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interesting that the Sport post cars retained the door vent windows both in 69 & 70.
I see some 71 & 72 Sport coupes Cutlass images online so it carried through 72 with vent windows ? can say I have not seen any of those that I remember ...
so the 68 Holiday coupe was the last Holiday with vent windows ? I have seen a few posts here that they prefer the 68 with the vent windows (so they must prefer the Holiday look as well) ?
were those sport post coupes unique to a certain assembly plant (with so few made) as a carry over thing ? or just made everywhere ?
I have seen a 69 Pontiac Tempest with the vent windows as well ... so the other GM Divisions were all in suit ?
Post cars (Sport Coupes, Town Sedans, and wagons) and four door hardtops had vent windows through the 1972 model year. Dashboards on vent window cars without A/C had no vents in them at all - not even the fake vents used on the hardtops. Olds built a lot more cars than just 2dr hardtops and convertibles.
They are actually the most desirable when it comes to original muscle and its primary intent. There the strongest and lightest versions which makes them the quickest and safest...
They are actually the most desirable when it comes to original muscle and its primary intent. There the strongest and lightest versions which makes them the quickest and safest...
Sorry, that's a myth fostered by the auction community who tries to pump up every possible variation as "rare" and thus somehow "valuable". The differences between Sport Coupes and Holiday Coupes in both weight and stiffness is nearly negligible. Post cars were low-rent loss leaders. They are rare because they were unpopular when new. Racers took to them more for the lower purchase cost and the fact that they tended to be stripped bottom-feeder cars, so less stuff to rip out when building a race car. The only structural differences between a Sport Coupe and a Holiday coupe are the B-pillars, which are just spot-welded on. Given that the body is rubber mounted to the frame anyway, the stiffness difference is negligible, and any roll cage you weld in provides an order of magnitude more stiffness anyway. The weight difference was negligible - for a 1970 442, curb weight for a Sport Coupe was 3771 lb; for a Holiday Coupe it was 3817 lb. Weights for both cars are base equipment (455, HD 3spd manual trans, 3.08 axle, bucket seats, no console, no A/C, base tires, steel wheels, etc). That 46 lbs is a little over 1% difference, and most of that was in things like simpler window cranks for the post car since the window frames guided the glass. MSRP on that 442 Sport Coupe was $3312. On the Holiday Coupe it was $3376.
Even F85s could be loaded with options. I'm talking about BASE equipment, which is what is included in the curb and shipping weights. And the examples I posted above are both 442s with exactly the same equipment. One typically isn't going to pay extra for a boatload of power options if you just plan to strip them out for a race car, unless you are trying to hit a specific class weight break. Unlike cars today, in the 60s most cars didn't get loaded up with PW, PS, PTrunk, A/C, or all the other stuff that slowed us down.
I had the build sheets for mine that showed the column shift M40,Vinyl top, tinted glass, lighting package, power disc brakes,and 3:42 anti spin limited slip.
"Miraculously", the 2 door (post) coupe (I think shipping weight) weight divided by "factory (listed) horsepower" was right at the top of the class, based on power to weight range in NHRA. This also affected car Insurance rates. Example: (1970 W-30) 3707 lbs / 370 = 10.0189 pounds per horsepower.
"Miraculously", the 2 door (post) coupe (I think shipping weight) weight divided by "factory (listed) horsepower" was right at the top of the class, based on power to weight range in NHRA. This also affected car Insurance rates. Example: (1970 W-30) 3707 lbs / 370 = 10.0189 pounds per horsepower.
Yup. That's a whole different issue, of course - how much HP did the W-30 REALLY make? As I've said before, why would Olds waste the time and money to cast up unique heads, intake, and use a more radical cam and ignition timing to make 30 HP LESS than the W34 Toronado motor that DID come with power brakes and A/C?
Sorry, that's a myth fostered by the auction community who tries to pump up every possible variation as "rare" and thus somehow "valuable".
Yes and no in my opinion. While I get trying to maximize a sale, you cant deny some like a 1966 W30 post coupe are extremely valuable.
Originally Posted by joe_padavano
The differences between Sport Coupes and Holiday Coupes in both weight and stiffness is nearly negligible. Post cars were low-rent loss leaders. They are rare because they were unpopular when new. Racers took to them more for the lower purchase cost and the fact that they tended to be stripped bottom-feeder cars, so less stuff to rip out when building a race car.
But that's just it Joe, if you wanted a quick 442 you wanted it raw and lighter... I will concede that started really going out the window around 1970 because cars were so powerful they could more easily afford the extra weight from options etc... Much like todays performance cars...
But no matter what, put your 69 H/Os powertrain in a 66 post coupe and it will be quicker than any factory stock Olds ever.
Originally Posted by joe_padavano
As I've said before, why would Olds waste the time and money to cast up unique heads, intake, and use a more radical cam and ignition timing to make 30 HP LESS than the W34 Toronado motor that DID come with power brakes and A/C?
You've been saying this for decades and have been proven correct. Horsepower Hijinks article confirms your suspicions. The W34 was overrated by 32 HP. As well as the stick 1970 W30 making more power than advertised.
