Hi All. I'm STILL building a 1971 455" for my '57 and have a question. Stock crank (10 under, rods and mains) ICON Pistons (9-1) Eagle "ESP" H-Beam rods so far. When I installed 1,3,5,7 rods, pistons, etc., the engine turned over cleanly w/no obstructions. When I installed 2,4,6,8 the even side rods hit the opposite side cylinder wall casting at the very bottom of the bore. I know that every casting can't be the same, but is this normal for this combination? I've since pulled it all apart and ground away some of the casting, reassembled it and all is clear. Again, is this sufficient? Also I need some advice from CutlessEFI(?) re: a cam bring. I'm going to use Edlebrock Alum heads, Howard roller rockers, after Bernard Mondello does his thing to them. Anyone? Many thanks!!!

 

I meant"Cam Grind" ! sorry

 

It's not unlikely that one side needs to be ground more than the other. Plus when you put in the other rods, now the first ones will be on the edge of the journal. Sometimes they drift over during assembly until both are on the journal. Let me know that rest of the build specs/desires and I'll help on the cam. Thanks!!

 

Thanks Cutless. (Name? I'm Bill). This engine is for a '57 olds Super88 cruiser. I like low end torque to get this beast moving but it's not going to be a race car. Having said that, i'd like a little "Lope" also. Using a Hydroboost Brake system so no vacuum issues. Also have an Edlebrock Performer 4 barrel manifold/carb has yet to be decided. Would love to go with an Inglese injection system if they make one for this application. This will be coupled to a 4-80LE Trans. and the stock rear-end (3:4..something to 1). Also what do you think of the stock exhaust manifolds for this build. If headers are better I would opt for Sanderson.

 

Also Mondello recommends Howard roller rockers. By the way, I'd rather stay w/a flat tappet hydraulic set up to try to defray some of the cost. Many Thanks, Bill. wfg4u@aol.com

 

Hey Bill,

I'm Mark.
Unfortunately Inglese doesn't make an 8 stack for your build, no one does.
If you're looking for low end torque and overall performance, check out "70cutty' s build. I did that one for him. The cam specs etc are there as well.
Let me know if I can help from there. Thanks and best of luck in your project!!

 

Thanks Mark! How do I ck out "70cutty's build? Not really familiar w/this website. Many thanks again.

 

Here you go, 70cutty's build: https://classicoldsmobile.com/forums...omp-heads.html

 

Hi Bill,


I met you briefly at the machine shop while you were there pricing out the work to be done on your 455.


I have been involved in the Olds racing and engine building community for many years now and although I don't want to dismiss or discount any advice you may receive here or on other boards, but if you have already solicited and received advice on a cam manufacturer and grind from Bernard Mondello, I can't think of anyone more qualified to provide that advice.


I understand the roller hydraulic route is more expensive than a flat tappet but the advantages are huge in taking the roller approach. The improved durability, better lift vs duration ratio, reduced parasitic drag, and the peace of mind during that critical first 15-20 minutes of break in that a lobe won't go flat and potentially damage other components just seems to outweigh the cost difference in my opinion.


I just finished two 455 builds for local Olds Club owners, one in a 50' Olds street rod, and the other in a 71' 442 and both utilize Howards roller hydraulics recommended by Bernard. Both engines are making plenty of torque and horsepower and both owners are very happy with the street manners as well.


Just my .02 worth.


Grant

 

are these roller lifter setups available for the Toro/442 blocks with 0.921" lifters?

 

The 39* vs 45* bank angle really creates more of a challenge than the lifter diameter due to the limited cam core availability for the 45* engines. There has been .921 roller lifters available at times but installing bronze bushings in the block to get to the more common .842 lifter is one approach. Since there were variations here in the 400 / 425 blocks of both bank angle and lifter diameter you need to be sure which degree angle block you have.

 

Hey Grant,
Yes Bernard is a great guy no question. I've had a few conversations with him and he is most definitely a great source of info for all. And yes all very good points on the benefits of roller vs flat tappet.

But a couple of additional points. The Howard cores are a 4-7 swap and made of 1050 steel, which means you need to run a bronze gear on them. The Lunati cores I offer are standard firing order and are SADI's (Select Austempered Ductile Iron) so they do not require a bronze gear. Plus, depending on the lobe combinations, I can offer the same core in a 45* at a minor up charge.
Also the lifter bores on the .921 blocks cannot take much lobe lift on a roller due to the placement of the oil hole in the lifter bore vs. the oil band position on the lifter itself, and you need an altered lobe base circle as well for it to work correctly with a roller. However I do have upgraded .921 roller and flat tappet lifters for those blocks as well as the DX's. But if you're going to go thru the expense and trouble to bush the .921's down to the .842's it would be best to index them correctly with a BHJ Lifter-tru arbor or similar, maybe a CNC program. All my machine work is done with BHJ Bor Tru, Lifter Tru, and torque plate fixtures. Imo they're worth something in both hp and longevity.

Hope this helps. Thanks.

 

So Cutlass EFI, are you refuting what Bernard and John at Howards has stated regarding their 1050 cores being compatible with standard cast distributor gears? Please say it isn't so! Both the builds I mentioned previously have this combination, one with an HEI distributor and the other with an MSD pro billet unit. The 50' Olds with the pro billet distributor I have back to upgrade to the MSD Atomic fuel injection so I just pulled the distributor this past weekend to lock it out and the gear on it, after a little more than 250 miles, looks perfect with no excessive wear so I have to believe what I see. You may want to research this a bit more before making such a blanket statement. You are correct that the Howards cams are a 4-7 swap on the firing order and there are a thousand different opinions as to whether this improves performance or not but I don't see this as a big deal for a person using this retrofit hydraulic roller which is an on the shelf and readily available camshaft. I don't dispute the lifter and bank angle issues ( that wasn't really the main topic of this thread ) but even as you have noted, there isn't any straight forward way to address these odd combinations without custom grinds and paying special attention to all the other issues you noted.

 

I stand by my statement, the 1050 core requires a bronze gear for extended life. The only roller core material that is truly safe for extended use with a stock distributor gear is a SADI core. It is more similar to a standard iron flat tappet core than any other material currently offered. It's the same material originally used in the first roller engines of the 80's. Those never required different distributor gears either.
And I wouldn't expect to see any wear after only 250 miles anyway, especially on an Olds that squirts oil directly on the gear all the time.

Thanks.