So with rebuilding my engine i decided to do the stock specs on the car. is there somewhere/can someone help me with a list of parts on how to do this? any info would be awesome and as always TIA. Also will be using C Heads due to not having D heads on the car ><

 

Pair o D-heads on evilbay right now.Not cheap though,but I've seen them for more.
I know you don't need to get crazy with the build,but the modern camshaft technology will be a nice improvement.Not sure if your car has AC or not,but whatever you have,you can get a cam ground for it.

 

if its just a basic rebuild u need piston rings, rod bearings. main bearings, freeze plugs, oil pump, and gasket kit.

if u go up a step u need all of the above and new pistons, camshaft and lifters. some places to get ur stuff are summit racings, competition products, and evilbay.

we will all be here to help u put it togather just let us know what questions u have.

 

well i know this but i don't know what the freaking size and all that to get for the car.. which is the best company to stick with etc. i was on 69olds.com and looking there. if ya couldn't tell kinda new to this game of rebuilding. and from the machine shops i been talking to they said they wont do anything to the block til i have pistons for it.

 

u want a stock spec build so the 455 pistons would be 4.125 the crank mains are 3.0 and the rods are 2.0

if ur machine shop is waiting on pistons then it sounds like it needs to be bored.

u need to talk to ur machine shop to see how much they need to bore to get the walls clean. then order your pistons from there.

i dont remember but i think ur old engine u hurt some bearings. so u might need ur crank reground or a new crank. if so u need to find out from the machine shop how much they have to take off to get ur cranks clean. should be .010, .020 , .030 if its more than that u want a new crank.

sounds like ur machine shop isnt being much help.

 

i havent taken it to the machine shop yet. This was before i decided to not bore the engine out to a beastly build. right now the engine is in a million pieces in my garage lol

 

i dont remember what was hurt on ur engine. if ur cylinder walls are in rough shape they probably need to be bored out so u would have to get bigger pistons. and if some ur crank bearing(rod bearings and main bearings) are in rough shape u probably need to get ur crank ground. right now u need to mic/measure everything out and see how good they are. pistons need to be 4.125(stock) rod bearings are 2.0"(stock) and mains are 3.0"(stock). do u have any family or friends that have measuring tools or have built a engine before. its good to have someone close by that can come over and give u pointers. and/or show u how to do things. someone from here might live close to you.

Am i being any help?

 

i will have to talk to a guy in the olds club, i believe he has some measuring tools. And the one cylinder wall had rust on the wall so it needs to be bored i think. and yeah i do need new bearings (both main and rod) so i will be ordering them also. now with buying new piston heads do i have to buy the shaft that connects it to the crankshaft (not too positive on the name) or can i reuse them or do they come with the piston heads... lol sorry if i sound noobtacular here but best place for info IMHO. Thanks for everything so far...
Tom "Sicky"

 

Sometimes a good hone can clean up a rusty cylinder wall with out having to bore it. before u buy beaings u need to know which size u need. thats why u need to measure them. if u measure ur rod journal and u get 1.995 then i would get the crank ground to 1.99, so u would need .010 rod bearings dont go below 1.97 if it is smaller than that i would find a new crank. same with main bearings if u get 2.995 grind it down to 2.99 dont go smaller tha 2.97

the pistons u order will just come with pistons then u need ur machine shop or shop to take the rods off ur old pistons and put on ur new pistons. inspect ur old rods really good.

 

Personally I wouldn't buy anything until after the machine shop looks at it. there's a lot of what if's that can arise, say you buy .030 over pistons, but it needs a .060 overbore or maybe only .010 but you have the new pistons already etc etc . Are you doing the assembly etc yourself? your going to need those measuring tools, if not work out with the machine shop to tell you exactly what to buy.

 

I would check with texas jim see who he has used in the lone star state and maybe even he would lend a hand dont know how far apart you are . You know you are going to drive the hell out of it when it gets back on the road so I would build a strong block with a roller cam can always put new heads or port the one's you have latter bead blast the intake pant it all up . JMT

 

@eddie: you saying to take the block to a machine shop to get it looked at and let them know what i want to do and see what parts i would need to order.

@froefrost: Texas Jim lives in killeen if i remember which is about 4 hours away or something like that. I am taking it to Miller's Machine Shop here in SA(lots of people use them from the olds club and highly suggest them).

 

it would be alot easier if u just let the machine shop do all the measuring and the ordering. see if they can atleast build the short block for you. then u could do the rest.

 

whats the difference between a long and a short block?

 

Shortblock is basically the block with crank and pistons,Longblock includes the heads too (no intake or other accesoires)

 

yeah thats basically what i want done, i have the rest of it in my garage that is fine (maybe the heads cleaned up and inspected). anyone know estimated about how much that will cost?

