Hey every one!

I have 2 weeks off be for i start a new job and i decided to take my engine apart. you might remember i had a thread https://classicoldsmobile.com/forums...ad-gasket.html
where my car would over heat right when the t stat would open (temp ups slowly then at 180 shoots up to 230 then back down) i never found out why but i just ran my car with out a tstat and stopped worrying about it.

well since i started taking apart i just kept going




now i just have some questions. should i just go ahead and pull the heads?
how hard is it to get the headers off wile its still in the car?
Turkey tray gasket for intake or something else?
if i did pull the heads how much for hardened valve seats? or any thing else i should do to them?

it would be cool if i could find out would made it get so hot. and even if i dont get any machine work done i still can lap the valves and clean it all up some.

THanks for your in put

 

ok well whats the best way to get the headers off wile its still in the car. any tips?

 

If you still have the bolt lock tabs, you would need to flatten the edges so you can get a wrench or socket on them. Then just remove the bolts.

As far as the heads are concerned, if you are going to take them off, you might as well send them out for a freshening up!

If there is a four piece manifold gasket set, I would run with that. your block already has a galley shield.

 

The should I question is best answered when preceded by an indication of your budget lol! You should if you have the funds to cope with any possible gremlin you find when you remove the heads. If you were having overheating problems changing the head gaskets might be a good idea, but be prepared to have some work done to the heads while their off.

The only way to know what head work is going to cost in your area is to call a few machine shops and get prices. Most of that depends on the area you live in and the quality of the shop. Good luck with it!

The headers come off with the engine in the car, but you don't have to remove them from the car unless you are pulling the engine. Just loosen them from the heads and let them rest on the frame while you pull the heads off.

 

Also, you should run a 4 piece intake gasket set as oldcutlass suggested but do not use the end seals. Instead use a bead of silicone (Ultra Copper / Ultra Black) between the block and the intake. Be sure to get enough in there to make a good seal, you can test fit the manifold to make sure you use enough silicone. Also be sure to get enough in the corners where the head/block/intake meet...that is usually where they like to leak.

 

And, using the ultra black, only set it down until it squishes out a little and let it sit for at least an hour before tightening down the intake. Ben there.

 

X2...on the dyno we had a seep at the corners of the intake/head/block where I suggested for you to make sure you get enough in there...behind any advice there's an idiot that did it the wrong way, you're better off heeding it and saving yourself some agony lol!

 

you need to run the sheetmetal gasket if you are using the stock intake! the cam cover that is shown will not keep the oil off the bottom of the intake and it'll burn oil & fill the valley with carbon... the only thing that cover does is prevent the camshaft from throwing oil up into the valley... use the steel gasket!

 

No he does not, if you look at the pictures he has a sheild in the lifter galley.

 

ok ill probly start working on the heads tomarow.

im cleaning the intake with Electrolysis so that's exciting.

after its all clean should i paint it.

I don't think im going to get a valve job or any real machine work.

Ill lap the valves and make sure every thing is ok.

and then in a years time after i save a bit more maybe ill go get a new set of heads and a new intake.

hear is the intake before cleaning
i removed the rest of the brass and the carb heat pipe thing.



its running now. ill check it tomarow and post some more pics.
oh and for the paint i know it needs to be high temp but any thing special

 

that cam cover will do nothing about the oil coming off the lifters... if that was adequate the factory would not have bothered with the steel shim gasket over top of it....

 

Yeah, he should get a valley cover from Dick Miller or Rocket Racing that covers the lifters as well. Even if he doesn't get a valley cover, he can use his old turkey tray to cover the valley and still use a 4 piece gasket set. The steel tray gaskets were great for brand new cast heads and manifold but on 40 year old stuff they suck...or blow, however you wanna look at it.

 

I'm not going to argue but the biggest cause of crap in the lifter galley area, is not changing your oil, blocked oil returns, overtemps, and gasket failure. The 4 piece gasket has been used for over 40 years and they perform well and are easier to install than that god aweful turkey tray.

 

My only question before pulling the heads would be, "Have they ever been off before?"

If not, then you've got the original 0.017" steel shim gaskets, and will lose about ½ a point of compression if you reassemble with a standard 0.047" new head gasket (ipsie pipsie [sp?] hot rod head gaskets can be gotten thinner, but at considerable expense), so if your compression tests good, and the gasket is original, you might want to leave well enough alone.
Of course, you could also take them off and find the water passages blocked with rusty gunk...

- Eric

 

how the heck do you get the bolt tabs off the headers? and what type of paint for the intake?

i stoped using the battery charger as it would think that this was a battery and drop the amps down to 2 so i got a 12volt 12.5 amp power supply and its working way better!

 

With great patience and knuckles of iron.

You may need to use a mirror to see exactly where they are, then use a very small screwdriver to get between the bolt head and the tab, and bend each one back until you can get a socket on the bolt.

There has been great discussion on this topic if you search.

