viper771

Hey everyone! I am about to tackle the stuck heat riser valve within the next week or so. While I was under the hood I thought that I should take a look at the plugs. I haven't done much with my 62 Starfire since I got it, but I hope to do more as budget permits. That being said.. what kind of spark plugs do you guys use? My car has iridium plugs in it now. I wasn't sure if AC delco plugs would be better and what plug #. I can't remember what iridium plug number is in there now, but the last owner put them in there. Keep in mind that I haven't had the car out on the road yet (trying to fix a few issues still). Also, I was thinking about getting rid of the points and do one of those electronic conversions. It seems that it would be one less thing to worry about and the car would still look stock.

Should I still keep the gap at .030? I need to get a timing light and other tools so I can do the necessary work on the car. I think the timing is set up 5 deg before TDC, at least that is what is marked on the balancer. Just trying to ask some questions and get more info. Thinking about trying to redo the front end myself eventually as well. I really HOPE that getting rid of the heat riser valve will stop my overheating problems. We shall see.... I would appreciate any spark plug info you can pass along.

59-59-59

I've been running Champion RJ12YC for years on a semi daily driven 394. I don't care what old timers say with Champion plug bashing - these have never given me problems, have been on my driver for years, and is actually on a running 394. They are just set at 0.30. If your getting rid of points, I would stay far away from Pertronix, as I have burned out 2 sets- on the same 394 ( still can't figure that one out) I replaced it with an ACCELL conversion and have zero problems with it, and was an easy install. Overheating? Run the car till its at operating temp with the cap off. Look in the radiator and check for bubbles. I had a microscopic crack in the cylinder head that would only show bubbles after the fourth heat/ cooling cycle.

viper771

I will have to check out the ACCELL conversion. I don't know a whole lot about points, engine timing, etc. I am new to all of that really. But I am willing to learn just about anything.

I did run the car without the cap on (to see if the thermostat would open up) and I didn't see any bubbles. I also had good water flow. I still say the heat riser is stuck shut. When I checked it out, the spring wasn't attached, and I can't move the thing at all. Here is a picture of it. If it is stuck open, it isn't stuck open very far. I wanted to take it out anyway. I can take another look for the bubbles too since it wouldn't hurt. Thanks for the spark plug info too!!

Keep in mind that my starfire also has single exhaust at the moment. The radiator was redone not long ago and looks good on the inside and outside. It doesn't take long for it to get really REALLY hot, even with the hood up. This is why I think the heat riser valve is actually stuck. The guy I bought it from didn't drive it at all either.

Don R.

Stay with stock but if you are unsure of the age / condition of the parts you have it is cheap and easy to replace all - plugs, points, coil, condenser, cables, rotor and distributor cap. Forget about electronic conversion unless this will be your daily driver. Use AC plugs, AC44 was the original spec, get a modern equivalent. Any parts store should be able to supply all parts, buy their top quality brand. Points are easy to adust with a dwell meter and an allen wrench, just remember "30-30" - .030" plug gap and 30 degrees of dwell. Timing of 5 degrees BTDC is correct but you may get some ping if the compression is still good. When you have the rotor off be sure to clean up and lubricate the advance weights and make sure the springs are there. Also check to make sure your vacuum advance can does not leak andis working. Good luck!

viper771

Thanks for the info!!! I haven't gotten under the dist cap yet. I don't know much about engine timing and what not, but I am reading up as much as I can. I would like to use AC plugs... since they don't make 44s anymore, I can either go 43 or 45... or 43S or 45S. I am not going to be driving it on the highway or anything for a long while yet. I don't know if I need the S type plugs, but some people say they don't get fouled up as easily.
So the orig plugs were non resistor type? Some ppl say NGK are good since they are plated and don't rust. I would like to get something since I pulled a couple plugs yesterday and they are NGK XR51X plugs... I don't think they are anywhere close to being the right plugs according to the charts I looked up. Maybe that is why I have some overheating issues?

oldsmobum

wait until you get the engine running decent before you start to mess with performance upgrade type stuff... Reason being it can help rule out variables once you finally do install something in case it doesn't work right. Keep in mind there are also guys that can do an HEI conversion to your small body distributor... Just another alternative to the ACCEL and Pertronix kits. Nothing wrong with a good set of points though, its what is currently in my 324, even though I have an HEI conversion for it on my shelf.

viper771

The only thing I would change would be getting rid of the points... but that is just bec I don't know how to mess with them. If I learn how to do that stuff, get a timing light and dwell meter, then I would prob keep em in.

