don't need a fridge that is going to e-mail or text me to let me know what I'm low on, just keep my stuff cold!

25 years ago, as a housewarming present my Dad bought me a freezer that I keep in the garage. Is it frost-free...no, but I de-ice and clean it twice a year and it's never given me an issue.

On the other hand, I've gone through 2 central a/c units in the same amount of time. They both came with 10-year warranties. Both, in year 11, had their compressors literally explode and then need to be replaced.

 

I tried several different LEDs before I found some with the correct color as our regular old bulbs. Like you, I'm not a fan of the "cold" LEDs. But now, to look at any lamp in my house, you would never know they were LEDs. Even the porch light and either side of the garage are LEDs that look like the old Edison bulbs. Same look, much more efficient, and been going for years.

 

You probably know this, but it's helpful for others... When buying an LED, look for the color rating, measured in degrees K. Buy ones that rate 3000 K and below to get the warm look of our old bulbs.

On a sad note, Federal regulations that take effect July 25, 2028, nearly triple the required energy efficiency of LED lamps. Right now, the only bulbs that qualify are the blue ones. If the industry doesn't figure out how to make more efficient bulbs with a balanced light output, I'm going back to candles.

 

Several years ago, I replaced the nasty old dust collecting track lights in our kitchen with recessed LED lights. Replacement lights had an interesting feature the hue was adjustable ! there was a switch on the backside where you could select the hue I of course, selected the setting to mimic the warm tone of good old-fashioned bulbs as I am not a fan of the cold blue light emitted by some LEDs. I also installed a dimmer and the lights have been working as designed for several years now.

 

Here are some landscaping lights I just installed and they have a switch on top to select 3000k, 4000k or 5000k. I would never choose this color inside the house but I like the 5000k for outdoors. You can see the lights on the garage are more of the old school look, even though they are LED Edison style. How long will they last? Who knows. But the Edison bulbs have been going strong for at least 5 years now.

 

Gang
Step back a sec, if you think about it, planned obsolescence is really just a crude version of getting you to subscribe to a product/device, but as expressed in buying form. One way to view it is you get X hours of use for Y dollars, until the product stops working. Really we’re griping about a continual drop in quality, which can be viewed as a continual increase in subscription price.

The one that gets me is renting music with the subscription services. I’d rather own my media thanks.

And don’t even get me going on that BMW episode where they tried to charge monthly for a heated seat. To h*ll with that.

The thing is most all businesses have figured out that creating an ongoing revenue stream, more or less an annuity to their shareholders is what pumps the stock price or their bonuses. We consumers were better off before they realized this.

Chris

 

Very interesting way to look at it.

 

Had this discussion with my father a few years ago. My grandparents received a fridge for a wedding present in 1948. It ran in their house until my grandmother's death in 2011. It seemingly ran just as well as it did when it was new. I offered the same sentiments- what a great fridge and too bad they don't make them like that anymore. My father was pretty quick to remind me that it had been serviced 100s of times and revived more than once. It wasn't any better than whats out there now, it just got fixed instead of tossed. I'm all but sure my grandparents had way too much $$ into it and it cost an exorbitant amount of $$ to run yearly, but growing up in the depression had that affect on people.

 

I read a lot, as does my wife. However, our choices in reading media differs greatly!!

My wife prefers her Kindle. I prefer an actual book. While I have a kindle, I don’t care for it. The vast majority of free reading material is written like a high school book report. And if I’m paying for the “book” I want something to show for it!!!

 

One more random thought on declining quality:

Its been my experience that family business seem to do well until the 3rd generation. Grandpa struggled to start and maintain the business, and spent years of hard work building it. Son inherits the business, while he may not have invested as much “sweat equity” he experienced first hand the sacrifices needed to enjoy the benefits later in life.

Now the grandkids inherit the business. They have reaped the rewards of the business their entire lives, and haven’t experienced the hardship to create it. They generally take it for granted, and as a result quality and customer satisfaction goes to hell.