 

yes it just makes sense, have the block checked, magnafluxed etc perhaps your not using that block? once the block is checked, then you know where you are going, the machinist will tell you what size the bores are and where they need to be, maybe the block was already bored? so you want to be sure. I spoke to my engine guy, got a ball park figure, then went from there, if your not trusting your machinist then how can you trust his work, the idea for referrals is an excellent idea, somebody who used so and so.

it took me awhile to find a guy I was comfortable with, and I am MORE then happy with my results, I went with a pretty stock rebuild, also using c heads but my machinist is just passionate about the builds. I bought parts and I let him order parts, I also upgraded things where I felt they made sense.

 

I would first find the machinist. Then talk to him, tell him what you want, and listen to what he says, the difference in price for me between the shortblock, and having the motor completely assembled and being broke in before i brought it home didn't make enough difference for me to assemble the heads, etc, get it running, adjust everything. so you need to talk to him. what is he going to charge you to throw the heads, manifold and water pump on? If this is all in your comfort zone great, but it was nice going to the machine shop, and seeing the motor running before I brought it home, I didn't add the money for the dyno, but that is all a numbers game anyway, I have 3.08 gears how much power do you need?

also there is the cam to be considered, this effects the springs, the rocker arm ratio's the lifter selection etc, this also determines the carb jetting etc.

I guess you could take rough measurements, and order a complete deluxe rebuild kit in .030 over or .060 over whatever, but I don't know if i would do that on a Hurst Olds??

 

well it hada cheap cam in it first off and i broke the end of it off when taking the timing chain off. And if you havent seen other threads about my car/engine; Its not a numbers matching so i personally dont see a problem with boring it out .03 or .06 over on the engine.

 

They won't touch it until you have pistons? That would be enough to run the other way. You won't know what size pistons you might need until you get into it & check things out.

 

i think it was cause i told them i wanted to bore the engine out.

 

What I did firstly when I wanted to know what direction to take my 455 Olds, I bought the book: Wild About Cars-Engine Mod and Tuning Guide. This book IMO breaks it all down and sends you in the right direction f/ what you want to do, whatever it may be. It actually lists the mods needed to put your engine build in the category you desire. Build sheets included. I've built many Chevy engines, but never an Olds to that point in time, and the Olds is a very different situation and a very interesting one. I also sent to Dick Miller and bought his parts catalog which also has alot of specifics to do w/ performance. Between the book, the catalog and this site, I became very knowledgable to do w/ the 455 Olds, and it's one of the coolest engines I've ever been into.
San Antonio and Killeen are quite a distance apart, about 150 miles.
When I wanted to understand and install hydraulic suspension, I bought the book: The Science Of Hydraulic Suspension. It gives you all the basics and then some, and puts you in a position to ask intelligent questions to those who know their stuff on the site "LayItLow.com."
My advice would be to get the Book I mentioned and go from there. You'll save time and money and learn so much f/ very little, a great investment and fantastic starting point. But, pay close attention to this site. The site is a great place and even greater after you know the book well and know what to ask and look f/. Good Luck!

***The book would have answered all the questions you've asked thus far under this topic.***

 

I have that book too, mondello has a step by step free down load from their web site on your first rebuild also a good write up if it is not there anymore I can make a copy of mine for you .

 

My point was that you won't know what size pistons you need until you bore the block.I'm sure your block is fine,and a +.030 would do it,but it is better to have that done first.I did a 71 block before,that sat complete,in a Delta,with the hood on,away from the elements,but when it came down to it,there was enough rust haze in the clyinders that it needed to go +.075 to get them nice.

 

Sicky it wasn't the boring out I was referring to, it was getting a rebuild assembly from some place not sure if they still do it but PAW where they sell you the whole rotating assembly, there is nothing wrong with boring a motor .030 maybe even .060 but again you need to make sure the block is in excellent condition etc I was thinking with an HO that you would want a higher quality build, I mean you can get a 455 rebuilt from a lot of places that will probably be cheaper then rebuilding your own, depends what you want here is one for 2900 bucks, this is 2 grand less then I paid
http://www.rebuiltcrateengines.com/o...30-p-2153.html

here is the kind of kit I was talking about

 

If it is the number-matching block,then I would bore it the least amount needed,to help preserve the block.If the bores are absolutely mint,then just do a hone,and use std bore pistons.There are a few companies that also offer +.020 pistons as well.
Yes PAW was a wholesaler that sold engine kits.I'm not sure if they still do,but they would be a little on the generic side,as well as some of the kits offered by Summit & Jeg's. I prefer to hand-pick my pieces,to get the good stuff.Something I learned a long time ago.Everything I need,& nothing I don't.