I have an HEI in my 442 and I haven't messed with that car at all for about 5 years. That is going to be a whole other issue lol

redoldsman

I am big on the HEI conversion. It gets a good bit of debate on here. I think 59-59-59 is the first case of problems with Pertronix I have heard of. One thing that is often overlooked is that if any of the cam lobes are worn, it doesn't matter to the Pertronix. It may not be so much of a performance upgrade but it will sure start quicker. I would use the stock recommended AC plugs and gap them at about 40 thousanths. These are just my opinions. I am sure we will have some more opinions that agree and several that disagree. Points are good and there are several brands of spark plugs that will also work well. This is how I would do it.

viper771

I picked up some R43S plugs today... Fusicks said they recommend those for the 394. I know they are cooler than the stock 44s, but I am not driving the car anywhere for awhile anyway. If they begin to foul pretty bad (the ones that were in there are very sooty) I will switch to a R45S. There is a HUGE different between the delcos I just picked up today and the NKGs I am taking out. According to the advance auto website, the plugs I am taking out are ones that go with my car... but I think they are wrong. All the plugs they listed seemed to be way off for some reason, but that is just accorind to the research I have done in my own.

I don't plan on putting an HEI on the Starfire.. I will keep it on the 68 442 though. I was just curious about getting rid of the points since it looked easy for me to do (since I have really no experience in this stuff) and it would be one less thing to worry about.

I think I had my heater core stolen off my front porch today Trying to track down my box via FedEx. Other than that, I plan to redo all my vac lines, put in new plugs, remove the heat riser to see if I need to take the valve out, and do other various stuff to the starfire. I found an orig booster so I can take out that weird aftermarket one that is in my car now. I think that is the main problem of my brake problem. I will just need the booster rebuilt and I should be good to go!!

Thanks for all the info guys. So gap at .040 instead of .030?

viper771

I put the new R43s plugs in and just put the gap at .030 for now to see what happens. She sounds a lot better. But, the car still oveheats. After I redo all my vac lines for the heat controls, I am taking out the heat riser to convert it to just a spacer. When the car overheats, the hot light comes on in about 5 mins -7 mins of the car in idle with the hood up. The upper rad hose gets hot, ran the engine without rad cap on and saw that I had good flow when thermostat opened up. The radiator was recored recently, inside passages look very clean, no leaks at all.

I plan on flushing the system, putting in a new heater core while I am at it, putting a new water pump in while I am at it, and checking the heat riser. I still suspect the heat riser since the car gets so hot so fast. Keep in mind, it still has single exhaust so if the heat riser is not even open all the way, that is a lot of restricted flow.

Hopefully it is nothing serious!!!!!

fbonanno

You mention removing your heat riser valve and going to a spacer. Do you have a source for the spacer? I am in process of replacing the cross over exhaust pipe on my 1963 D-88. The pipe is made for use with the heat riser valve, which I don't have anymore on my car. Would you know the thickness of your heat riser valve? I may need to make my own spacer. Thanks Frank.

redoldsman

I hope a blown head gasket is not the overheating problem.

viper771

I haven't messed with my car yet since last summer I have not found a source for a spacer yet. I may just take the valve out of the heat riser itself and have someone weld up the holes for me. If we all had Chevys, then things would be so much easier to acquire.

As far as blown gaskets... that has crossed my mind. I was going to check with the intake gasket first. Something isn't right though. She still over heats and you can tell after awhile since the exhaust smell changes. How do you tell if you have a blown head gasket? With the intake I was going to spray around the intake with carb cleaner to see if the idle changes at all. Since the weather is getting warmer, I will have the opportunity to try some fixes. It would be nice to get it to drive around the block this summer.

fbonanno

OK on the heat riser spacer. Understood. If your exhaust has a sweet smell to it, you probably need new head gaskets. White smoke that doesn't go away upon warm up is a hint too. Does the level of water/anti freeze go down? I replaced my head gaskets last year because I spotted the white smoke one day upon warm up. I never did over heat. It's not a fun job. Just be careful lifting the heads off if you go there. They are heavy. Back problems and all. You might want to install a water temp gauge to check actual temp by the stat. It wont tell you temps elsewhere, but good to have any ways instead of just the dash light.

TripDeuces

If you're dead set on not using the heat riser you can just knock the guts out of it and tap the cross shaft hole for a set screw or bolt to seal it. No spacer needed. Just be sure that's what you want because going back is harder once that is done.

viper771

I think Fusick still sells the heat risers for the 394 in their earlier cat. I guess you can always just take the flapper out and leave all the guts alone so you don't have to worry about trying sealing up the shaft hole. My heat riser doesn't move anyway... and it looks pretty much stuck shut or close to shut. In my case, not having it will just be better anyway.

fbonanno

No problem on the spacer. I've just never seen one up close to know how thick it was to compensate for the new pipe. My car didn't have one. The existing cross over pipe has seen better days, so I'll be replacing it with a new one that was designed/geometry for the heat valve. I can fab a spacer myself, it just takes longer measuring and getting the entrance-exit radius correct.

viper771

I need to get rid of my cross over pipe eventually and go back to the orig dual exhaust. I have other problems to solve first though