There was a long time Chrysler dealership here that started in the 1930s. The old man was perfectly content to operate in the original building, a building that was old as dirt when the place first opened. As soon as he died, the kids took over the business and immediately sold the building and built a new modern dealership. It wasn’t long before the place started to get a bad reputation. In the original small, old outdated building, the guy sold fewer cars, but had decades of happy, long term family repeat buyers. Now, new place is big fancy, with comfy chairs and lots of modern entertainment in the customer waiting area, but there are no customers.

 

The old quote in many countries about that generational shift goes something like this:

Shirtsleeves to shirtsleeves in 3 generations.

I’ve seen it in the USA, Europe and Asia in various forms over the years for precisely the reasons you cite Matt69olds.

Chris

 

China can only steal tech to make quality products! Almost everything that they build is crap. China make a big deal of how ahead of the world they are. Its all BS. Even their navy ships, tanks, planes are junk. Aircraft carriers not run by nuclear reactors. Limited time at sea before it next full-up. Two elevators instead of three like US ones. China armed forces are just as corrupt as Russia's. Paper Dragon. Be proud my fellow Americans. Communist China could never have built this ship, without your support! Keep buying, Made in China.

China high-speed trains

 

The US benefited from the second World War. Look up Operation Paperclip sometime; the Apollo program should have had the Iron Cross on the fuselages. Rockets, engines, electric drive, optics, riflery, all that came from wartime Germany. We also got a lot of nice tech from Japan.

I fixed my microwave and fridge this winter. Washer a couple years ago. I'll be interested to know how the Speedqueen does. My mother likes hers, but I don't want a circuit board washer.

 

This US Gov capitalizing on German technology? Certainly nothing new, but that could come as a surprise to some. The truth is all influential countries in the world are guilty of, or are currently duplicating another country’s technology.

SpeedQueen appliances: I have friends that purchased a washer/dryer set and they rave about them. The only thing that I find particularly concerning about them is the amount of water the top-load washer can use…up to 30 gallons per load, according to a web-site I used in my look-up. For someone like me on a septic tank that is a concern. We don’t have jobs where we heavily soil our clothes. Consequently, our front-load washer with water miser features serves us well. I might add both our current washer/dryer appliances came with computer boards and they have been in service going on 21-years and no problems with the boards, then too, we have both on surge protectors, just for good measure.

 

have replaced control boards in my stove, and the dryer at least once. However, it’s obvious I had the dryer apart for some other reason because I had made assembly/reassembly notes on a couple of inner panels. The control board failed again, and the part has been discontinued. 🙄 On the positive, the microwave and refrigerator have been mostly trouble free!!

I know I have shared some of my grandfathers “words of wisdom” or quotes. One that really sticks in my mind was him asking if I could think of anything the Japanese invented. I’m guessing I was 8 or 9 years old, because the only thing I could think of was the Sony Walkman. He pointed a finger at me and said “BINGO! Look what the Japanese have done with Tv, cars, stereos, and other electronics. Give them an idea, they will improve the hell out of it.”

Which brings up another of his thoughts: he commented that the Japanese tried to kick our as with bombs and bullets, and failed. The way things are going, they are going to kick out *** with dollars and cents, without a shot fired.

Once again, this was probably 40 years ago we had this conversation. I really wonder what colorful conversations we would have about the state of things today?!

I was too young and naive to appreciate alot of the thoughts he had, and things he experienced. If I had known then what I know now, I DEFINITELY would have paid much more attention to, and asked many more questions.

Here is a pic of my 1954 Philco refrigerator. I seriously doubt any appliance made today will still be operating 70 years from now.

Needless to say, my wife loves flamingos!