The contestants are usually

• Bill Hirsch (a bit light in color, but comes in a normal-sized can)
• Fusick (probably better original match, but comes in partly-empty cans)
• Eastwood (also well regarded)
• POR (I believe they have brush-on only)

- Eric

 

intake gasket came in today but there's no port for the Exhaust that runs under the carb should i just cut it or leave it and not worry i live in fl?

 

after 16 hours with the new power supply

 

What gaskets did you get?

 

http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/web...___#fragment-1

but it looks like they all are missing it excepted the stock one

 

My advice...take the Mr. Gasket back and get this gasket.

When it comes to gaskets, do it right one time...don't do twice the work because you wanted to save a buck.

 

This is the one you need, if you are going to buy one there! Is this what you removed originally?

http://shop.advanceautoparts.com/web...R%7CGRPGASKAMS_____

 

I'm confused...

The turkey tray gasket he had was leaking...I would use a better quality 4 piece gasket and toss the end seals. JMO

 

I agree, the one you suggested does not have the exhaust crossovers for his stock manifold and carb. So he would have to fill the holes or cut the gaskets. That is complicated!

I believe what he is doing is going to be a temporary fix until he gathers the funds to build his motor correctly. So I would just go back stock for now. In the future when he decides to rebuild and upgrade, then he can go with the more modern stuff.

 

pulled one head looks like some crud in the water passages.





there's one bolt holding the outer head to the exhaust. so i removed the cross pipe and unbolted the header too exhaust. but its been a real pan in the *** to get the whole thing out.

 

That's a really clean-looking engine inside.

Good combustion, too.

I wouldn't get too wound up about the water passages, as long as there's no really thick stuff in there.
Take out the drain plugs and give it all a really good flush, and poke around with a screwdriver to see if you need to loosen anything up.

- Eric

 

Im trying to clean out the ports a little, and maybe gaskit match. Will put all the valve s in saturday

 

heads are painted and valves are laped the runners are ported a little just made them really clean





IS that too much or does it look ok?
Thanks

 

hey i drained out the block and tried to flush it out as much as i could ended up buying one of so now the oil wont splash up form the cam or lifters so i can use the intake gasket i had. i cut a hole out for the cross over.

hear are some pics from it back on with the rockers

i dont know why the valve cover looks like theres green on it in this pic

 

well its all back together well the main exhaust is still off




one thing that got a little confusing was the firing order in the hans book was like this

and it would not start had to run it like this

any idea what the first ones for

also this broke any idea how to fix or if its needed

going to test it all out tomorrow

 

http://youtu.be/PfpKlViLAj0
felt awesome

 

The broken strap is your engine ground strap.

It is absolutely essential for the proper operation of your car.

If you can't get it replaced, you need to run a heavy wire from a body ground to either your engine block or the negative terminal of your battery.

- Eric

 

so fixed the ground strap and put the exhaust. then took it for a spin.

oil psi shot up to 80 with a little bit of gas normality 60 at WOT also hear a little strange noise

a look under the valve cover shows that most of the rockers are not covered in oil. so i turn the car over and take a look with the valve covers off and it looks like maybe half of the rockers are not getting oil from the push rods. and the ones that are look like a little stream is coming out of the holes. i didint remove any of the lifter.

what the heck is going on will in need to take the intake back off.

also the only thing that changed is the cam / push rod gard. the bolts that hold it in place where a little bit longer the the stock ones could that be blocking the oil.

 

Unlike certain cars with orange engines, Olds do not squire oil all over the place from the rockers - it just sort of oozes out, and it can take a while to get up there after the engine has been apart.

How long did you run it before you looked?

- Eric

 

yeah id say about half of them where oozing. i ran it for maybe 5 mins. what really just got me was the oil psi.

 

I can't say much about the noise without hearing it, but it takes longer than that to get oil up through the pushrods.

I have no idea why your oil pressure would suddenly be much higher than before, but 5 minutes is not enough time to get the oil warmed up and circulating.

- Eric

 

ill run it today for 10 mins or so idle with the valve covers off and see whats going on ill up date

 

turned out to be the alt making the noise. and the push rods started squirting more oil. also looks like the temp problem is fixed. i did lose the breather D gasket so looking to get one.

Thanks EVERY ONE!!!!!!!!!!!

 

well i did all that work and it still has the same issue thought that maybe theres air traped in the coolint so i tryed to bleed it even put it up an incline and took out the temp sencer and the wated for air to come out did the whole funnel thing this is an old clip but its still doing the exact same thing http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwOSF5O0YEM&feature=plcp im going to replace the water pump and then if that dose not fix it im going to idk just be realy pissed.

do you guys have any ideas.

 

this vid is a little shorter and more to the point
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yXFJenkVHdk&feature=plcp

coolant bouncing up and down. when i rev it up to try and do the bleeding once i drop the rpm all the coolant will shoot out like old faithful.

but i rember taking the water pump off and it looking and acting fine no slipping