 

If u dont have money to burn u probably dont need everything that is in that kit. like the crank and rods. those pistons u can get 475$ dished pistons u can get for 330$ . bearings, gasket kit, rings (which might come with the pistons) oil pump, and freeze plugs u can get for less then 400$
so for 730$-875$ will get u the parts u need to get. that much plus the price of machining and ur done.

if u want to bore ur engine out and u told ur machinst that then yeah alot of machinist want the pistons at the same time they are doing the bore job. then they will machine it and match the new pistons to each holes at the same time. incase the pistons are differant or something. the last engine i had done. thats what my machinist explained to me. but i already had the .040 pistons.

 

yeah, true that. i picked-up a '71 455 block from a machine shop they bored it .020" over, then fit forged pistons to it,honed it. the machine shop guy said 20 over was the most he'd go on a 455 someone was thinkin' about putin' in a cutlass.

 

i talked to a guy that alot of people use from the olds club (miller machining) and they will do it for around 1500 for the short block. (machining and everything). That is for a stock 455 rebuild so i would have to see what needs to be different about the H/O motor from a stock one (besides the cam obvi). And no 507Olds it is not a numbers matching car. Story behind that one was apparantly the car had an accident and that is why it had a frame off restore. And most likely someone took the engine out and sold the parts or used it on his Olds (knowing what was in there)

 

I thought you siezed the motor. I'd have everything on the short block checked by a good shop before reusing anything.

 

from my understanding they replace everything with that. so we shall see when i actually take the motor block into them...

 

For $1500.00,you better get a detailed list of everything they are doing to the shortblock,and the parts going in it.That's too cheap for a shortblock.
I am currently doing a shortblock for a customer's 70 W30 4-spd,and it is more like $2500.00 for an assembled shortblock.No cam,No heads,No timing chain,No oiling system. It is a balanced rotating assembly,consisting of an N-crank,turned .10/.10,polished,champhered oil holes;reconditioned stock 455 rods with ARP bolts;Speed-Pro .040" forged pistons with small dish & matching rings. The 70 455 block was cleaned,checked,bored/honed +.040,line-honed mains with ARP bolts,the deck squared,and the rotating assembly installed.
The $2500.00 price includes ALL machine work,and the parts,like pistons,rings,bearings,and fasteners.
To finish the entire engine,with rebuilding the heads,new cam/lifters & valvetrain,oiling system,etc.,it will be an additional $1500.00-$2,000.00,depending one what cam & valvetrain gets picked.

With that being said,if you set a budget of $5,000.00 to rebuild your entire engine,you won't go into to shock when it's done.Everything will add-up one way or another,unless you or the machinist decides to cut corners.Then you might also find yourself doing it again,which would then result in paying twice for half of what you get.You can have $10,000.00 into a $5,000.00 engine.
I have not had the heads rebuilt yet,but I am suspecting a $1,000.00 price,by the time they are done.That would include cleaning/checking,new bronzewall guides,hardened seats(if needed),3-angle valve job,new valves/springs/retainers/locks,and seals. If the valves are REAL nice,I mean perfect,then I'll let the car owner & machinist decide whether or not they want to reuse them.
Other parts include:
cam - Lunati # LUN-60802LK,with matching lifters = $200.00
timing chain - Comp roller #2113 = $50.00
pushrods - Comp #yet to be determined = $50.00-$100.00
rockers - Harland Sharp shaft-mount # SV-5002 = $400.00
oil pump - Melling HV22 with bolt-on pickup & hardened shaft = $100.00
gaskets - Fel-Pro # QFS8171PT4 = $100.00
Head bolts will be reused,as it is a stock restoration,but I would get ARP's if you are able to.
The intake,Q-jet,and distributor will all be rebuilt/refurbished,and reused.
The water pump will be the correct one,rebuilt,or you would possibly need to buy one.
Oil pan - reuse the stock one,unless it's trashed,then about $75.00 for a nice thick repop.
Hopefully,this sheds a little more light on the subject.This engine & car is a strict restoration/show car.It will NEVER see the track,and it will rarely ever see the high-rpms from daily driving.

 

so would it be better to get a crate engine or rebuild the motor i got now?

http://www.rebuiltcrateengines.com/o...30-p-2153.html
-------OR-------
Rebuild engine i have.

 

My Harlan sharps also required bigger studs, that was additional work, and parts... I think your spot on, mine came out to 5400..... or so with all the additions..

 

There is a set of D heads for $1200 on Greenville SC Craigslist hope this info may help on your build .

 

The phone number is 864-612-4411 Skip,I'm Still looking for a KA pulley for my friend let me know

 

Sold 500 bucks

 

Nice buy....I hope sold to you...........Lee

 

Sad to say no .

 

bummer, and no luck with the 442.com guy either........Lee