 

The problem with things today is that there are far less people in this world that can repair things at home. Most would rather shell out to have someone come out and repair or just dispose of the item and get a new one. I have recently replaced our 5 year old garbage disposal (nothing to repair inside), replaced the control (electronic rheostat) for a burner on a 5 year old electric stove, replaced the heating coil in the SpeedQueen dryer, and repaired broken switches for lamps, Bunn coffee maker. I tune my own mowers, sharpen my own blades, and do most all home repairs myself. I figure whats the harm in trying? I'd rather *** it up beyond recognition trying to fix it and then replace it if necessary.
Don't even get me started on LED ceiling lights and bulbs. These are suppose to last 50000 hours, I'm lucky to get 5000 hrs out of them. I modified one of my recessed can lights to accept a regular LED light bulb vs the replacement recessed lighting module fixture. If it holds up I'll do the rest as they burn out. While the LED bulbs don't last long either, maybe 2 years and they start to flicker, they are a lot cheaper than the recessed lights and put out the same light.

 

Definitely some truth to this!!!

My daughter’s boyfriend was flabbergasted when she told him I was installing an outlet in our front entry hallway. He had no idea an outlet could be installed just anywhere. Of course, this is a kid that has no clue how to check tire pressure, god forbid he has a flat tire! And if he does have a flat tire, and there is no cell phone service, he better hope my daughter is with him or that tire isn’t getting changed!!!

I have always had the mentality of trying to repair something instead of paying someone else to do it. I figure it’s already broken, I really can’t make it any worse!! The only time I’ll pay for repairs is if the tools/supplies/time needed cost more than just paying the experts.

 

I agree with Matt, one of my daughters had a boyfriend that could reach the highest level of any video game made but probably couldn't put air in a tire !! I also agree with the theory it's already broken what harm can it do, also being retired I have the time to attempt repairs and I like the challenge of can I fix it !!
Things I have repaired recently the circuit board in the Whirlpool drier , easy peasy ( with a little help from You Tube) the bottom heating element in the Whirlpool electric range and just last night my wife's Calphalon spring baking pan broke as she was attempting to bake a cheese cake, she said isn't that special guess I need a new one she reverted to a regular pie pan resumed her baking and while she was on line looking at Walmart for a new spring pan I picked the pan out of the garbage went in to the garage removed the broken rivets from the clasp replaced them with new pop rivets, pan repaired $24.00 saved with 4 cents worth of pop rivets and the bonus was I got out of my recliner where I was falling asleep and did something !!!!

 

There is no finer example of planned obsolescence than the lightbulb.
Very cool ! I first heard of this bulb in the 1990s while listening to news radio. The story never left my mind. Every now and then I would bring in up in conversation over decades only to realize its still going in 2025... amazing.

Most if not all progress is peak quality in its infancy and early iterations. Think flip phone vs smartphone. Drop both enough times and let me know how it works out... Applying further technological advancement to such items is a double edge sword of compromise and perceived betterment through refined options.

Things were built better, it's not old man talk... My parents second home had the same well functioning refrigerator in it for 50 years... It doesn't make its own ice, it doesn't have stainless steel panels. But it still worked and worked well. Modern masses are sucked right in so whatever we say will make no difference. You tell them cars were built better and they tell you yeah but a new one will disintegrate around you and keep you safe. They talk like the first 100 years of automobile's wiped out the human race. Like we couldn't survive sitting in our mothers lap. But as I said before I get it. Market creation is a way of life for us. So be it.

Ai has a flawless take on what contributes to "Market Creation".

• Changing perceptions:
  Convincing customers, partners, and other stakeholders to see the world differently and embrace the new solution.

Here, a whole new direction but a very apropos observation. Windows XP was a perfect operating platform, 25 years later it still operates 75% of the worlds ATM machines... Meanwhile Microsoft has come up with 4 "new and improved" operating systems ever since.... I can come up with example after example of similar consumer products.

Banging on the old Sherman tank like TV sets got them to work again. Don't even think about doing that with a smart TV...

 

I have gotten at least 60K out of every set of tires on my 99 Tahoe. The originals might have not lasted quite as long but since then I have put Michelins on it. Ill have to check my records but its getting ready to turn 300K miles and I am pretty sure the set on there now is the 4th set and they only have about 10K miles on them.